* Re: exporting zotxt or orgref links to HTML and ODF [not found] <CAMfbzvA83eSWe79Ot=yX+_s_g33gpLnP-z+zQ52QFJm+iJTR+Q@mail.gmail.com> @ 2015-01-28 21:53 ` Matt Price 2015-01-28 23:01 ` John Kitchin 0 siblings, 1 reply; 34+ messages in thread From: Matt Price @ 2015-01-28 21:53 UTC (permalink / raw) To: Vicente Vera, Org Mode [-- Attachment #1: Type: text/plain, Size: 1355 bytes --] i think I may have seen it these on the list at one point, but it's very helpful to be reminded. I do think that the default fonts, etc., are a bit of an acquired taste for humanists; and I've gotten used to using custom styles in html & odt for size & placing of images; but even without following the instructions carefully, export seems to work, which is pretyt amazing! Vikas recommends involving pandoc manually, as Erik H. has also suggested to me; I would like to aovid doing that if possible, but if it has to be done i guess I can find some way of automating it. There are clearly a lot of options in this space; I am still interested in using Zotero if I can, so will continue working with zotxt, but hopefully in a way that gets me closer to other people's usage patterns. thanks, Matt On Wed, Jan 28, 2015 at 3:31 PM, Vicente Vera <vicentemvp@gmail.com> wrote: > Hello. Interesting thread! > Matt, have you read Vikas guide to writing papers with Org? > https://github.com/vikasrawal/orgpaper > From my point of view, using LaTeX through Org isn't difficult at all. > You'll need to tweak a few things (packages, figures, etc.), but it's > definitely easier for a beginner that starting a LaTeX document from > scratch. > Here's another article about writing LaTeX (social science) papers: > https://github.com/kjhealy/workflow-paper > [-- Attachment #2: Type: text/html, Size: 1925 bytes --] ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 34+ messages in thread
* Re: exporting zotxt or orgref links to HTML and ODF 2015-01-28 21:53 ` exporting zotxt or orgref links to HTML and ODF Matt Price @ 2015-01-28 23:01 ` John Kitchin 2015-01-29 1:34 ` Matt Price 2015-01-29 2:26 ` Vikas Rawal 0 siblings, 2 replies; 34+ messages in thread From: John Kitchin @ 2015-01-28 23:01 UTC (permalink / raw) To: Matt Price; +Cc: Org Mode, Vicente Vera With the latest version of org-ref, I can automate export from org through markdown to docx via pandoc like this: #+BEGIN_SRC emacs-lisp (defun ox-export-to-docx-and-open () "Export the current org file as a docx via markdown." (interactive) (let* ((bibfile (expand-file-name (car (org-ref-find-bibliography)))) ;; this is probably a full path (current-file (buffer-file-name)) (basename (file-name-sans-extension current-file)) (md-file (concat basename ".md")) (docx-file (concat basename ".docx"))) (when (file-exists-p docx-file) (delete-file docx-file)) (org-export-to-file 'md md-file) (shell-command (format "pandoc -s -S --bibliography=%s %s -o %s" bibfile md-file docx-file)) (org-open-file docx-file '(16)))) #+END_SRC this works because i defined a markdown format function that converts the cite link to pandoc format on export. I could avoid the markdown translation if I could do an org to org export that would do that. With a little work we could define file tags like: #+PANDOC_CSL: some-csl-file that would also get passed to the pandoc command to determine the style of the citation and bibliography. Matt Price writes: > i think I may have seen it these on the list at one point, but it's very > helpful to be reminded. > > I do think that the default fonts, etc., are a bit of an acquired taste for > humanists; and I've gotten used to using custom styles in html & odt for > size & placing of images; but even without following the instructions > carefully, export seems to work, which is pretyt amazing! > > Vikas recommends involving pandoc manually, as Erik H. has also suggested > to me; I would like to aovid doing that if possible, but if it has to be > done i guess I can find some way of automating it. > > There are clearly a lot of options in this space; I am still interested in > using Zotero if I can, so will continue working with zotxt, but hopefully > in a way that gets me closer to other people's usage patterns. > > thanks, > Matt > > > On Wed, Jan 28, 2015 at 3:31 PM, Vicente Vera <vicentemvp@gmail.com> wrote: > >> Hello. Interesting thread! >> Matt, have you read Vikas guide to writing papers with Org? >> https://github.com/vikasrawal/orgpaper >> From my point of view, using LaTeX through Org isn't difficult at all. >> You'll need to tweak a few things (packages, figures, etc.), but it's >> definitely easier for a beginner that starting a LaTeX document from >> scratch. >> Here's another article about writing LaTeX (social science) papers: >> https://github.com/kjhealy/workflow-paper >> -- Professor John Kitchin Doherty Hall A207F Department of Chemical Engineering Carnegie Mellon University Pittsburgh, PA 15213 412-268-7803 @johnkitchin http://kitchingroup.cheme.cmu.edu ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 34+ messages in thread
* Re: exporting zotxt or orgref links to HTML and ODF 2015-01-28 23:01 ` John Kitchin @ 2015-01-29 1:34 ` Matt Price 2015-01-29 1:48 ` John Kitchin 2015-01-29 13:09 ` John Kitchin 2015-01-29 2:26 ` Vikas Rawal 1 sibling, 2 replies; 34+ messages in thread From: Matt Price @ 2015-01-29 1:34 UTC (permalink / raw) To: John Kitchin, Org Mode [-- Attachment #1: Type: text/plain, Size: 3261 bytes --] John, this does look very powerful. Do you see a path forward that would help add zotero support to org-ref, probably using Erik's zotxt library? Does that seem like a worthwhile goal for you? Matt On Wed, Jan 28, 2015 at 6:01 PM, John Kitchin <johnrkitchin@gmail.com> wrote: > With the latest version of org-ref, I can automate export from org > through markdown to docx via pandoc like this: > > #+BEGIN_SRC emacs-lisp > (defun ox-export-to-docx-and-open () > "Export the current org file as a docx via markdown." > (interactive) > (let* ((bibfile (expand-file-name (car (org-ref-find-bibliography)))) > ;; this is probably a full path > (current-file (buffer-file-name)) > (basename (file-name-sans-extension current-file)) > (md-file (concat basename ".md")) > (docx-file (concat basename ".docx"))) > > (when (file-exists-p docx-file) (delete-file docx-file)) > (org-export-to-file 'md md-file) > (shell-command (format > "pandoc -s -S --bibliography=%s %s -o %s" > bibfile md-file docx-file)) > (org-open-file docx-file '(16)))) > #+END_SRC > > > this works because i defined a markdown format function that converts > the cite link to pandoc format on export. I could avoid the markdown > translation if I could do an org to org export that would do that. With > a little work we could define file tags like: > > #+PANDOC_CSL: some-csl-file > > that would also get passed to the pandoc command to determine the style > of the citation and bibliography. > > > > > Matt Price writes: > > > i think I may have seen it these on the list at one point, but it's very > > helpful to be reminded. > > > > I do think that the default fonts, etc., are a bit of an acquired taste > for > > humanists; and I've gotten used to using custom styles in html & odt for > > size & placing of images; but even without following the instructions > > carefully, export seems to work, which is pretyt amazing! > > > > Vikas recommends involving pandoc manually, as Erik H. has also suggested > > to me; I would like to aovid doing that if possible, but if it has to be > > done i guess I can find some way of automating it. > > > > There are clearly a lot of options in this space; I am still interested > in > > using Zotero if I can, so will continue working with zotxt, but hopefully > > in a way that gets me closer to other people's usage patterns. > > > > thanks, > > Matt > > > > > > On Wed, Jan 28, 2015 at 3:31 PM, Vicente Vera <vicentemvp@gmail.com> > wrote: > > > >> Hello. Interesting thread! > >> Matt, have you read Vikas guide to writing papers with Org? > >> https://github.com/vikasrawal/orgpaper > >> From my point of view, using LaTeX through Org isn't difficult at all. > >> You'll need to tweak a few things (packages, figures, etc.), but it's > >> definitely easier for a beginner that starting a LaTeX document from > >> scratch. > >> Here's another article about writing LaTeX (social science) papers: > >> https://github.com/kjhealy/workflow-paper > >> > > -- > Professor John Kitchin > Doherty Hall A207F > Department of Chemical Engineering > Carnegie Mellon University > Pittsburgh, PA 15213 > 412-268-7803 > @johnkitchin > http://kitchingroup.cheme.cmu.edu > [-- Attachment #2: Type: text/html, Size: 4420 bytes --] ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 34+ messages in thread
* Re: exporting zotxt or orgref links to HTML and ODF 2015-01-29 1:34 ` Matt Price @ 2015-01-29 1:48 ` John Kitchin [not found] ` <CAN_Dec80Su+5Nh5mqNxBXsLu_gm93aY77B=2Zrce-TJ1RPKCig@mail.gmail.com> 2015-01-29 13:09 ` John Kitchin 1 sibling, 1 reply; 34+ messages in thread From: John Kitchin @ 2015-01-29 1:48 UTC (permalink / raw) To: Matt Price; +Cc: Org Mode [-- Attachment #1: Type: text/plain, Size: 4272 bytes --] I can see how you could have a command insert links from a zotero database. You just need some way to get a list of the keys for that. it looks like zotxt could provide that. if not, it could be a few sqlite commands to get it. Lets say we have citations like: zotero:zotero-key or [@zotero-key]. These are easy to get I think. I am still unclear on what you do after that. So far I only have used bibtex as the backend database, and there are programs like bibtex and pandox that create the bibliography from it. What is the end format you want? and how would zotero be used to generate the bibliography? John ----------------------------------- John Kitchin Professor Doherty Hall A207F Department of Chemical Engineering Carnegie Mellon University Pittsburgh, PA 15213 412-268-7803 http://kitchingroup.cheme.cmu.edu On Wed, Jan 28, 2015 at 8:34 PM, Matt Price <moptop99@gmail.com> wrote: > John, > > this does look very powerful. Do you see a path forward that would help > add zotero support to org-ref, probably using Erik's zotxt library? Does > that seem like a worthwhile goal for you? > > Matt > > > On Wed, Jan 28, 2015 at 6:01 PM, John Kitchin <johnrkitchin@gmail.com> > wrote: > >> With the latest version of org-ref, I can automate export from org >> through markdown to docx via pandoc like this: >> >> #+BEGIN_SRC emacs-lisp >> (defun ox-export-to-docx-and-open () >> "Export the current org file as a docx via markdown." >> (interactive) >> (let* ((bibfile (expand-file-name (car (org-ref-find-bibliography)))) >> ;; this is probably a full path >> (current-file (buffer-file-name)) >> (basename (file-name-sans-extension current-file)) >> (md-file (concat basename ".md")) >> (docx-file (concat basename ".docx"))) >> >> (when (file-exists-p docx-file) (delete-file docx-file)) >> (org-export-to-file 'md md-file) >> (shell-command (format >> "pandoc -s -S --bibliography=%s %s -o %s" >> bibfile md-file docx-file)) >> (org-open-file docx-file '(16)))) >> #+END_SRC >> >> >> this works because i defined a markdown format function that converts >> the cite link to pandoc format on export. I could avoid the markdown >> translation if I could do an org to org export that would do that. With >> a little work we could define file tags like: >> >> #+PANDOC_CSL: some-csl-file >> >> that would also get passed to the pandoc command to determine the style >> of the citation and bibliography. >> >> >> >> >> Matt Price writes: >> >> > i think I may have seen it these on the list at one point, but it's very >> > helpful to be reminded. >> > >> > I do think that the default fonts, etc., are a bit of an acquired taste >> for >> > humanists; and I've gotten used to using custom styles in html & odt for >> > size & placing of images; but even without following the instructions >> > carefully, export seems to work, which is pretyt amazing! >> > >> > Vikas recommends involving pandoc manually, as Erik H. has also >> suggested >> > to me; I would like to aovid doing that if possible, but if it has to be >> > done i guess I can find some way of automating it. >> > >> > There are clearly a lot of options in this space; I am still interested >> in >> > using Zotero if I can, so will continue working with zotxt, but >> hopefully >> > in a way that gets me closer to other people's usage patterns. >> > >> > thanks, >> > Matt >> > >> > >> > On Wed, Jan 28, 2015 at 3:31 PM, Vicente Vera <vicentemvp@gmail.com> >> wrote: >> > >> >> Hello. Interesting thread! >> >> Matt, have you read Vikas guide to writing papers with Org? >> >> https://github.com/vikasrawal/orgpaper >> >> From my point of view, using LaTeX through Org isn't difficult at all. >> >> You'll need to tweak a few things (packages, figures, etc.), but it's >> >> definitely easier for a beginner that starting a LaTeX document from >> >> scratch. >> >> Here's another article about writing LaTeX (social science) papers: >> >> https://github.com/kjhealy/workflow-paper >> >> >> >> -- >> Professor John Kitchin >> Doherty Hall A207F >> Department of Chemical Engineering >> Carnegie Mellon University >> Pittsburgh, PA 15213 >> 412-268-7803 >> @johnkitchin >> http://kitchingroup.cheme.cmu.edu >> > > [-- Attachment #2: Type: text/html, Size: 5973 bytes --] ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 34+ messages in thread
