* Re: [off-topic] E-readers and Org-Mode
@ 2022-10-25 14:44 Payas Relekar
0 siblings, 0 replies; 28+ messages in thread
From: Payas Relekar @ 2022-10-25 14:44 UTC (permalink / raw)
To: Max Nikulin; +Cc: emacs-orgmode
Max Nikulin <manikulin@gmail.com> writes:
> E-ink displays are slow (my device was manufactured 15 years ago but I do not
> expect dramatic improvement), so applications should be heavily optimized to
> provide acceptable experience. I do not think that Emacs is suitable.
There are people already using Emacs on e-ink displays, and from first
look its quite useful.
See https://twitter.com/ianthehenry/status/1481376985129500679?lang=en
Unsure on use for extended duration, I'll have to try out myself once
one is actually available in my country, but I'm liking the idea.
--
^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 28+ messages in thread
* Re: [off-topic] E-readers and Org-Mode
@ 2022-10-24 7:12 Pedro Andres Aranda Gutierrez
2022-10-24 14:11 ` Juan Manuel Macías
0 siblings, 1 reply; 28+ messages in thread
From: Pedro Andres Aranda Gutierrez @ 2022-10-24 7:12 UTC (permalink / raw)
To: maciaschain; +Cc: Org Mode List
[-- Attachment #1: Type: text/plain, Size: 555 bytes --]
Hi Juan Manuel
My workflow is to create an HTML from the org file(s) and then generate an
EPUB2 file forthe reader (in my case Kobo or Cervantes Light) I have always
felt the rendition is much more confortable than PDF. Other readers may be
better suited for PDF.
Just my experience,
/Pedro A. Aranda
--
Fragen sind nicht da um beantwortet zu werden,
Fragen sind da um gestellt zu werden
Georg Kreisler
Headaches with a Juju log:
unit-basic-16: 09:17:36 WARNING juju.worker.uniter.operation we should run
a leader-deposed hook here, but we can't yet
[-- Attachment #2: Type: text/html, Size: 872 bytes --]
^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 28+ messages in thread
* [off-topic] E-readers and Org-Mode
@ 2022-10-23 16:29 Ypo
0 siblings, 0 replies; 28+ messages in thread
From: Ypo @ 2022-10-23 16:29 UTC (permalink / raw)
To: maciaschain, Org-mode
[-- Attachment #1: Type: text/plain, Size: 726 bytes --]
Probably an offtopic for your offtopic, but:
I use my phone to read e-books:
- AMOLED screen (black color doesn't emit light).
- low level of brightness (so I can read in the night without "losing"
melatonin). Usually e-book reading app gives you this option.
- the PDF reading app must have reflowing of the text, so you can choose
the size and font you like.
- no blue colors (ie yellow "face" with a black background). Not sure
about its effect, but everywhere I read about blue filters. 8-)
Orgzly I use to capture ideas; and other tasks related with
auto-organization (GTD). Of course, the .org files are sync with my
computer.
For reading org-mode documents on mobile, I haven't found the perfect app.
[-- Attachment #2: Type: text/html, Size: 1729 bytes --]
^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 28+ messages in thread
* [off-topic] E-readers and Org-Mode
@ 2022-10-23 15:16 Juan Manuel Macías
2022-10-24 7:09 ` Fraga, Eric
` (2 more replies)
0 siblings, 3 replies; 28+ messages in thread
From: Juan Manuel Macías @ 2022-10-23 15:16 UTC (permalink / raw)
To: orgmode
Hi all,
As I am beginning to have serious eye fatigue problems, I am thinking of
buying an e-ink device, not to read books but to read documents. My idea
is that it be an Android device and that it supports the installation of
apk, to be able to install Termux/Emacs/Org-Mode and Nextcloud to sync
with my desktop PC or my laptop. I'd like to explore a workflow where I
could read PDFs on the device (and probably also text-only web pages
with eww) and also take Org Mode notes.
I wonder if anyone has tried something similar, if there is anything
written about it somewhere or if it is completely uncharted territory.
Best regards,
Juan Manuel
^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 28+ messages in thread* Re: [off-topic] E-readers and Org-Mode
2022-10-23 15:16 Juan Manuel Macías
@ 2022-10-24 7:09 ` Fraga, Eric
2022-10-24 11:50 ` Juan Manuel Macías
2022-10-24 16:42 ` Jeffrey DeLeo
2022-10-25 14:37 ` Max Nikulin
2 siblings, 1 reply; 28+ messages in thread
From: Fraga, Eric @ 2022-10-24 7:09 UTC (permalink / raw)
To: Juan Manuel Macías; +Cc: orgmode
Dear Juan Manuel,
On Sunday, 23 Oct 2022 at 15:16, Juan Manuel Macías wrote:
> Hi all,
>
> As I am beginning to have serious eye fatigue problems, I am thinking of
> buying an e-ink device, not to read books but to read documents.
> My idea is that it be an Android device and that it supports the
> installation of apk, to be able to install Termux/Emacs/Org-Mode and
> Nextcloud to sync with my desktop PC or my laptop. I'd like to explore
> a workflow where I could read PDFs on the device (and probably also
> text-only web pages with eww) and also take Org Mode notes.
Putting aside the org mode aspect for the moment, I highly recommend the
reMarkable [1] tablet for reading PDF documents. I have owned one for
several years now and use it all the time (in particular for reading 300
pages theses on the train...). I do not use org mode on it, however.
For Emacs, some people have hacked the reMarkable. I have not tried any
of the hacks but the Parabola initiative [2] seems the most advanced.
HTH,
eric
Footnotes:
[1] https://remarkable.com/
[2] http://www.davisr.me/projects/parabola-rm/,
--
: Eric S Fraga, with org release_9.5.5-966-g88c85d in Emacs 29.0.50
^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 28+ messages in thread
* Re: [off-topic] E-readers and Org-Mode
2022-10-24 7:09 ` Fraga, Eric
@ 2022-10-24 11:50 ` Juan Manuel Macías
2022-10-24 15:30 ` Fraga, Eric
0 siblings, 1 reply; 28+ messages in thread
From: Juan Manuel Macías @ 2022-10-24 11:50 UTC (permalink / raw)
To: Org Mode List
Hi, Eric,
Fraga, Eric writes:
> Putting aside the org mode aspect for the moment, I highly recommend the
> reMarkable [1] tablet for reading PDF documents. I have owned one for
> several years now and use it all the time (in particular for reading 300
> pages theses on the train...). I do not use org mode on it, however.
>
> For Emacs, some people have hacked the reMarkable. I have not tried any
> of the hacks but the Parabola initiative [2] seems the most advanced.
>
> HTH,
> eric
>
> Footnotes:
> [1] https://remarkable.com/
>
> [2] http://www.davisr.me/projects/parabola-rm/,
Thanks a lot for the pointers. I didn't know about it, but something
like reMarkable is what I'm looking for, a device that serves as a
substitute for printed paper in A4 and reading on a desktop screen. The
Parabola hack looks pretty cool (that's supposed to be equivalent to
being able to use Emacs with pdf-tools package). I have seen that the
Wi-Fi does not work (it is not essential for me) but the OTG does. I
will investigate about it... In that device line I had also seen the
Onyx Boox Note. But recently I read that this brand has a sad history of
violating the Linux kernel GPL license.