[parent not found: <CAN_Dec80Su+5Nh5mqNxBXsLu_gm93aY77B=2Zrce-TJ1RPKCig@mail.gmail.com>]
* Re: exporting zotxt or orgref links to HTML and ODF [not found] ` <CAN_Dec80Su+5Nh5mqNxBXsLu_gm93aY77B=2Zrce-TJ1RPKCig@mail.gmail.com> @ 2015-01-29 13:06 ` John Kitchin 2015-01-29 13:11 ` Vikas Rawal 0 siblings, 1 reply; 34+ messages in thread From: John Kitchin @ 2015-01-29 13:06 UTC (permalink / raw) To: Matt Price, emacs-orgmode It turns out to be very easy to get pandoc citations into orgmode using helm-bibtex. It is not even that difficult to make the pandoc citations clickable to get similar features as in org-ref. They just don't have the org-element support. Having tried this, I don't see any obvious advantages over org-links (except that I still have to figure out how to export org to org, with a translation of org-link to pandoc citation). See this example: http://kitchingroup.cheme.cmu.edu/blog/2015/01/29/Export-org-mode-to-docx-with-citations-via-pandoc/ The conversion is not perfect, but it gets pretty far. Probably not far enough to use for production except in the simplest cases. Matt Price writes: > On Wed, Jan 28, 2015 at 8:48 PM, John Kitchin <johnrkitchin@gmail.com> > wrote: > >> I can see how you could have a command insert links from a zotero >> database. You just need some way to get a list of the keys for that. it >> looks like zotxt could provide that. if not, it could be a few sqlite >> commands to get it. >> > Lets say we have citations like: zotero:zotero-key or [@zotero-key]. These >> are easy to get I think. >> > > I think zotxt already does this, though one would have to modify the link > format for ocmpativility. That part doesn't seem so hard, even for someone > like me. > >> >> I am still unclear on what you do after that. So far I only have used >> bibtex as the backend database, and there are programs like bibtex and >> pandox that create the bibliography from it. What is the end format you >> want? and how would zotero be used to generate the bibliography? >> >> For my own use, the most important end formats are html and odt/docx. Of > course it would be nice if there was a more generic solution so other > people could benefit. > Erik has written a python script, pandoc-zotxt, which allows an interface > with pandoc. I'm not sure how it works - -I haven't started using pandoc > in any serious way just yet. ( > https://github.com/egh/zotxt/tree/master/pandoc-zotxt) > > It also looks easy to query the zotero database with a list of keys and > retrieve a bibliography in html or plaintext formats. That would, I guess > be useful for HTML export. For ODT I think the situation is somewhat more > difficult, especially if one wants to retain "live" Zotero links in the > final stage, working with Libreoffice. > > thanks again John, > Matt > > > >> John >> >> ----------------------------------- >> John Kitchin >> Professor >> Doherty Hall A207F >> Department of Chemical Engineering >> Carnegie Mellon University >> Pittsburgh, PA 15213 >> 412-268-7803 >> http://kitchingroup.cheme.cmu.edu >> >> >> On Wed, Jan 28, 2015 at 8:34 PM, Matt Price <moptop99@gmail.com> wrote: >> >>> John, >>> >>> this does look very powerful. Do you see a path forward that would help >>> add zotero support to org-ref, probably using Erik's zotxt library? Does >>> that seem like a worthwhile goal for you? >>> >>> Matt >>> >>> >>> On Wed, Jan 28, 2015 at 6:01 PM, John Kitchin <johnrkitchin@gmail.com> >>> wrote: >>> >>>> With the latest version of org-ref, I can automate export from org >>>> through markdown to docx via pandoc like this: >>>> >>>> #+BEGIN_SRC emacs-lisp >>>> (defun ox-export-to-docx-and-open () >>>> "Export the current org file as a docx via markdown." >>>> (interactive) >>>> (let* ((bibfile (expand-file-name (car (org-ref-find-bibliography)))) >>>> ;; this is probably a full path >>>> (current-file (buffer-file-name)) >>>> (basename (file-name-sans-extension current-file)) >>>> (md-file (concat basename ".md")) >>>> (docx-file (concat basename ".docx"))) >>>> >>>> (when (file-exists-p docx-file) (delete-file docx-file)) >>>> (org-export-to-file 'md md-file) >>>> (shell-command (format >>>> "pandoc -s -S --bibliography=%s %s -o %s" >>>> bibfile md-file docx-file)) >>>> (org-open-file docx-file '(16)))) >>>> #+END_SRC >>>> >>>> >>>> this works because i defined a markdown format function that converts >>>> the cite link to pandoc format on export. I could avoid the markdown >>>> translation if I could do an org to org export that would do that. With >>>> a little work we could define file tags like: >>>> >>>> #+PANDOC_CSL: some-csl-file >>>> >>>> that would also get passed to the pandoc command to determine the style >>>> of the citation and bibliography. >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> Matt Price writes: >>>> >>>> > i think I may have seen it these on the list at one point, but it's >>>> very >>>> > helpful to be reminded. >>>> > >>>> > I do think that the default fonts, etc., are a bit of an acquired >>>> taste for >>>> > humanists; and I've gotten used to using custom styles in html & odt >>>> for >>>> > size & placing of images; but even without following the instructions >>>> > carefully, export seems to work, which is pretyt amazing! >>>> > >>>> > Vikas recommends involving pandoc manually, as Erik H. has also >>>> suggested >>>> > to me; I would like to aovid doing that if possible, but if it has to >>>> be >>>> > done i guess I can find some way of automating it. >>>> > >>>> > There are clearly a lot of options in this space; I am still >>>> interested in >>>> > using Zotero if I can, so will continue working with zotxt, but >>>> hopefully >>>> > in a way that gets me closer to other people's usage patterns. >>>> > >>>> > thanks, >>>> > Matt >>>> > >>>> > >>>> > On Wed, Jan 28, 2015 at 3:31 PM, Vicente Vera <vicentemvp@gmail.com> >>>> wrote: >>>> > >>>> >> Hello. Interesting thread! >>>> >> Matt, have you read Vikas guide to writing papers with Org? >>>> >> https://github.com/vikasrawal/orgpaper >>>> >> From my point of view, using LaTeX through Org isn't difficult at all. >>>> >> You'll need to tweak a few things (packages, figures, etc.), but it's >>>> >> definitely easier for a beginner that starting a LaTeX document from >>>> >> scratch. >>>> >> Here's another article about writing LaTeX (social science) papers: >>>> >> https://github.com/kjhealy/workflow-paper >>>> >> >>>> >>>> -- >>>> Professor John Kitchin >>>> Doherty Hall A207F >>>> Department of Chemical Engineering >>>> Carnegie Mellon University >>>> Pittsburgh, PA 15213 >>>> 412-268-7803 >>>> @johnkitchin >>>> http://kitchingroup.cheme.cmu.edu >>>> >>> >>> >> -- Professor John Kitchin Doherty Hall A207F Department of Chemical Engineering Carnegie Mellon University Pittsburgh, PA 15213 412-268-7803 @johnkitchin http://kitchingroup.cheme.cmu.edu ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 34+ messages in thread
* Re: exporting zotxt or orgref links to HTML and ODF 2015-01-29 13:06 ` John Kitchin @ 2015-01-29 13:11 ` Vikas Rawal 2015-01-29 13:24 ` John Kitchin 0 siblings, 1 reply; 34+ messages in thread From: Vikas Rawal @ 2015-01-29 13:11 UTC (permalink / raw) To: John Kitchin; +Cc: org-mode mailing list > > The conversion is not perfect, but it gets pretty far. Probably not far > enough to use for production except in the simplest cases. > > John, If your main objective is support for citations, why not go from Org to LaTeX, and then use Pandoc to convert from LaTeX to DocX? Is there an advantage in going through Markdown instead of LaTeX? In my experiments in going Org->LaTeX->(via Pandoc)DocX, I find Bibtex citations to work well. But there are other limitations of Pandoc (for example, lack of support for various LaTeX environments for making tables). Vikas ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 34+ messages in thread
* Re: exporting zotxt or orgref links to HTML and ODF 2015-01-29 13:11 ` Vikas Rawal @ 2015-01-29 13:24 ` John Kitchin 2015-01-29 13:39 ` Vikas Rawal 0 siblings, 1 reply; 34+ messages in thread From: John Kitchin @ 2015-01-29 13:24 UTC (permalink / raw) To: Vikas Rawal; +Cc: org-mode mailing list, John Kitchin That could be an option. I was mostly looking at feasibility for org to docx. There is no obvious advantage to go through markdown, I just had some handy machinery in org-ref to export my cite links to the pandoc format in that export. I have since figured out a simple way to insert pandoc citations in org directly, and do an org -> docx in pandoc directly. It looks like there are limitations all around. My sense is pandoc is just a temporary solution until there is (one day) a full org export to docx solution. I am not that experienced with the ODT export, so i don't know what the state of citation support in those are. Luckily that is not something I need often, but a robust org to docx export would be helpful to many! Vikas Rawal writes: >> >> The conversion is not perfect, but it gets pretty far. Probably not far >> enough to use for production except in the simplest cases. >> >> > > John, > > If your main objective is support for citations, why not go from Org to LaTeX, and then use Pandoc to convert from LaTeX to DocX? Is there an advantage in going through Markdown instead of LaTeX? > > In my experiments in going Org->LaTeX->(via Pandoc)DocX, I find Bibtex citations to work well. But there are other limitations of Pandoc (for example, lack of support for various LaTeX environments for making tables). > > Vikas -- Professor John Kitchin Doherty Hall A207F Department of Chemical Engineering Carnegie Mellon University Pittsburgh, PA 15213 412-268-7803 @johnkitchin http://kitchingroup.cheme.cmu.edu ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 34+ messages in thread
* Re: exporting zotxt or orgref links to HTML and ODF 2015-01-29 13:24 ` John Kitchin @ 2015-01-29 13:39 ` Vikas Rawal 0 siblings, 0 replies; 34+ messages in thread From: Vikas Rawal @ 2015-01-29 13:39 UTC (permalink / raw) To: John Kitchin; +Cc: org-mode mailing list For my use case, I find the native Org to Odt export has several limitations: 1. No support for bibtex 2. I end up using quite a bit of LaTeX-specific stuff for formatting tables and graphics. All of that gets messed up when I do Org to Odt export. I agree, a robust org to odt/docx export would be very helpful. Vikas > On 29-Jan-2015, at 6:54 pm, John Kitchin <johnrkitchin@gmail.com> wrote: > > That could be an option. I was mostly looking at feasibility for org to > docx. There is no obvious advantage to go through markdown, I just had > some handy machinery in org-ref to export my cite links to the pandoc > format in that export. I have since figured out a simple way to insert > pandoc citations in org directly, and do an org -> docx in pandoc > directly. > > It looks like there are limitations all around. My sense is pandoc is > just a temporary solution until there is (one day) a full org export to docx > solution. I am not that experienced with the ODT export, so i don't know > what the state of citation support in those are. > > Luckily that is not something I need often, but a robust org to docx > export would be helpful to many! > > Vikas Rawal writes: > >>> >>> The conversion is not perfect, but it gets pretty far. Probably not far >>> enough to use for production except in the simplest cases. >>> >>> >> >> John, >> >> If your main objective is support for citations, why not go from Org to LaTeX, and then use Pandoc to convert from LaTeX to DocX? Is there an advantage in going through Markdown instead of LaTeX? >> >> In my experiments in going Org->LaTeX->(via Pandoc)DocX, I find Bibtex citations to work well. But there are other limitations of Pandoc (for example, lack of support for various LaTeX environments for making tables). >> >> Vikas > > -- > Professor John Kitchin > Doherty Hall A207F > Department of Chemical Engineering > Carnegie Mellon University > Pittsburgh, PA 15213 > 412-268-7803 > @johnkitchin > http://kitchingroup.cheme.cmu.edu ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 34+ messages in thread
* Re: exporting zotxt or orgref links to HTML and ODF 2015-01-29 1:34 ` Matt Price 2015-01-29 1:48 ` John Kitchin @ 2015-01-29 13:09 ` John Kitchin 1 sibling, 0 replies; 34+ messages in thread From: John Kitchin @ 2015-01-29 13:09 UTC (permalink / raw) To: Matt Price; +Cc: Org Mode, John Kitchin There is a separation between the citation bits in an org-file (whether they are org-links, or the pandoc format, etc...) and the formatted bibliography. org-ref is really focused on providing functionality to insert the citation keys (using reftex, or helm-bibtex right now, but there are many other options that could do this like ebib, perhaps zotxt, ido-completion, etc...), and references and labels. Then, once the citations are in, org-ref provides functionality to see what is cited, open the reference, pdf, search in scientific search engines, other utilities, etc... I can imagine there being backend (bibtex, ox-bibtex, zotero, ...) specific functions to do these things (usually you have to get some information from the entry to act, like get a doi to open a url, etc...). The formatting of the bibliography is almost always done by a dedicated program, e.g. bibtex, biblatex, or now in some cases pandoc. org-ref just provides functionality to export org and transform the links into the format required for those programs. If it were possible to figure out how to insert zotero links in a docx, then zotero would take over to make the bibliography in the docx. Ditto for mendeley, Endnote, Papers, ... The only exceptions to this are html where org-ref enables a crude and limited export of the bibliography for blog posts. I am not interested in having org-ref do much more than this, because the dedicated tools do such a good job in my opinion, it isn't worth duplicating the effort. Matt Price writes: > John, > > this does look very powerful. Do you see a path forward that would help > add zotero support to org-ref, probably using Erik's zotxt library? Does > that seem like a worthwhile goal for you? > > Matt > > > On Wed, Jan 28, 2015 at 6:01 PM, John Kitchin <johnrkitchin@gmail.com> > wrote: > >> With the latest version of org-ref, I can automate export from org >> through markdown to docx via pandoc like this: >> >> #+BEGIN_SRC emacs-lisp >> (defun ox-export-to-docx-and-open () >> "Export the current org file as a docx via markdown." >> (interactive) >> (let* ((bibfile (expand-file-name (car (org-ref-find-bibliography)))) >> ;; this is probably a full path >> (current-file (buffer-file-name)) >> (basename (file-name-sans-extension current-file)) >> (md-file (concat basename ".md")) >> (docx-file (concat basename ".docx"))) >> >> (when (file-exists-p docx-file) (delete-file docx-file)) >> (org-export-to-file 'md md-file) >> (shell-command (format >> "pandoc -s -S --bibliography=%s %s -o %s" >> bibfile md-file docx-file)) >> (org-open-file docx-file '(16)))) >> #+END_SRC >> >> >> this works because i defined a markdown format function that converts >> the cite link to pandoc format on export. I could avoid the markdown >> translation if I could do an org to org export that would do that. With >> a little work we could define file tags like: >> >> #+PANDOC_CSL: some-csl-file >> >> that would also get passed to the pandoc command to determine the style >> of the citation and bibliography. >> >> >> >> >> Matt Price writes: >> >> > i think I may have seen it these on the list at one point, but it's very >> > helpful to be reminded. >> > >> > I do think that the default fonts, etc., are a bit of an acquired taste >> for >> > humanists; and I've gotten used to using custom styles in html & odt for >> > size & placing of images; but even without following the instructions >> > carefully, export seems to work, which is pretyt amazing! >> > >> > Vikas recommends involving pandoc manually, as Erik H. has also suggested >> > to me; I would like to aovid doing that if possible, but if it has to be >> > done i guess I can find some way of automating it. >> > >> > There are clearly a lot of options in this space; I am still interested >> in >> > using Zotero if I can, so will continue working with zotxt, but hopefully >> > in a way that gets me closer to other people's usage patterns. >> > >> > thanks, >> > Matt >> > >> > >> > On Wed, Jan 28, 2015 at 3:31 PM, Vicente Vera <vicentemvp@gmail.com> >> wrote: >> > >> >> Hello. Interesting thread! >> >> Matt, have you read Vikas guide to writing papers with Org? >> >> https://github.com/vikasrawal/orgpaper >> >> From my point of view, using LaTeX through Org isn't difficult at all. >> >> You'll need to tweak a few things (packages, figures, etc.), but it's >> >> definitely easier for a beginner that starting a LaTeX document from >> >> scratch. >> >> Here's another article about writing LaTeX (social science) papers: >> >> https://github.com/kjhealy/workflow-paper >> >> >> >> -- >> Professor John Kitchin >> Doherty Hall A207F >> Department of Chemical Engineering >> Carnegie Mellon University >> Pittsburgh, PA 15213 >> 412-268-7803 >> @johnkitchin >> http://kitchingroup.cheme.cmu.edu >> -- Professor John Kitchin Doherty Hall A207F Department of Chemical Engineering Carnegie Mellon University Pittsburgh, PA 15213 412-268-7803 @johnkitchin http://kitchingroup.cheme.cmu.edu ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 34+ messages in thread
* Re: exporting zotxt or orgref links to HTML and ODF 2015-01-28 23:01 ` John Kitchin 2015-01-29 1:34 ` Matt Price @ 2015-01-29 2:26 ` Vikas Rawal 1 sibling, 0 replies; 34+ messages in thread From: Vikas Rawal @ 2015-01-29 2:26 UTC (permalink / raw) To: John Kitchin; +Cc: org-mode mailing list, Vicente Vera > > With the latest version of org-ref, I can automate export from org > through markdown to docx via pandoc like this: Great job, once again! Vikas ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 34+ messages in thread
* exporting zotxt or orgref links to HTML and ODF
@ 2015-01-26 16:29 Matt Price
[not found] ` <54C67E1A.8080706@law.lsu.edu>
` (4 more replies)
0 siblings, 5 replies; 34+ messages in thread
From: Matt Price @ 2015-01-26 16:29 UTC (permalink / raw)
To: Org Mode
[-- Attachment #1: Type: text/plain, Size: 6290 bytes --]
Hi eveyrone,
I've just looked back through my email archives and from what I can tell,
almost everyone who uses Org to write papers uses LaTex for the final
product.
I have never learned to use Latex, mostly because, as a humanist, almost
none of my colleagues can use LaTex files, and the same goes for journals I
interact with, which generally prefer Word submission(!). Because of this,
I am still trying to figure out a way to use org-mode for scholarly
writing. At present, I write my first, very rough drafts in Org, then
export to ODT and add citations from Zotero (we don't really use Bibtex
either); after this step, I can't really go back to Org, which is of course
very frustrating.
I would prefer to write exclusively in Org, then export to ODT when I have
a high-quality draft that I want to share with colleagues; in some cases, I
would also like to export directly to HTML for posting on a blog or course
website. In fact, one use case that would really help me is a very simple
one: when writing course syllabi, I would really like to just get the full
references to course readings to show up in HTML exports.
My question: does anyone yet have a workflow that lets them export directly
to HTML or ODT?
I've just tried using zotxt again (
https://bitbucket.org/egh/zotxt-emacs/overview -- first time in a while);
it is remarkably easy to use in Org itself. By default, though, the links
simply aren't handled in the HTML and ODT exports, and so the cites will be
completely absent.
Here is the text inserted by zotxt for a single citation:
----------------
[[zotero://select/items/0_TI27HJ5I][Suchman, Lucy. “Subject Objects.”
Feminist Theory 12, no. 2 (August 1, 2011): 119–45.
http://resolver.scholarsportal.info/resolve/14647001/v12i0002/119_so.xml.]]
---------------
In HTML, I would like to replace this with something like this:
(<a href="#BibSuchman2011">Suchman 2011</a>)
and then have Org generate a bibligraphy somewhere, a bit like org-ref
seems to do, It would be nice if I could steal the styles from somehwere,
the way org-ref seems to do.
For ODT< it seems a little more complicated. Here is the rather lengthy
equivalent that Zotero itself produces for my default style (Chicago) in
Libreoffice:
---------------
<text:note text:id="ftn0"
text:note-class="footnote"><text:note-citation>1</text:note-citation><text:note-body><text:p
text:style-name="Footnote"><text:reference-mark-start
text:name="ZOTERO_ITEM CSL_CITATION
{"citationID":"5xzXuF2I","properties":{"formattedCitation":"{\\rtf
Lucy Suchman, \\uc0\\u8220{}Subject Objects,\\uc0\\u8221{} \\i Feminist
Theory\\i0{} 12, no. 2 (August 1, 2011): 119\\uc0\\u8211{}45,
http://resolver.scholarsportal.info/resolve/14647001/v12i0002/119_so.xml.}","plainCitation":"Lucy
Suchman, “Subject Objects,” Feminist Theory 12, no. 2 (August 1, 2011):
119–45,
http://resolver.scholarsportal.info/resolve/14647001/v12i0002/119_so.xml."
},"citationItems":[{"id":149,"uris":["
http://zotero.org/users/20/items/TI27HJ5I"],"uri":["
http://zotero.org/users/20/items/TI27HJ5I"],"itemData":{"id":149,"type":"article-journal","title":"Subject
objects","container-title":"Feminist
Theory","page":"119-145","volume":"12","issue":"2","URL":"
http://resolver.scholarsportal.info/resolve/14647001/v12i0002/119_so.xml"
;,"ISSN":"14647001","author":[{"family":"Suchman","given":"Lucy"}],"issued":{"date-parts":[["2011",8,1]]}}}],"schema":"
https://github.com/citation-style-language/schema/raw/master/csl-citation.json"}
RNDuhNYYpC1hN"/><text:span text:style-name="T3">Lucy Suchman, “Subject
Objects,” </text:span><text:span text:style-name="T4">Feminist
Theory</text:span><text:span text:style-name="T5"> 12, no. 2 (August 1,
2011): 119–45,
http://resolver.scholarsportal.info/resolve/14647001/v12i0002/119_so.xml.</text:span><text:reference-mark-end
text:name="ZOTERO_ITEM CSL_CITATION
{"citationID":"5xzXuF2I","properties":{"formattedCitation":"{\\rtf
Lucy Suchman, \\uc0\\u8220{}Subject Objects,\\uc0\\u8221{} \\i Feminist
Theory\\i0{} 12, no. 2 (August 1, 2011): 119\\uc0\\u8211{}45,
http://resolver.scholarsportal.info/resolve/14647001/v12i0002/119_so.xml.}","plainCitation":"Lucy
Suchman, “Subject Objects,” Feminist Theory 12, no. 2 (August 1, 2011):
119–45,
http://resolver.scholarsportal.info/resolve/14647001/v12i0002/119_so.xml."
},"citationItems":[{"id":149,"uris":["
http://zotero.org/users/20/items/TI27HJ5I"],"uri":["
http://zotero.org/users/20/items/TI27HJ5I"],"itemData":{"id":149,"type":"article-journal","title":"Subject
objects","container-title":"Feminist
Theory","page":"119-145","volume":"12","issue":"2","URL":"
http://resolver.scholarsportal.info/resolve/14647001/v12i0002/119_so.xml"
;,"ISSN":"14647001","author":[{"family":"Suchman","given":"Lucy"}],"issued":{"date-parts":[["2011",8,1]]}}}],"schema":"
https://github.com/citation-style-language/schema/raw/master/csl-citation.json"}
RNDuhNYYpC1hN"/></text:p></text:note-body></text:note>
------------------------------
I'm not sure what the best way to do this is; it may be that zotxt could be
extended to get zotero to do the heavy lifting here.