N.B.: I have to say that I have never used an e-ink device. The
''closest'' thing is this hack I wrote, for use especially on my old
Thinkpad in high light environments. It uses Picom compositor and
Redshift. And, after messing around with the parameters a lot, I found
these that I'm quite satisfied with. It also helps to apply a monochrome
theme in Emacs. Of course, it is nothing more than a simulation to try
to reduce the light emission as much as possible:
#+begin_src emacs-lisp
(setq picom-command "picom --backend glx --glx-fshader-win \"uniform sampler2D tex; uniform float opacity; void main() { vec4 color = texture2D(tex, gl_TexCoord[0].xy); gl_FragColor = vec4(vec3(0.2126 * color.r + 0.7152 * color.g + 0.0722 * color.b) * opacity, color.a * opacity); }\"")
(setq redshift-command "redshift -l 40.5914000:-4.1474000 -b 0.9:0.9 -t 4000k:4000k -g 0.5:0.5:0.8")
(defun my-poor-man-eink-toggle ()
(interactive)
(when (equal (process-status "picom") 'run)
(kill-process "picom"))
(if (and (not (equal (process-status "picom-g") 'run))
(not (equal (process-status "redshifg-g") 'run)))
(progn
(shell-command "killall picom")
(shell-command "killall redshift-gtk")
(shell-command "redshift -x")
(start-process-shell-command "redshift-g" nil redshift-command)
(start-process-shell-command "picom-g" nil picom-command))
(kill-process "picom-g")
(kill-process "redshift-g")
(shell-command "redshift -x")
(start-process-shell-command "redshift" nil "redshift-gtk -c ~/.redshift.conf")))
#+end_src
^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 28+ messages in thread* Re: [off-topic] E-readers and Org-Mode
2022-10-24 11:50 ` Juan Manuel Macías
@ 2022-10-24 15:30 ` Fraga, Eric
0 siblings, 0 replies; 28+ messages in thread
From: Fraga, Eric @ 2022-10-24 15:30 UTC (permalink / raw)
To: Juan Manuel Macías; +Cc: Org Mode List
On Monday, 24 Oct 2022 at 11:50, Juan Manuel Macías wrote:
> The Parabola hack looks pretty cool (that's supposed to be equivalent
> to being able to use Emacs with pdf-tools package).
Be aware (as I wasn't when I answered your previous post) that Parabola
is not free in the $ sense although the author claims it is free in the
libre sense.
--
: Eric S Fraga, with org release_9.5.5-966-g88c85d in Emacs 29.0.50
^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 28+ messages in thread
* Re: [off-topic] E-readers and Org-Mode
2022-10-23 15:16 Juan Manuel Macías
2022-10-24 7:09 ` Fraga, Eric
@ 2022-10-24 16:42 ` Jeffrey DeLeo
2022-10-24 17:16 ` Fraga, Eric
2022-10-25 11:06 ` Eduardo Suarez-Santana
2022-10-25 14:37 ` Max Nikulin
2 siblings, 2 replies; 28+ messages in thread
From: Jeffrey DeLeo @ 2022-10-24 16:42 UTC (permalink / raw)
To: emacs-orgmode
I am very happy with my Kobo Elipsa
(https://us.kobobooks.com/products/kobo-elipsa).
I use the following flow very often:
+ Place a PDF in dropbox folder, sync to Elipsa
+ Read on Elipsa, annotate in various ways
+ Sync back to dropbox.
+ Look at PDF on my desktop computer (linux), annotations visible.
I use okular to read PDF on linux.
^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 28+ messages in thread
* Re: [off-topic] E-readers and Org-Mode
2022-10-24 16:42 ` Jeffrey DeLeo
@ 2022-10-24 17:16 ` Fraga, Eric
2022-10-24 18:34 ` Juan Manuel Macías
2022-10-25 11:06 ` Eduardo Suarez-Santana
1 sibling, 1 reply; 28+ messages in thread
From: Fraga, Eric @ 2022-10-24 17:16 UTC (permalink / raw)
To: Jeffrey DeLeo; +Cc: emacs-orgmode@gnu.org
On Monday, 24 Oct 2022 at 17:42, Jeffrey DeLeo wrote:
> I am very happy with my Kobo Elipsa
Your workflow is very similar to that of mine on the reMarkable and the
two units are similar in size etc. It's a workflow that is fine for
annotating documents (which is what I want) but definitely no link to
org mode for the OP... ;-)
--
: Eric S Fraga, with org release_9.5.5-1023-g48b237 in Emacs 29.0.50
^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 28+ messages in thread
* Re: [off-topic] E-readers and Org-Mode
2022-10-24 17:16 ` Fraga, Eric
@ 2022-10-24 18:34 ` Juan Manuel Macías
2022-10-25 7:57 ` Fraga, Eric
2022-10-29 9:03 ` Juan Manuel Macías
0 siblings, 2 replies; 28+ messages in thread
From: Juan Manuel Macías @ 2022-10-24 18:34 UTC (permalink / raw)
To: Fraga, Eric; +Cc: Jeffrey DeLeo, orgmode
Fraga, Eric writes:
> On Monday, 24 Oct 2022 at 17:42, Jeffrey DeLeo wrote:
>> I am very happy with my Kobo Elipsa
>
> Your workflow is very similar to that of mine on the reMarkable and the
> two units are similar in size etc. It's a workflow that is fine for
> annotating documents (which is what I want) but definitely no link to
> org mode for the OP... ;-)
Indeed. Both Kobo Elipsa and reMarkable are very tempting and in a
similar price range. The main problem I find is that they both also run
closed and, presumably, proprietary software. I don't know if my
knowledge (and my time) would be enough to try to hack them. And I
imagine that I would run the risk of ending up bricking the gadget.