I know Erik H reads this list, so if you have any suggestions, Erik, I
would love to hear them. But maybe other people also have suggestions
about modifying export filters - -that would also be really helpful for
me. Thanks as always,
Matt
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^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 34+ messages in thread[parent not found: <54C67E1A.8080706@law.lsu.edu>]
* Re: exporting zotxt or orgref links to HTML and ODF [not found] ` <54C67E1A.8080706@law.lsu.edu> @ 2015-01-26 20:40 ` Matt Price 2015-01-26 21:53 ` Monroe, Will 0 siblings, 1 reply; 34+ messages in thread From: Matt Price @ 2015-01-26 20:40 UTC (permalink / raw) To: Monroe, Will, Org Mode [-- Attachment #1: Type: text/plain, Size: 10970 bytes --] Hi will, I haven't gotten very far with this yet, but adding a couple of lines to the definition of org-add-link-type in org-zotxt.el (around line 150, https://bitbucket.org/egh/zotxt-emacs/src/74702e2b2f2aa0427f099eb4fe69dce8709f67fc/org-zotxt.el?at=master) at least allows for unformatted, plain-text reproduction of citations: ------------------ (org-add-link-type "zotero" (lambda (rest) (zotxt-select-key (substring rest 15))) (lambda (path desc format) (if (and (eq format 'latex) (string-match "^@\\(.*\\)$" desc)) (format "\\cite{%s}" (match-string 1 desc)) nil) (if ( eq format 'html) (format "%s" desc) nil))) ------------------- A better option would be to somehow acquire the html that the Zotero extension "zotxt" generates when zotxt.el requests the formatted citation from it. I'm not quite sure how to do this, but I htink the action happens zotxt-choose-deferred, which starts on line 125 of zotxt.el ( https://bitbucket.org/egh/zotxt-emacs/src/74702e2b2f2aa0427f099eb4fe69dce8709f67fc/zotxt.el?at=master ): --------------------- (defun zotxt-choose-deferred (&optional method search-string) "Prompt a user for a search string, then ask the user to select an item from the citation.If METHOD is supplied, it should be one of :title-creator-year, :fields, or :everything.If SEARCH-STRING is supplied, it should be the search string." (if (null method) (let ((method-name (zotxt-completing-read "Zotero search method (nothing for title, creator, year): " zotxt-quicksearch-method-names nil t nil nil "title, creator, year"))) (setq method (cdr (assoc method-name zotxt-quicksearch-method-names))))) (if (null search-string) (setq search-string (read-string (format "Zotero quicksearch (%s) query: " (cdr (assq method zotxt-quicksearch-method-to-names)))))) (lexical-let ((d (deferred:new))) (request (format "%s/search" zotxt-url-base) :params `(("q" . ,search-string) ("method" . ,(cdr (assq method zotxt-quicksearch-method-params))) ("format" . "bibliography")) :parser 'json-read :success (function* (lambda (&key data &allow-other-keys) (let* ((results (mapcar (lambda (e) (cons (cdr (assq 'text e)) (cdr (assq 'key e)))) data)) (count (length results)) (citation (if (= 0 count) nil (if (= 1 count) (car (car results)) (zotxt-completing-read "Select item: " results)))) (key (cdr (assoc-string citation results)))) (deferred:callback-post d (if (null citation) nil `((:key ,key :citation ,citation)))))))) d)) ------------- My lisp isn't good enough to read this function properly, but apparently the :citation property of the result item plist is set to the 'text' object of each item. If one could also add the 'html' object which the zotxt Zotero plugin returns (the nomenclature is a little misleading, I know), then that information could be made available to emacs/org for use on export. See line 307-309 of the zotxt extension, here: https://bitbucket.org/egh/zotxt/src/a12d538ae9245b142fdb55550b2d241e43b82221/extension/bootstrap.js?at=master Not sure if this helps much? It's the best I have so far! Thanks, Matt On Mon, Jan 26, 2015 at 12:49 PM, Monroe, Will <will.monroe@law.lsu.edu> wrote: > Matt, > > I don't have much to contribute at this stage but as someone who uses org > heavily for outlining and writing, zotero for citation management, and who > is obliged to provide copies as Word documents (I'm an instructional > designer at at law school), I appreciate the question. > > I also appreciate the point to zotxt! Didn't know about that. > > I hope you get some good replies. > > Will > > ----------------------------- > Will Monroe, Ph.D. > Head of Instructional Technology > Paul M. Hebert Law Center > 225.578.7838 > will.monroe@law.lsu.edu > > On 1/26/15 10:29 AM, Matt Price wrote: > > Hi eveyrone, > > I've just looked back through my email archives and from what I can tell, > almost everyone who uses Org to write papers uses LaTex for the final > product. > > I have never learned to use Latex, mostly because, as a humanist, almost > none of my colleagues can use LaTex files, and the same goes for journals I > interact with, which generally prefer Word submission(!). Because of this, > I am still trying to figure out a way to use org-mode for scholarly > writing. At present, I write my first, very rough drafts in Org, then > export to ODT and add citations from Zotero (we don't really use Bibtex > either); after this step, I can't really go back to Org, which is of course > very frustrating. > > > I would prefer to write exclusively in Org, then export to ODT when I > have a high-quality draft that I want to share with colleagues; in some > cases, I would also like to export directly to HTML for posting on a blog > or course website. In fact, one use case that would really help me is a > very simple one: when writing course syllabi, I would really like to just > get the full references to course readings to show up in HTML exports. > > My question: does anyone yet have a workflow that lets them export > directly to HTML or ODT? > > I've just tried using zotxt again ( > https://bitbucket.org/egh/zotxt-emacs/overview -- first time in a while); > it is remarkably easy to use in Org itself. By default, though, the links > simply aren't handled in the HTML and ODT exports, and so the cites will be > completely absent. > > Here is the text inserted by zotxt for a single citation: > > ---------------- > > [[zotero://select/items/0_TI27HJ5I][Suchman, Lucy. “Subject Objects.” > Feminist Theory 12, no. 2 (August 1, 2011): 119–45. > http://resolver.scholarsportal.info/resolve/14647001/v12i0002/119_so.xml.]] > > --------------- > > In HTML, I would like to replace this with something like this: > > (<a href="#BibSuchman2011">Suchman 2011</a>) > > and then have Org generate a bibligraphy somewhere, a bit like org-ref > seems to do, It would be nice if I could steal the styles from somehwere, > the way org-ref seems to do. > > For ODT< it seems a little more complicated. Here is the rather lengthy > equivalent that Zotero itself produces for my default style (Chicago) in > Libreoffice: > --------------- > <text:note text:id="ftn0" > text:note-class="footnote"><text:note-citation>1</text:note-citation><text:note-body><text:p > text:style-name="Footnote"><text:reference-mark-start > text:name="ZOTERO_ITEM CSL_CITATION > {"citationID":"5xzXuF2I","properties":{"formattedCitation":"{\\rtf > Lucy Suchman, \\uc0\\u8220{}Subject Objects,\\uc0\\u8221{} \\i Feminist > Theory\\i0{} 12, no. 2 (August 1, 2011): 119\\uc0\\u8211{}45, > http://resolver.scholarsportal.info/resolve/14647001/v12i0002/119_so.xml.}","plainCitation":"Lucy > Suchman, “Subject Objects,” Feminist Theory 12, no. 2 (August 1, 2011): > 119–45, > http://resolver.scholarsportal.info/resolve/14647001/v12i0002/119_so.xml." > },"citationItems":[{"id":149,"uris":[" > http://zotero.org/users/20/items/TI27HJ5I"],"uri":[" > http://zotero.org/users/20/items/TI27HJ5I"],"itemData":{"id":149,"type":"article-journal","title":"Subject > objects","container-title":"Feminist > Theory","page":"119-145","volume":"12","issue":"2","URL":" > http://resolver.scholarsportal.info/resolve/14647001/v12i0002/119_so.xml" > ;,"ISSN":"14647001","author":[{"family":"Suchman","given":"Lucy"}],"issued":{"date-parts":[["2011",8,1]]}}}],"schema":" > https://github.com/citation-style-language/schema/raw/master/csl-citation.json"} > RNDuhNYYpC1hN"/><text:span text:style-name="T3">Lucy Suchman, “Subject > Objects,” </text:span><text:span text:style-name="T4">Feminist > Theory</text:span><text:span text:style-name="T5"> 12, no. 2 (August 1, > 2011): 119–45, > http://resolver.scholarsportal.info/resolve/14647001/v12i0002/119_so.xml.</text:span><text:reference-mark-end > text:name="ZOTERO_ITEM CSL_CITATION > {"citationID":"5xzXuF2I","properties":{"formattedCitation":"{\\rtf > Lucy Suchman, \\uc0\\u8220{}Subject Objects,\\uc0\\u8221{} \\i Feminist > Theory\\i0{} 12, no. 2 (August 1, 2011): 119\\uc0\\u8211{}45, > http://resolver.scholarsportal.info/resolve/14647001/v12i0002/119_so.xml.}","plainCitation":"Lucy > Suchman, “Subject Objects,” Feminist Theory 12, no. 2 (August 1, 2011): > 119–45, > http://resolver.scholarsportal.info/resolve/14647001/v12i0002/119_so.xml." > },"citationItems":[{"id":149,"uris":[" > http://zotero.org/users/20/items/TI27HJ5I"],"uri":[" > http://zotero.org/users/20/items/TI27HJ5I"],"itemData":{"id":149,"type":"article-journal","title":"Subject > objects","container-title":"Feminist > Theory","page":"119-145","volume":"12","issue":"2","URL":" > http://resolver.scholarsportal.info/resolve/14647001/v12i0002/119_so.xml" > ;,"ISSN":"14647001","author":[{"family":"Suchman","given":"Lucy"}],"issued":{"date-parts":[["2011",8,1]]}}}],"schema":" > https://github.com/citation-style-language/schema/raw/master/csl-citation.json"} > RNDuhNYYpC1hN"/></text:p></text:note-body></text:note> > ------------------------------ > > I'm not sure what the best way to do this is; it may be that zotxt could > be extended to get zotero to do the heavy lifting here. > > I know Erik H reads this list, so if you have any suggestions, Erik, I > would love to hear them. But maybe other people also have suggestions > about modifying export filters - -that would also be really helpful for > me. Thanks as always, > > Matt > > > [-- Attachment #2: Type: text/html, Size: 22605 bytes --] ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 34+ messages in thread
* Re: exporting zotxt or orgref links to HTML and ODF 2015-01-26 20:40 ` Matt Price @ 2015-01-26 21:53 ` Monroe, Will 0 siblings, 0 replies; 34+ messages in thread From: Monroe, Will @ 2015-01-26 21:53 UTC (permalink / raw) To: emacs-orgmode [-- Attachment #1: Type: text/html, Size: 29285 bytes --] ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 34+ messages in thread
* Re: exporting zotxt or orgref links to HTML and ODF 2015-01-26 16:29 Matt Price [not found] ` <54C67E1A.8080706@law.lsu.edu> @ 2015-01-27 8:25 ` Eric S Fraga 2015-01-27 9:23 ` Christian Moe ` (2 subsequent siblings) 4 siblings, 0 replies; 34+ messages in thread From: Eric S Fraga @ 2015-01-27 8:25 UTC (permalink / raw) To: Matt Price; +Cc: Org Mode On Monday, 26 Jan 2015 at 11:29, Matt Price wrote: [...] > My question: does anyone yet have a workflow that lets them export directly > to HTML or ODT? The following is for MS Word output, not ODT, but you can of course read in Word files in Libreoffice and save as ODT if desired. Although I do strive to only have to work in org (+ LaTeX), I do sometimes have to generate Word files, especially for conference publications. In this case, I still use org but I generate the final document using org -> LaTeX and then use pandoc to get me the doc file using a shell script that looks like this: --8<---------------cut here---------------start------------->8--- #!/bin/sh -f BASE=$(basename $1 .tex) CSL="/home/ucecesf/synced/share/citation.styles/acm-siggraph.csl" if [ -f default.csl ]; then CSL="default.csl" fi echo "Converting " $BASE.tex " to " $BASE.docx " using bib style " $CSL pandoc --bibliography=/home/ucecesf/share/texmf/bibtex/bib/papers.bib --csl=${CSL} --filter pandoc-citeproc ${BASE}.tex -o ${BASE}.docx --8<---------------cut here---------------end--------------->8--- The key is pandoc with bib styles. The scripts defaults to using an ACM SIGGRAPH style but will use a "default" style if present in the current directory. Although you say your colleagues do not use BiBTeX, it does not stop you from using it within org and then exporting the result... With org exporting LaTeX fragments as images (hence my recent emails about dvipng...), I get equations (on the printed page) and bibliography without having to suffer using Word... Good luck! -- : Eric S Fraga (0xFFFCF67D), Emacs 25.0.50.1, Org release_8.3beta-726-gd34b80.dirty ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 34+ messages in thread
* Re: exporting zotxt or orgref links to HTML and ODF 2015-01-26 16:29 Matt Price [not found] ` <54C67E1A.8080706@law.lsu.edu> 2015-01-27 8:25 ` Eric S Fraga @ 2015-01-27 9:23 ` Christian Moe 2015-01-27 13:30 ` Rasmus 2015-01-27 12:01 ` Vikas Rawal [not found] ` <m2vbjsvay0.fsf@christianmoe.com> 4 siblings, 1 reply; 34+ messages in thread From: Christian Moe @ 2015-01-27 9:23 UTC (permalink / raw) To: Matt Price; +Cc: Org Mode Matt Price writes: > My question: does anyone yet have a workflow that lets them export directly > to HTML or ODT? Hi, Matt, Yes, now I have not just a workflow, but a code solution for Org/Zotero/ODT export that has been tried and tested for a while. It now supports multiple references in one citation, prefixes, suffixes, locators, and year-only citations, and produces 'live' Zotero refmarks in ODT, so you can do all the changes you want in LibreOffice afterward. It also does some very limited but useful things for html (DOI links and links that will work on Wordpress blogs with Katie Seaborn's ZotPress extension). It depends on Eric Hetzner's excellent zotero-plain and org-zotero packages, and hence on the MozRepl extension on the Firefox side, though you can use the ODT export functionality itself without those dependencies. I haven't yet announced it on the list, for three reasons. 1) Not very polished. There's some messy code, a poor man's user interface, and no editing support for multiple citations (but support for exporting them!). 2) It's part of a more ambitious project I set myself for an all-round citation system that I never got on with. 3) It uses this cool idea I had for how to use citation links differently, but it imposes certain syntax conventions on the user, and they may yet change in backward-incompatible ways if I develop this further. If this sounds interesting, I can post the code here 'as is' for you to try out, but I'd better update the docs first, which could take a day or two. Yours, Christian > I've just tried using zotxt again ( > https://bitbucket.org/egh/zotxt-emacs/overview[1] -- first time in a while); > it is remarkably easy to use in Org itself. By default, though, the links > simply aren't handled in the HTML and ODT exports, and so the cites will be > completely absent. > > Here is the text inserted by zotxt for a single citation: > > ---------------- > > [[zotero://select/items/0_TI27HJ5I][Suchman, Lucy. “Subject Objects.” > Feminist Theory 12, no. 2 (August 1, 2011): 119–45. > http://resolver.scholarsportal.info/resolve/14647001/v12i0002/119_so.xml.[2]]] > --------------- > > In HTML, I would like to replace this with something like this: > > (<a href="#BibSuchman2011">Suchman 2011</a>) > > and then have Org generate a bibligraphy somewhere, a bit like org-ref > seems to do, It would be nice if I could steal the styles from somehwere, > the way org-ref seems to do. > > For ODT< it seems a little more complicated. Here is the rather lengthy > equivalent that Zotero itself produces for my default style (Chicago) in > Libreoffice: > --------------- > <text:note text:id="ftn0" > text:note-class="footnote"><text:note-citation>1</text:note-citation><text:note-body><text:p > text:style-name="Footnote"><text:reference-mark-start > text:name="ZOTERO_ITEM CSL_CITATION > {"citationID":"5xzXuF2I","properties":{"formattedCitation":"{\\rtf > Lucy Suchman, \\uc0\\u8220{}Subject Objects,\\uc0\\u8221{} \\i Feminist > Theory\\i0{} 12, no. 2 (August 1, 2011): 119\\uc0\\u8211{}45, > http://resolver.scholarsportal.info/resolve/14647001/v12i0002/119_so.xml.[3]}","plainCitation":"Lucy > Suchman, “Subject Objects,” Feminist Theory 12, no. 2 (August 1, 2011): > 119–45, > http://resolver.scholarsportal.info/resolve/14647001/v12i0002/119_so.xml."[4] > },"citationItems":[{"id":149,"uris":[" > http://zotero.org/users/20/items/TI27HJ5I"[5]],"uri":[" > http://zotero.org/users/20/items/TI27HJ5I"[6]],"itemData":{"id":149,"type":"article-journal","title":"Subject > objects","container-title":"Feminist > Theory","page":"119-145","volume":"12","issue":"2","URL":" > http://resolver.scholarsportal.info/resolve/14647001/v12i0002/119_so.xml"[7] > ;,"ISSN":"14647001","author":[{"family":"Suchman","given":"Lucy"}],"issued":{"date-parts":[["2011",8,1]]}}}],"schema":" > https://github.com/citation-style-language/schema/raw/master/csl-citation.json"[8]} > RNDuhNYYpC1hN"/><text:span text:style-name="T3">Lucy Suchman, “Subject > Objects,” </text:span><text:span text:style-name="T4">Feminist > Theory</text:span><text:span text:style-name="T5"> 12, no. 2 (August 1, > 2011): 119–45, > http://resolver.scholarsportal.info/resolve/14647001/v12i0002/119_so.xml.[9]</text:span><text:reference-mark-end > text:name="ZOTERO_ITEM CSL_CITATION > {"citationID":"5xzXuF2I","properties":{"formattedCitation":"{\\rtf > Lucy Suchman, \\uc0\\u8220{}Subject Objects,\\uc0\\u8221{} \\i Feminist > Theory\\i0{} 12, no. 2 (August 1, 2011): 119\\uc0\\u8211{}45, > http://resolver.scholarsportal.info/resolve/14647001/v12i0002/119_so.xml.[10]}","plainCitation":"Lucy > Suchman, “Subject Objects,” Feminist Theory 12, no. 2 (August 1, 2011): > 119–45, > http://resolver.scholarsportal.info/resolve/14647001/v12i0002/119_so.xml."[11] > },"citationItems":[{"id":149,"uris":[" > http://zotero.org/users/20/items/TI27HJ5I"[12]],"uri":[" > http://zotero.org/users/20/items/TI27HJ5I"[13]],"itemData":{"id":149,"type":"article-journal","title":"Subject > objects","container-title":"Feminist > Theory","page":"119-145","volume":"12","issue":"2","URL":" > http://resolver.scholarsportal.info/resolve/14647001/v12i0002/119_so.xml"[14] > ;,"ISSN":"14647001","author":[{"family":"Suchman","given":"Lucy"}],"issued":{"date-parts":[["2011",8,1]]}}}],"schema":" > https://github.com/citation-style-language/schema/raw/master/csl-citation.json"[15]} > RNDuhNYYpC1hN"/></text:p></text:note-body></text:note> > ------------------------------ > > I'm not sure what the best way to do this is; it may be that zotxt could be > extended to get zotero to do the heavy lifting here. > > I know Erik H reads this list, so if you have any suggestions, Erik, I > would love to hear them. But maybe other people also have suggestions > about modifying export filters - -that would also be really helpful for > me. Thanks as always, > > Matt ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 34+ messages in thread
* Re: exporting zotxt or orgref links to HTML and ODF 2015-01-27 9:23 ` Christian Moe @ 2015-01-27 13:30 ` Rasmus 2015-01-27 13:51 ` Matt Price 2015-01-27 17:24 ` Richard Lawrence 0 siblings, 2 replies; 34+ messages in thread From: Rasmus @ 2015-01-27 13:30 UTC (permalink / raw) To: emacs-orgmode Hi, Christian Moe <mail@christianmoe.com> writes: > I haven't yet announced it on the list, for three reasons. 1) Not very > polished. There's some messy code, a poor man's user interface, and no > editing support for multiple citations (but support for exporting > them!). 2) It's part of a more ambitious project I set myself for an > all-round citation system that I never got on with. 3) It uses this cool > idea I had for how to use citation links differently, but it imposes > certain syntax conventions on the user, and they may yet change in > backward-incompatible ways if I develop this further. I also have a very half-baked branch somewhere with preliminary code, but mainly in terms of syntax/org-element (similar to pandoc). IMO we /need/ to add proper citation support to Org, preferably with a real syntax rather than these link-"solutions" and with good backend support (bibtex & Zotero for starters, I guess). #+begin_rant The current state is a mess and not portable. E.g. there's at least two Zotero projects, there's John Kitchin's code, there's ox-bibtex.el (which IMO is not suitable for complicated citation requirements), plus everyone and their mother's have got custom citation links in their config via custom org link types... /Proper/ citation support (not links) is, IMO, the last thing that is missing for good academic publishing support. #+end_rant —Rasmus -- I hear there's rumors on the, uh, Internets. . . ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 34+ messages in thread
* Re: exporting zotxt or orgref links to HTML and ODF 2015-01-27 13:30 ` Rasmus @ 2015-01-27 13:51 ` Matt Price 2015-01-27 14:14 ` Rasmus 2015-01-27 15:24 ` Christian Moe 2015-01-27 17:24 ` Richard Lawrence 1 sibling, 2 replies; 34+ messages in thread From: Matt Price @ 2015-01-27 13:51 UTC (permalink / raw) To: Org Mode [-- Attachment #1: Type: text/plain, Size: 1474 bytes --] On Tue, Jan 27, 2015 at 8:30 AM, Rasmus <rasmus@gmx.us> wrote: > Hi, > > Christian Moe <mail@christianmoe.com> writes: > > IMO we /need/ to add proper citation support to Org, preferably with a > real syntax rather than these link-"solutions" and with good backend > support (bibtex & Zotero for starters, I guess). > > #+begin_rant > > The current state is a mess and not portable. E.g. there's at least two > Zotero projects, there's John Kitchin's code, there's ox-bibtex.el (which > IMO is not suitable for complicated citation requirements), plus everyone > and their mother's have got custom citation links in their config via > custom org link types... > > /Proper/ citation support (not links) is, IMO, the last thing that is > missing for good academic publishing support. > > #+end_rant > > —Rasmus > (I know about zotxt -- is there another zotero project?) I am certainly not the person to implement anything "properly!" But I do agree -- if we had great citation support, with bibtex and Zotero undrestood as portable backends, then (a) i would really be able to work in org start to finish, and (b) I could start to recommend it to colleagues, as I'm itching to do. In the meantime, I think zotxt is the best starting point for me. But I would certainly be willing to test, debug, contribute minor patches, etc. to anyone who wants to take the project on properly (it is almost certainly beyond my limited skills). [-- Attachment #2: Type: text/html, Size: 2203 bytes --] ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 34+ messages in thread
* Re: exporting zotxt or orgref links to HTML and ODF 2015-01-27 13:51 ` Matt Price @ 2015-01-27 14:14 ` Rasmus 2015-01-27 18:17 ` John Kitchin 2015-01-27 15:24 ` Christian Moe 1 sibling, 1 reply; 34+ messages in thread From: Rasmus @ 2015-01-27 14:14 UTC (permalink / raw) To: emacs-orgmode Matt Price <moptop99@gmail.com> writes: > On Tue, Jan 27, 2015 at 8:30 AM, Rasmus <rasmus@gmx.us> wrote: >> #+begin_rant >> >> The current state is a mess and not portable. E.g. there's at least two >> Zotero projects, there's John Kitchin's code, there's ox-bibtex.el (which >> IMO is not suitable for complicated citation requirements), plus everyone >> and their mother's have got custom citation links in their config via >> custom org link types... >> >> /Proper/ citation support (not links) is, IMO, the last thing that is >> missing for good academic publishing support. >> >> #+end_rant > > (I know about zotxt -- is there another zotero project?) This is the other one I had in mind: https://github.com/vspinu/zotelo > (b) I could start to recommend it to colleagues, as I'm itching to do. But the argument "it's easier/cleaner" seems to shatter when you get to [[textcite:KEY]] compared to \textcite{KEY}... Even worse when you have to have notes, e.g. \textcite[pre][post]{KEY}. —Rasmus -- The right to be left alone is a human right ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 34+ messages in thread
* Re: exporting zotxt or orgref links to HTML and ODF 2015-01-27 14:14 ` Rasmus @ 2015-01-27 18:17 ` John Kitchin 0 siblings, 0 replies; 34+ messages in thread From: John Kitchin @ 2015-01-27 18:17 UTC (permalink / raw) To: Rasmus; +Cc: emacs-orgmode I have not found the link syntax too constraining. Simple links like the ones I use in org-ref are perfect for simple citation needs. It handles all different kinds of citations (cite, citet, textcite,...) and multiple citations. org-ref automates selection of keys and insertion via reftex or helm. They are all we need for the kind of scientific publication my group does. We have published six peer-reviewed publications so far with just these simple links. I do concede that if you use many "non-simple: features of biblatex, you are heading for trouble with links. You can probably just use raw LaTeX then. [[textcite:KEY]] is not required unless KEY has some particular characters like spaces or other link-breaking characters. textcite:KEY works just fine for me. I do agree that \textcite[pre][post]{KEY} is trickier and uglier to solve. I have only found this approach [[textcite:KEY][pre text::post text]] to work particularly well, and you have to parse the description in the export. I use :: as the divider, since it seems unlikely to be in either element. It takes a little more thought to automate insertion of these, but the link insertion machinery of org-mode will do it in org-ref. If you use descriptive links in org-mode, it collapses into just the description, which I don't like but live with. The newest org-ref has a minibuffer message feature that should show you a summary of the citation when your cursor is idle on that link though. I don't want to start a war over links vs dedicated element for citations. I just want to point out that links work really well for a large set of use cases, and other solutions are not likely to be as simple to use. My thoughts are biased of course since I have invested a lot of time and thought into org-ref, and I don't see the limitations you suggest in our daily work. If you send me some examples of what is not easy, maybe we can see if org-ref can do it. Rasmus writes: > Matt Price <moptop99@gmail.com> writes: > >> On Tue, Jan 27, 2015 at 8:30 AM, Rasmus <rasmus@gmx.us> wrote: >>> #+begin_rant >>> >>> The current state is a mess and not portable. E.g. there's at least two >>> Zotero projects, there's John Kitchin's code, there's ox-bibtex.el (which >>> IMO is not suitable for complicated citation requirements), plus everyone >>> and their mother's have got custom citation links in their config via >>> custom org link types... >>> >>> /Proper/ citation support (not links) is, IMO, the last thing that is >>> missing for good academic publishing support. >>> >>> #+end_rant >> >> (I know about zotxt -- is there another zotero project?) > > This is the other one I had in mind: > > https://github.com/vspinu/zotelo > >> (b) I could start to recommend it to colleagues, as I'm itching to do. > > But the argument "it's easier/cleaner" seems to shatter when you get to > [[textcite:KEY]] compared to \textcite{KEY}... Even worse when you have > to have notes, e.g. \textcite[pre][post]{KEY}. > > —Rasmus -- Professor John Kitchin Doherty Hall A207F Department of Chemical Engineering Carnegie Mellon University Pittsburgh, PA 15213 412-268-7803 @johnkitchin http://kitchingroup.cheme.cmu.edu ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 34+ messages in thread