The annotations by hand with the stylus are difficult to translate to
Org :-) but in any case they are tremendously useful and save
considerable paper and ink.
I wonder if these devices are capable of exporting normal annotations in
plain text or xml? Anyway, I think it would be possible to write some
python script[1] to extract the annotations and then parse the resulting
xml from there to get a nice and beautiful Org document. Which also
leads me to wonder if anyone has tried that. I think it's a good
entertainment for a vacation...
[1] https://stackoverflow.com/questions/1106098/parse-annotations-from-a-pdf
^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 28+ messages in thread
* Re: [off-topic] E-readers and Org-Mode
2022-10-24 18:34 ` Juan Manuel Macías
@ 2022-10-25 7:57 ` Fraga, Eric
2022-10-25 12:55 ` Juan Manuel Macías
2022-10-29 9:03 ` Juan Manuel Macías
1 sibling, 1 reply; 28+ messages in thread
From: Fraga, Eric @ 2022-10-25 7:57 UTC (permalink / raw)
To: Juan Manuel Macías; +Cc: Jeffrey DeLeo, orgmode
On Monday, 24 Oct 2022 at 18:34, Juan Manuel Macías wrote:
> The main problem I find is that they both also run
> closed and, presumably, proprietary software.
They both run Linux but with proprietary user interfaces.
> I wonder if these devices are capable of exporting normal annotations in
> plain text or xml?
The annotations are not text: they are vector data corresponding to the
movement of the stylus. You can extract that information (I have
software for the reMarkable that does so) but doing character
recognition would be challenging...
--
: Eric S Fraga, with org release_9.5.5-1023-g48b237 in Emacs 29.0.50
^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 28+ messages in thread
* Re: [off-topic] E-readers and Org-Mode
2022-10-25 7:57 ` Fraga, Eric
@ 2022-10-25 12:55 ` Juan Manuel Macías
2022-10-25 13:59 ` Fraga, Eric
2022-10-26 13:31 ` L.C. Karssen
0 siblings, 2 replies; 28+ messages in thread
From: Juan Manuel Macías @ 2022-10-25 12:55 UTC (permalink / raw)
To: Org Mode List; +Cc: Fraga, Eric, Jeffrey DeLeo
Fraga, Eric writes:
>> I wonder if these devices are capable of exporting normal annotations in
>> plain text or xml?
>
> The annotations are not text: they are vector data corresponding to the
> movement of the stylus. You can extract that information (I have
> software for the reMarkable that does so) but doing character
> recognition would be challenging...
I see... I was referring to annotations entered as text. Can't you do
annotations on those devices like you do in a typical PDF reader,
Acrobat or Okular style, using an on-screen keyboard or a physical
keyboard? It's those kinds of annotations I was referring to, the ones
that are stored as metadata in the PDF.
As for the stylus notes, I think I would find them useful especially for
proof reading. But very often what I need is just to put text. In Org I
use Org-noter + pdf-tools a lot.