* Re: exporting zotxt or orgref links to HTML and ODF 2015-01-27 13:51 ` Matt Price 2015-01-27 14:14 ` Rasmus @ 2015-01-27 15:24 ` Christian Moe 1 sibling, 0 replies; 34+ messages in thread From: Christian Moe @ 2015-01-27 15:24 UTC (permalink / raw) To: Matt Price; +Cc: Org Mode Matt Price writes: > On Tue, Jan 27, 2015 at 8:30 AM, Rasmus <rasmus@gmx.us> wrote: > >> Hi, >> >> Christian Moe <mail@christianmoe.com> writes: Actually, Rasmus wrote the following, not I. >> IMO we /need/ to add proper citation support to Org, preferably with a >> real syntax rather than these link-"solutions" and with good backend >> support (bibtex & Zotero for starters, I guess). >> >> #+begin_rant >> >> The current state is a mess and not portable. E.g. there's at least two >> Zotero projects, there's John Kitchin's code, there's ox-bibtex.el (which >> IMO is not suitable for complicated citation requirements), plus everyone >> and their mother's have got custom citation links in their config via >> custom org link types... >> >> /Proper/ citation support (not links) is, IMO, the last thing that is >> missing for good academic publishing support. But I don't necessarily disagree. I just figure I might try to prototype the solutions I'd like to see toward the day someone steps up to the bat and implements them in core with native syntax. Yours, Christian ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 34+ messages in thread
* Re: exporting zotxt or orgref links to HTML and ODF 2015-01-27 13:30 ` Rasmus 2015-01-27 13:51 ` Matt Price @ 2015-01-27 17:24 ` Richard Lawrence 2015-01-27 17:50 ` Rasmus ` (2 more replies) 1 sibling, 3 replies; 34+ messages in thread From: Richard Lawrence @ 2015-01-27 17:24 UTC (permalink / raw) To: emacs-orgmode Rasmus <rasmus@gmx.us> writes: > IMO we /need/ to add proper citation support to Org, preferably with a > real syntax rather than these link-"solutions" and with good backend > support (bibtex & Zotero for starters, I guess). > ... > /Proper/ citation support (not links) is, IMO, the last thing that is > missing for good academic publishing support. Although my home-baked solution presently works for me, I am inclined to agree. I've just had a glance at: http://pandoc.org/README.html#citations It looks to me like Pandoc has a quite general solution, and it also looks like Org could use Pandoc's citation syntax as-is. I would suggest borrowing this syntax as a starting point for building citation support into Org. #+BEGIN_QUOTE Citations go inside square brackets and are separated by semicolons. Each citation must have a key, composed of ‘@’ + the citation identifier from the database, and may optionally have a prefix, a locator, and a suffix. The citation key must begin with a letter or _, and may contain alphanumerics, _, and internal punctuation characters (:.#$%&-+?<>~/). Here are some examples: Blah blah [see @doe99, pp. 33-35; also @smith04, ch. 1]. Blah blah [@doe99, pp. 33-35, 38-39 and *passim*]. Blah blah [@smith04; @doe99]. A minus sign (-) before the @ will suppress mention of the author in the citation. This can be useful when the author is already mentioned in the text: Smith says blah [-@smith04]. You can also write an in-text citation, as follows: @smith04 says blah. @smith04 [p. 33] says blah. #+END_QUOTE Org does use single brackets and `@'-signs for other things (footnote markers, priorities, statistics cookies, inactive timestamps, list counters, inline export snippets -- I think that's it). But these should all be pretty easy to tell apart from citations using regular expressions, so I wouldn't expect parsing this syntax to present any difficulties. Does anyone have citation needs that this syntax doesn't cover? Using this syntax would also have the advantage that Pandoc can already parse it, which would reduce friction for Org users who convert their documents with Pandoc (and Pandoc users who need to deal with Org inputs). Since this seems like a significant contingent of Org users, that's something to consider. The bigger question is whether, in addition to a citation *syntax*, it would be a lot of work to add support for the various citation database formats, as well as the various output styles, and which ones to support. Best, Richard ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 34+ messages in thread
* Re: exporting zotxt or orgref links to HTML and ODF 2015-01-27 17:24 ` Richard Lawrence @ 2015-01-27 17:50 ` Rasmus 2015-01-28 4:09 ` Richard Lawrence 2015-01-27 20:01 ` Christian Moe 2015-01-28 6:37 ` Erik Hetzner 2 siblings, 1 reply; 34+ messages in thread From: Rasmus @ 2015-01-27 17:50 UTC (permalink / raw) To: emacs-orgmode Hi, Richard Lawrence <richard.lawrence@berkeley.edu> writes: > Rasmus <rasmus@gmx.us> writes: > >> IMO we /need/ to add proper citation support to Org, preferably with a >> real syntax rather than these link-"solutions" and with good backend >> support (bibtex & Zotero for starters, I guess). >> ... >> /Proper/ citation support (not links) is, IMO, the last thing that is >> missing for good academic publishing support. > > Although my home-baked solution presently works for me, I am inclined to > agree. It works for me as well, but it's still an ugly hack that I cannot advice friends and colleagues to follow. Still, I would much rather have quality-support like with entities. > I've just had a glance at: http://pandoc.org/README.html#citations Indeed. Pandoc seems to most sensible. I have a survey of implementations in on my other computer (in a folder that is not synced between my PCs). > Org does use single brackets and `@'-signs for other things (footnote > markers, priorities, statistics cookies, inactive timestamps, list > counters, inline export snippets -- I think that's it). But these > should all be pretty easy to tell apart from citations using regular > expressions, so I wouldn't expect parsing this syntax to present any > difficulties. Maybe something like: @short-textcite-key, (@parentcite-key) and [@textcite-key :with options] (@parencite-key :with options). > Does anyone have citation needs that this syntax doesn't cover? From my experience with social science publication, one needs to be able to add options (e.g. cite-type, "citeyear", say) and pre and post notes. > The bigger question is whether, in addition to a citation *syntax*, it > would be a lot of work to add support for the various citation database > formats, as well as the various output styles, and which ones to > support. I guess. But it can be added gradually. BTW: Org has an almost-agnostic format for storing citation data via org-bibtex.el. So perhaps it's easier to go from whatever to org-bibtex-format and from there to ox-backend-format. I think that's how pandoc does it as well. —Rasmus -- May the Force be with you ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 34+ messages in thread
* Re: exporting zotxt or orgref links to HTML and ODF 2015-01-27 17:50 ` Rasmus @ 2015-01-28 4:09 ` Richard Lawrence 0 siblings, 0 replies; 34+ messages in thread From: Richard Lawrence @ 2015-01-28 4:09 UTC (permalink / raw) To: emacs-orgmode Rasmus <rasmus@gmx.us> writes: > BTW: Org has an almost-agnostic format for storing citation data via > org-bibtex.el. So perhaps it's easier to go from whatever to > org-bibtex-format and from there to ox-backend-format. I think that's how > pandoc does it as well. Well, that would certainly suit me, as I already store my citation data in org-bibtex format, and generate a .bib file as needed from it. I think Pandoc does something similar with YAML, either in-file or in a separate bibliography file. I do not know if the org-bibtex format will play nicely with non-BibTeX citation databases, though; can anyone speak to that? Best, Richard ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 34+ messages in thread
* Re: exporting zotxt or orgref links to HTML and ODF 2015-01-27 17:24 ` Richard Lawrence 2015-01-27 17:50 ` Rasmus @ 2015-01-27 20:01 ` Christian Moe 2015-01-27 22:08 ` Rasmus ` (2 more replies) 2015-01-28 6:37 ` Erik Hetzner 2 siblings, 3 replies; 34+ messages in thread From: Christian Moe @ 2015-01-27 20:01 UTC (permalink / raw) To: Richard Lawrence; +Cc: emacs-orgmode Richard Lawrence writes: > It looks to me like Pandoc has a quite general solution, and it also > looks like Org could use Pandoc's citation syntax as-is. I would > suggest borrowing this syntax as a starting point for building citation > support into Org. It's been years since I looked at Pandoc, and I think they've added some functionality since then. Prefix, locator, suffix, and multiple references in one human-readable citation: Great! And /much/ nicer to look at than latex \cite commands with their frankly bizarre placement of locators etc. > Blah blah [see @doe99, pp. 33-35; also @smith04, ch. 1]. In my current homebrewn solution for Zotero, I have tried to do something similarly readable using Org link syntax (sorry, Rasmus!) with the database entry ID as link target, and parsing the description part for prefix/author-date/locator/suffix, but with a slightly different syntax than Pandoc uses. In my solution the above would be: Blah blah [[zotero:0_A43F89;0_E25CB3][(see: Doe 1999: p.33-35; also: Smith 2004: ch. 1)]]. > A minus sign (-) before the @ will suppress mention of the author in the > citation. This can be useful when the author is already mentioned in the > text: > > Smith says blah [-@smith04]. In my current Zotero solution: Smith says blah [[zotero:0_E25CB3][(2004)]]. > Does anyone have citation needs that this syntax doesn't cover? It's great, as long as your database uses mnemonic citekeys like doe99. Zotero doesn't, but uses keys that are meaningless to humans, like 0_A43F89. Unfortunately [see @0_A43F89, p. 5] wouldn't look nearly as nice as [see @doe99, p.5], and it wouldn't help you remember what you referenced. I think the typical workflow combining Zotero with Pandoc is to export a BibTex file from Zotero and reference the BibTex citekeys from there. I could live with that much of the time. But that workflow doesn't help with something I often want to do, which is to export to ODT and have 'live' Zotero citations that I can continue to work with in LibreOffice. > Using this syntax would also have the advantage that Pandoc can already > parse it, which would reduce friction for Org users who convert their > documents with Pandoc (and Pandoc users who need to deal with Org > inputs). Since this seems like a significant contingent of Org users, > that's something to consider. That's a good point. OTOH, don't Org users convert their documents with Pandoc mostly because cross-backend citation support is lacking? > The bigger question is whether, in addition to a citation *syntax*, it > would be a lot of work to add support for the various citation database > formats, as well as the various output styles, and which ones to > support. Possibly more work if it's worth if we adopt Pandoc syntax, since Pandoc-citeproc seems to handle nearly everything that is based on plain text. To truly support citations natively, we'd essentially have to implement something like citeproc in elisp. Not that I haven't been thinking about that... Yours, Christian ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 34+ messages in thread
* Re: exporting zotxt or orgref links to HTML and ODF 2015-01-27 20:01 ` Christian Moe @ 2015-01-27 22:08 ` Rasmus 2015-01-27 22:15 ` John Kitchin 2015-01-28 2:10 ` Matt Price 2 siblings, 0 replies; 34+ messages in thread From: Rasmus @ 2015-01-27 22:08 UTC (permalink / raw) To: emacs-orgmode [-- Attachment #1: Type: text/plain, Size: 2006 bytes --] Hi, Christian Moe <mail@christianmoe.com> writes: >> Blah blah [see @doe99, pp. 33-35; also @smith04, ch. 1]. > > In my current homebrewn solution for Zotero, I have tried to do > something similarly readable using Org link syntax (sorry, Rasmus!) with > the database entry ID as link target, and parsing the description part > for prefix/author-date/locator/suffix, but with a slightly different > syntax than Pandoc uses. In my solution the above would be: > > Blah blah [[zotero:0_A43F89;0_E25CB3][(see: Doe 1999: p.33-35; also: > Smith 2004: ch. 1)]]. The problem is that your information can become out of sync if you are not careful, e.g.: > [[zotero:0_A43F89;0_E25CB3][(see: Doe 1999: p.33-35; also: Smith 2004: ch. 1)]] > [[zotero:0_A43F89;0_E25CB3][(see: Forbar 1999: p.33-35)]] IMO nice displays should be solved with overlays(?) like org-entities, tex-fold-mode etc. >> Does anyone have citation needs that this syntax doesn't cover? > > It's great, as long as your database uses mnemonic citekeys like > doe99. Zotero doesn't, but uses keys that are meaningless to humans, > like 0_A43F89. Unfortunately [see @0_A43F89, p. 5] wouldn't look nearly > as nice as [see @doe99, p.5], and it wouldn't help you remember what you > referenced. Selection is solved by Reftex or Zotero or whatever. Still, bad keys are an issue! One idea would be to allow file-specific pointers to citations or allow easy insertion of entries in org-bibtex format. > But that workflow doesn't help with something I often want to do, which > is to export to ODT and have 'live' Zotero citations that I can continue > to work with in LibreOffice. Are they like bib(la)tex citations? Like with click and dynamic bibliography and the like. > Possibly more work if it's worth if we adopt Pandoc syntax, > since Pandoc-citeproc seems to handle nearly everything that is based on > plain text. bibtex.el and org-bibtex.el seems rather competent. Of course, styles is an issue. Here's my notes on this topic: [-- Attachment #2: notes-on-citation.org --] [-- Type: application/vnd.lotus-organizer, Size: 5159 bytes --] [-- Attachment #3: Type: text/plain, Size: 18 bytes --] -- Bang bang ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 34+ messages in thread
* Re: exporting zotxt or orgref links to HTML and ODF 2015-01-27 20:01 ` Christian Moe 2015-01-27 22:08 ` Rasmus @ 2015-01-27 22:15 ` John Kitchin 2015-01-28 2:10 ` Matt Price 2 siblings, 0 replies; 34+ messages in thread From: John Kitchin @ 2015-01-27 22:15 UTC (permalink / raw) To: Christian Moe; +Cc: Richard Lawrence, emacs-orgmode Christian Moe writes: > Richard Lawrence writes: > >> It looks to me like Pandoc has a quite general solution, and it also >> looks like Org could use Pandoc's citation syntax as-is. I would >> suggest borrowing this syntax as a starting point for building citation >> support into Org. > > It's been years since I looked at Pandoc, and I think they've added some > functionality since then. Prefix, locator, suffix, and multiple > references in one human-readable citation: Great! And /much/ nicer to > look at than latex \cite commands with their frankly bizarre placement > of locators etc. > >> Blah blah [see @doe99, pp. 33-35; also @smith04, ch. 1]. > > In my current homebrewn solution for Zotero, I have tried to do > something similarly readable using Org link syntax (sorry, Rasmus!) with > the database entry ID as link target, and parsing the description part > for prefix/author-date/locator/suffix, but with a slightly different > syntax than Pandoc uses. In my solution the above would be: > > Blah blah [[zotero:0_A43F89;0_E25CB3][(see: Doe 1999: p.33-35; also: > Smith 2004: ch. 1)]]. > >> A minus sign (-) before the @ will suppress mention of the author in the >> citation. This can be useful when the author is already mentioned in the >> text: >> >> Smith says blah [-@smith04]. > > In my current Zotero solution: > > Smith says blah [[zotero:0_E25CB3][(2004)]]. > >> Does anyone have citation needs that this syntax doesn't cover? > > It's great, as long as your database uses mnemonic citekeys like > doe99. Zotero doesn't, but uses keys that are meaningless to humans, > like 0_A43F89. Unfortunately [see @0_A43F89, p. 5] wouldn't look nearly > as nice as [see @doe99, p.5], and it wouldn't help you remember what you > referenced. This doesn't have to be case. Even bibtex keys are not mnemonic enough in my opinion (maybe it is fairer to put the limitation on what I can remember though ;) I recently implemented a neat idea in org-ref that will show you the full citation in the minibuffer when your cursor is idle over a cite link. See https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8cEb6F9AEu0 to see it in action. I played around with many variations of tool tips, etc... and settled on the minibuffer as the lightest weight, least disruptive flow. On the other hand, if the concern about mnemonic is remembering what to type in, then you should consider using a completion tool. org-ref has completion by key (which I do not use because I do not remember keys), but also key selection through either reftex or helm-bibtex. It is surprisingly easy to make a helm selection buffer. All you need is a way to get the possible candidates from zotero, e.g. by parsing the entries to get a list of (description . zotero-key) for each entry. description is what you see in helm to narrow, and zotero-key is what is sent to an action function that takes care of formatting and inserting the keys. > > I think the typical workflow combining Zotero with Pandoc is to export a > BibTex file from Zotero and reference the BibTex citekeys from > there. I could live with that much of the time. > > But that workflow doesn't help with something I often want to do, which > is to export to ODT and have 'live' Zotero citations that I can continue > to work with in LibreOffice. I don't do this often, but if you know what the zotero citation format in odt is, I think you could get org to export it for that backend. > >> Using this syntax would also have the advantage that Pandoc can already >> parse it, which would reduce friction for Org users who convert their >> documents with Pandoc (and Pandoc users who need to deal with Org >> inputs). Since this seems like a significant contingent of Org users, >> that's something to consider. > > That's a good point. OTOH, don't Org users convert their documents with > Pandoc mostly because cross-backend citation support is lacking? > >> The bigger question is whether, in addition to a citation *syntax*, it >> would be a lot of work to add support for the various citation database >> formats, as well as the various output styles, and which ones to >> support. > > Possibly more work if it's worth if we adopt Pandoc syntax, > since Pandoc-citeproc seems to handle nearly everything that is based on > plain text. > > To truly support citations natively, we'd essentially have to implement > something like citeproc in elisp. Not that I haven't been thinking about > that... > > Yours, > Christian -- Professor John Kitchin Doherty Hall A207F Department of Chemical Engineering Carnegie Mellon University Pittsburgh, PA 15213 412-268-7803 @johnkitchin http://kitchingroup.cheme.cmu.edu ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 34+ messages in thread
* Re: exporting zotxt or orgref links to HTML and ODF 2015-01-27 20:01 ` Christian Moe 2015-01-27 22:08 ` Rasmus 2015-01-27 22:15 ` John Kitchin @ 2015-01-28 2:10 ` Matt Price 2 siblings, 0 replies; 34+ messages in thread From: Matt Price @ 2015-01-28 2:10 UTC (permalink / raw) To: Christian Moe, Org Mode [-- Attachment #1: Type: text/plain, Size: 3977 bytes --] I am very eager to see this work of yours, Christian. I also would very much like to find a way to have a single, well-supported citation framework in org -- I certainly think John's work looks incredible, and zotxt is very powerful, but it would be fantastic if one could just choose a bibliographic backend and export seamlessly to any supported format. It would be a big step forward. I guess I don't quite see, yet, what has to happen for the work of various contributors to be consolidated; clearly Erik, You, and John have worked in overlapping and distinct directions, but I would be veyr enthusiastic about helping a unified approach emerge, espeically one that supported Zotero. Thanks everyone, Matt On Tue, Jan 27, 2015 at 3:01 PM, Christian Moe <mail@christianmoe.com> wrote: > > Richard Lawrence writes: > > > It looks to me like Pandoc has a quite general solution, and it also > > looks like Org could use Pandoc's citation syntax as-is. I would > > suggest borrowing this syntax as a starting point for building citation > > support into Org. > > It's been years since I looked at Pandoc, and I think they've added some > functionality since then. Prefix, locator, suffix, and multiple > references in one human-readable citation: Great! And /much/ nicer to > look at than latex \cite commands with their frankly bizarre placement > of locators etc. > > > Blah blah [see @doe99, pp. 33-35; also @smith04, ch. 1]. > > In my current homebrewn solution for Zotero, I have tried to do > something similarly readable using Org link syntax (sorry, Rasmus!) with > the database entry ID as link target, and parsing the description part > for prefix/author-date/locator/suffix, but with a slightly different > syntax than Pandoc uses. In my solution the above would be: > > Blah blah [[zotero:0_A43F89;0_E25CB3][(see: Doe 1999: p.33-35; also: > Smith 2004: ch. 1)]]. > > > A minus sign (-) before the @ will suppress mention of the author in the > > citation. This can be useful when the author is already mentioned in the > > text: > > > > Smith says blah [-@smith04]. > > In my current Zotero solution: > > Smith says blah [[zotero:0_E25CB3][(2004)]]. > > > Does anyone have citation needs that this syntax doesn't cover? > > It's great, as long as your database uses mnemonic citekeys like > doe99. Zotero doesn't, but uses keys that are meaningless to humans, > like 0_A43F89. Unfortunately [see @0_A43F89, p. 5] wouldn't look nearly > as nice as [see @doe99, p.5], and it wouldn't help you remember what you > referenced. > > I think the typical workflow combining Zotero with Pandoc is to export a > BibTex file from Zotero and reference the BibTex citekeys from > there. I could live with that much of the time. > > But that workflow doesn't help with something I often want to do, which > is to export to ODT and have 'live' Zotero citations that I can continue > to work with in LibreOffice. > > > Using this syntax would also have the advantage that Pandoc can already > > parse it, which would reduce friction for Org users who convert their > > documents with Pandoc (and Pandoc users who need to deal with Org > > inputs). Since this seems like a significant contingent of Org users, > > that's something to consider. > > That's a good point. OTOH, don't Org users convert their documents with > Pandoc mostly because cross-backend citation support is lacking? > > > The bigger question is whether, in addition to a citation *syntax*, it > > would be a lot of work to add support for the various citation database > > formats, as well as the various output styles, and which ones to > > support. > > Possibly more work if it's worth if we adopt Pandoc syntax, > since Pandoc-citeproc seems to handle nearly everything that is based on > plain text. > > To truly support citations natively, we'd essentially have to implement > something like citeproc in elisp. Not that I haven't been thinking about > that... > > Yours, > Christian > > > > > > > [-- Attachment #2: Type: text/html, Size: 4837 bytes --] ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 34+ messages in thread
* Re: exporting zotxt or orgref links to HTML and ODF 2015-01-27 17:24 ` Richard Lawrence 2015-01-27 17:50 ` Rasmus 2015-01-27 20:01 ` Christian Moe @ 2015-01-28 6:37 ` Erik Hetzner 2015-02-01 4:20 ` Erik Hetzner 2 siblings, 1 reply; 34+ messages in thread From: Erik Hetzner @ 2015-01-28 6:37 UTC (permalink / raw) To: emacs-orgmode; +Cc: Richard Lawrence On Tue, 27 Jan 2015 at 09:24:00 PST, Richard Lawrence <richard.lawrence@berkeley.edu> wrote: > > > Although my home-baked solution presently works for me, I am inclined to > agree. > > I've just had a glance at: http://pandoc.org/README.html#citations > > It looks to me like Pandoc has a quite general solution, and it also > looks like Org could use Pandoc's citation syntax as-is. I would > suggest borrowing this syntax as a starting point for building citation > support into Org. Hi all, I agree completely. For what it’s worth, using pandoc citations now will work right now if you output to markdown and then parse in pandoc. e.g. [see @doe:2006article, p. 10] will work. I wrote a parser for pandoc citations (that assumes you start with a citation string, that is, it doesn’t work unless you have extracted the citation string from the document): https://bitbucket.org/egh/zot4rst/src/master/xciterst/parser.py but it doesn’t seem that org-element.el uses a grammar, so I’m not sure how much that would help. There is also, of course, the pandoc parser. best, Erik -- Sent from my free software system <http://fsf.org/>. ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 34+ messages in thread
* Re: exporting zotxt or orgref links to HTML and ODF 2015-01-28 6:37 ` Erik Hetzner @ 2015-02-01 4:20 ` Erik Hetzner 0 siblings, 0 replies; 34+ messages in thread From: Erik Hetzner @ 2015-02-01 4:20 UTC (permalink / raw) To: emacs-orgmode On Tue, 27 Jan 2015 at 22:37:20 PST, Erik Hetzner <egh@e6h.org> wrote: > > […] > > I wrote a parser for pandoc citations (that assumes you start with a > citation string, that is, it doesn’t work unless you have extracted > the citation string from the document): > > https://bitbucket.org/egh/zot4rst/src/master/xciterst/parser.py > > but it doesn’t seem that org-element.el uses a grammar, so I’m not > sure how much that would help. There is also, of course, the pandoc > parser. I have started porting this parser to elisp. So far it can’t parse much, but it shouldn’t be too hard to finish. https://gitlab.com/egh/org-pdcite This includes parser combinator functionality for elisp. best, Erik -- Sent from my free software system <http://fsf.org/>. ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 34+ messages in thread
* Re: exporting zotxt or orgref links to HTML and ODF 2015-01-26 16:29 Matt Price ` (2 preceding siblings ...) 2015-01-27 9:23 ` Christian Moe @ 2015-01-27 12:01 ` Vikas Rawal 2015-01-27 13:12 ` Matt Price 2015-01-27 13:31 ` Albert Krewinkel [not found] ` <m2vbjsvay0.fsf@christianmoe.com> 4 siblings, 2 replies; 34+ messages in thread From: Vikas Rawal @ 2015-01-27 12:01 UTC (permalink / raw) To: Matt Price; +Cc: org-mode mailing list > > My question: does anyone yet have a workflow that lets them export directly to HTML or ODT? In my experience, exporting from Org to LateX, and then using pandoc to convert to odt works better than converting directly from Org to odt. This is particularly the case if you are using citations. Of course, I use Bibtex but you may want to see Zotero support in Pandoc. Vikas ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 34+ messages in thread
* Re: exporting zotxt or orgref links to HTML and ODF 2015-01-27 12:01 ` Vikas Rawal @ 2015-01-27 13:12 ` Matt Price 2015-01-27 14:28 ` Eric S Fraga 2015-01-27 13:31 ` Albert Krewinkel 1 sibling, 1 reply; 34+ messages in thread From: Matt Price @ 2015-01-27 13:12 UTC (permalink / raw) To: Vikas Rawal, Org Mode [-- Attachment #1: Type: text/plain, Size: 781 bytes --] For me, the main issue with this route is that I don't understand LaTex at all, and it seems like there's a bit of a steep learning curve to get to a working set up. Maybe someone can recommend a good guide for starting out in LaTex? It does seem like somehting one should learn, I suppose. On Tue, Jan 27, 2015 at 7:01 AM, Vikas Rawal < vikaslists@agrarianresearch.org> wrote: > > > > My question: does anyone yet have a workflow that lets them export > directly to HTML or ODT? > > > In my experience, exporting from Org to LateX, and then using pandoc to > convert to odt works better than converting directly from Org to odt. This > is particularly the case if you are using citations. Of course, I use > Bibtex but you may want to see Zotero support in Pandoc. > > Vikas [-- Attachment #2: Type: text/html, Size: 1201 bytes --] ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 34+ messages in thread
* Re: exporting zotxt or orgref links to HTML and ODF 2015-01-27 13:12 ` Matt Price @ 2015-01-27 14:28 ` Eric S Fraga 0 siblings, 0 replies; 34+ messages in thread From: Eric S Fraga @ 2015-01-27 14:28 UTC (permalink / raw) To: Matt Price; +Cc: Org Mode On Tuesday, 27 Jan 2015 at 08:12, Matt Price wrote: > For me, the main issue with this route is that I don't understand LaTex at > all, and it seems like there's a bit of a steep learning curve to get to a > working set up. Maybe someone can recommend a good guide for starting out > in LaTex? It does seem like somehting one should learn, I suppose. There are many tutorials on the web. A simple "latex tutorial" web search brings back many links. I can send you a couple of PDF documents off-list, if you wish, of documents I have used in the past. The original text by Leslie Lamport is also a very good starting point. I do wonder, however, how much you need to know if you are using org. In fact, you can probably learn a lot by looking at the LaTeX that org produces... and many of us are happy to help with the odd org-LaTeX issues that can arise! -- : Eric S Fraga (0xFFFCF67D), Emacs 25.0.50.1, Org release_8.3beta-726-gd34b80.dirty ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 34+ messages in thread
* Re: exporting zotxt or orgref links to HTML and ODF 2015-01-27 12:01 ` Vikas Rawal 2015-01-27 13:12 ` Matt Price @ 2015-01-27 13:31 ` Albert Krewinkel 1 sibling, 0 replies; 34+ messages in thread From: Albert Krewinkel @ 2015-01-27 13:31 UTC (permalink / raw) To: Vikas Rawal; +Cc: org-mode mailing list Vikas Rawal <vikaslists@agrarianresearch.org> writes: >> My question: does anyone yet have a workflow that lets them export directly to HTML or ODT? > > In my experience, exporting from Org to LateX, and then using pandoc to > convert to odt works better than converting directly from Org to odt. Being one of the authors of pandocs org-mode reader, I'm very interested in learning the issues you experienced when converting directly to odt. Could you give some feedback on that? Thanks in advance, Albert -- Albert Krewinkel GPG: 8eed e3e2 e8c5 6f18 81fe e836 388d c0b2 1f63 1124 ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 34+ messages in thread
[parent not found: <m2vbjsvay0.fsf@christianmoe.com>]
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* Re: exporting zotxt or orgref links to HTML and ODF [not found] ` <CAN_Dec9qBWWWgdX+wQhdgbthMg_ZOgbOMFoXFixSc4=74avMjw@mail.gmail.com> @ 2015-01-27 14:41 ` Christian Moe 0 siblings, 0 replies; 34+ messages in thread From: Christian Moe @ 2015-01-27 14:41 UTC (permalink / raw) To: Matt Price; +Cc: orgmode list Well, color me embarrassed. I never even noticed the switch to zotxt. And I never tried with Standalone either. Just tinkered happily away with Eric's excellent old solution and Firefox. Maybe I should check out both before posting an obsolute solution with unnecessary dependencies... Will report back in a little while. Yours, Christian Matt Price writes: > Christian, > > I would love to see this. I am using Erik's rewritten > zotero-plain/org-zotero (zotxt-emacs); it works fine with > zotero-standalone, so MozRepl not required, I don't think. I'm not sure if > the link syntax is still the same as in the original versions. > > So yes, please do send the code if you are willing. If you have hints > about the more ambitious citation system, I and I'm sure others would love > to see them. > > thanks, > Matt > > > On Tue, Jan 27, 2015 at 4:18 AM, Christian Moe <mail@christianmoe.com> > wrote: > >> >> Matt Price writes: >> >> > My question: does anyone yet have a workflow that lets them export >> directly >> > to HTML or ODT? >> >> Hi, Matt, >> >> Yes, now I have not just a workflow, but a code solution for >> Org/Zotero/ODT export that has been tried and tested for a while. It now >> supports multiple references in one citation, prefixes, suffixes, >> locators, and year-only citations, and produces 'live' Zotero refmarks >> in ODT, so you can do all the changes you want in LibreOffice >> afterward. It also does some very limited but useful things for html >> (DOI links and links that will work on Wordpress blogs with Katie >> Seaborn's ZotPress extension). >> >> It depends on Eric Hetzner's excellent zotero-plain and org-zotero >> packages, and hence on the MozRepl extension on the Firefox side, though >> you can use the ODT export functionality itself without those >> dependencies. >> >> I haven't yet announced it on the list, for three reasons. 1) Not very >> polished. There's some messy code, a poor man's user interface, and no >> editing support for multiple citations (but support for exporting >> them!). 2) It's part of a more ambitious project I set myself for an >> all-round citation system that I never got on with. 3) It uses this cool >> idea I had for how to use citation links differently, but it imposes >> certain syntax conventions on the user, and they may yet change in >> backward-incompatible ways if I develop this further. >> >> If this sounds interesting, I can post the code here 'as is' for you to >> try out, but I'd better update the docs first, which could take a day or >> two. >> >> Yours, >> Christian >> >> >> > I've just tried using zotxt again ( >> > https://bitbucket.org/egh/zotxt-emacs/overview -- first time in a >> while); >> > it is remarkably easy to use in Org itself. By default, though, the >> links >> > simply aren't handled in the HTML and ODT exports, and so the cites will >> be >> > completely absent. >> > >> > Here is the text inserted by zotxt for a single citation: >> > >> > ---------------- >> > >> > [[zotero://select/items/0_TI27HJ5I][Suchman, Lucy. “Subject Objects.” >> > Feminist Theory 12, no. 2 (August 1, 2011): 119–45. >> > >> http://resolver.scholarsportal.info/resolve/14647001/v12i0002/119_so.xml. >> ]] >> > --------------- >> > >> > In HTML, I would like to replace this with something like this: >> > >> > (<a href="#BibSuchman2011">Suchman 2011</a>) >> > >> > and then have Org generate a bibligraphy somewhere, a bit like org-ref >> > seems to do, It would be nice if I could steal the styles from somehwere, >> > the way org-ref seems to do. >> > >> > For ODT< it seems a little more complicated. Here is the rather lengthy >> > equivalent that Zotero itself produces for my default style (Chicago) in >> > Libreoffice: >> > --------------- >> > <text:note text:id="ftn0" >> > >> text:note-class="footnote"><text:note-citation>1</text:note-citation><text:note-body><text:p >> > text:style-name="Footnote"><text:reference-mark-start >> > text:name="ZOTERO_ITEM CSL_CITATION >> > >> {"citationID":"5xzXuF2I","properties":{"formattedCitation":"{\\rtf >> > Lucy Suchman, \\uc0\\u8220{}Subject Objects,\\uc0\\u8221{} \\i Feminist >> > Theory\\i0{} 12, no. 2 (August 1, 2011): 119\\uc0\\u8211{}45, >> > >> http://resolver.scholarsportal.info/resolve/14647001/v12i0002/119_so.xml.}" >> ;,"plainCitation":"Lucy >> > Suchman, “Subject Objects,” Feminist Theory 12, no. 2 (August 1, 2011): >> > 119–45, >> > >> http://resolver.scholarsportal.info/resolve/14647001/v12i0002/119_so.xml." >> ; >> > },"citationItems":[{"id":149,"uris":[" >> > http://zotero.org/users/20/items/TI27HJ5I"],"uri":[" >> > http://zotero.org/users/20/items/TI27HJ5I" >> ],"itemData":{"id":149,"type":"article-journal","title":"Subject >> > objects","container-title":"Feminist >> > >> Theory","page":"119-145","volume":"12","issue":"2","URL":" >> > >> http://resolver.scholarsportal.info/resolve/14647001/v12i0002/119_so.xml" >> > >> ;,"ISSN":"14647001","author":[{"family":"Suchman","given":"Lucy"}],"issued":{"date-parts":[["2011",8,1]]}}}],"schema":" >> > >> https://github.com/citation-style-language/schema/raw/master/csl-citation.json" >> ;} >> > RNDuhNYYpC1hN"/><text:span text:style-name="T3">Lucy Suchman, “Subject >> > Objects,” </text:span><text:span text:style-name="T4">Feminist >> > Theory</text:span><text:span text:style-name="T5"> 12, no. 2 (August 1, >> > 2011): 119–45, >> > http://resolver.scholarsportal.info/resolve/14647001/v12i0002/119_so.xml >> .</text:span><text:reference-mark-end >> > text:name="ZOTERO_ITEM CSL_CITATION >> > >> {"citationID":"5xzXuF2I","properties":{"formattedCitation":"{\\rtf >> > Lucy Suchman, \\uc0\\u8220{}Subject Objects,\\uc0\\u8221{} \\i Feminist >> > Theory\\i0{} 12, no. 2 (August 1, 2011): 119\\uc0\\u8211{}45, >> > >> http://resolver.scholarsportal.info/resolve/14647001/v12i0002/119_so.xml.}" >> ;,"plainCitation":"Lucy >> > Suchman, “Subject Objects,” Feminist Theory 12, no. 2 (August 1, 2011): >> > 119–45, >> > >> http://resolver.scholarsportal.info/resolve/14647001/v12i0002/119_so.xml." >> ; >> > },"citationItems":[{"id":149,"uris":[" >> > http://zotero.org/users/20/items/TI27HJ5I"],"uri":[" >> > http://zotero.org/users/20/items/TI27HJ5I" >> ],"itemData":{"id":149,"type":"article-journal","title":"Subject >> > objects","container-title":"Feminist >> > >> Theory","page":"119-145","volume":"12","issue":"2","URL":" >> > >> http://resolver.scholarsportal.info/resolve/14647001/v12i0002/119_so.xml" >> > >> ;,"ISSN":"14647001","author":[{"family":"Suchman","given":"Lucy"}],"issued":{"date-parts":[["2011",8,1]]}}}],"schema":" >> > >> https://github.com/citation-style-language/schema/raw/master/csl-citation.json" >> ;} >> > RNDuhNYYpC1hN"/></text:p></text:note-body></text:note> >> > ------------------------------ >> > >> > I'm not sure what the best way to do this is; it may be that zotxt could >> be >> > extended to get zotero to do the heavy lifting here. >> > >> > I know Erik H reads this list, so if you have any suggestions, Erik, I >> > would love to hear them. But maybe other people also have suggestions >> > about modifying export filters - -that would also be really helpful for >> > me. Thanks as always, >> > >> > Matt >> >> ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 34+ messages in thread
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Thread overview: 34+ messages (download: mbox.gz / follow: Atom feed)
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[not found] <CAMfbzvA83eSWe79Ot=yX+_s_g33gpLnP-z+zQ52QFJm+iJTR+Q@mail.gmail.com>
2015-01-28 21:53 ` exporting zotxt or orgref links to HTML and ODF Matt Price
2015-01-28 23:01 ` John Kitchin
2015-01-29 1:34 ` Matt Price
2015-01-29 1:48 ` John Kitchin
[not found] ` <CAN_Dec80Su+5Nh5mqNxBXsLu_gm93aY77B=2Zrce-TJ1RPKCig@mail.gmail.com>
2015-01-29 13:06 ` John Kitchin
2015-01-29 13:11 ` Vikas Rawal
2015-01-29 13:24 ` John Kitchin
2015-01-29 13:39 ` Vikas Rawal
2015-01-29 13:09 ` John Kitchin
2015-01-29 2:26 ` Vikas Rawal
2015-01-26 16:29 Matt Price
[not found] ` <54C67E1A.8080706@law.lsu.edu>
2015-01-26 20:40 ` Matt Price
2015-01-26 21:53 ` Monroe, Will
2015-01-27 8:25 ` Eric S Fraga
2015-01-27 9:23 ` Christian Moe
2015-01-27 13:30 ` Rasmus
2015-01-27 13:51 ` Matt Price
2015-01-27 14:14 ` Rasmus
2015-01-27 18:17 ` John Kitchin
2015-01-27 15:24 ` Christian Moe
2015-01-27 17:24 ` Richard Lawrence
2015-01-27 17:50 ` Rasmus
2015-01-28 4:09 ` Richard Lawrence
2015-01-27 20:01 ` Christian Moe
2015-01-27 22:08 ` Rasmus
2015-01-27 22:15 ` John Kitchin
2015-01-28 2:10 ` Matt Price
2015-01-28 6:37 ` Erik Hetzner
2015-02-01 4:20 ` Erik Hetzner
2015-01-27 12:01 ` Vikas Rawal
2015-01-27 13:12 ` Matt Price
2015-01-27 14:28 ` Eric S Fraga
2015-01-27 13:31 ` Albert Krewinkel
[not found] ` <m2vbjsvay0.fsf@christianmoe.com>
[not found] ` <CAN_Dec9qBWWWgdX+wQhdgbthMg_ZOgbOMFoXFixSc4=74avMjw@mail.gmail.com>
2015-01-27 14:41 ` Christian Moe
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