^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 28+ messages in thread
* Re: [off-topic] E-readers and Org-Mode
2022-10-25 12:55 ` Juan Manuel Macías
@ 2022-10-25 13:59 ` Fraga, Eric
2022-10-26 13:31 ` L.C. Karssen
1 sibling, 0 replies; 28+ messages in thread
From: Fraga, Eric @ 2022-10-25 13:59 UTC (permalink / raw)
To: Juan Manuel Macías; +Cc: Org Mode List, Jeffrey DeLeo
On Tuesday, 25 Oct 2022 at 12:55, Juan Manuel Macías wrote:
> I see... I was referring to annotations entered as text. Can't you do
> annotations on those devices like you do in a typical PDF reader,
Not as far as I know (for the reMarkable; I have no experience with the
Elipsa). The virtual keyboard, on the reMarkable, is not great in any
case. Very rudimentary; enough for the job (naming files, connecting to
WiFi) but just barely.
> As for the stylus notes, I think I would find them useful especially for
> proof reading.
Indeed and, for my use cases, for reviewing journal articles and
for giving feedback to students on their reports or theses.
--
: Eric S Fraga, with org release_9.5.5-1028-gcd835d in Emacs 29.0.50
^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 28+ messages in thread
* Re: [off-topic] E-readers and Org-Mode
2022-10-25 12:55 ` Juan Manuel Macías
2022-10-25 13:59 ` Fraga, Eric
@ 2022-10-26 13:31 ` L.C. Karssen
2022-10-26 14:00 ` Quiliro Ordóñez
2022-10-26 16:27 ` Fraga, Eric
1 sibling, 2 replies; 28+ messages in thread
From: L.C. Karssen @ 2022-10-26 13:31 UTC (permalink / raw)
To: emacs-orgmode
On 25-10-2022 15:55, Juan Manuel Macías wrote:
> Fraga, Eric writes:
>
>>> I wonder if these devices are capable of exporting normal annotations in
>>> plain text or xml?
>>
>> The annotations are not text: they are vector data corresponding to the
>> movement of the stylus. You can extract that information (I have
>> software for the reMarkable that does so) but doing character
>> recognition would be challenging...
>
> I see... I was referring to annotations entered as text. Can't you do
> annotations on those devices like you do in a typical PDF reader,
> Acrobat or Okular style, using an on-screen keyboard or a physical
> keyboard? It's those kinds of annotations I was referring to, the ones
> that are stored as metadata in the PDF.
Another happy reMarkable user here. It looks like the upcoming v3.0 of
the software will allow entering text via the on-screen keyboard.
Whether that is only for 'regular' notes or also for PDF annotation is
not yet clear to me (source:
https://support.remarkable.com/s/article/Software-release-3-0-beta).
Best regards,
Lennart.
>
> As for the stylus notes, I think I would find them useful especially for
> proof reading. But very often what I need is just to put text. In Org I
> use Org-noter + pdf-tools a lot.
>
--
*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*
L.C. Karssen
's-Hertogenbosch
The Netherlands
lennart@karssen.org
http://blog.karssen.org
GPG key ID: A88F554A
-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-
^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 28+ messages in thread
* Re: [off-topic] E-readers and Org-Mode
2022-10-24 18:34 ` Juan Manuel Macías
2022-10-25 7:57 ` Fraga, Eric
@ 2022-10-29 9:03 ` Juan Manuel Macías
1 sibling, 0 replies; 28+ messages in thread
From: Juan Manuel Macías @ 2022-10-29 9:03 UTC (permalink / raw)
To: orgmode
Juan Manuel Macías writes:
> [...] Anyway, I think it would be possible to write some python
> script[1] to extract the annotations and then parse the resulting xml
> from there to get a nice and beautiful Org document. Which also leads
> me to wonder if anyone has tried that.
I've found that org-noter has the `org-noter-create-skeleton' function,
which exports PDF annotations to Org and keeps them in sync with the PDF
(via pdf-tools). Tremendously useful! :-)
^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 28+ messages in thread
* Re: [off-topic] E-readers and Org-Mode
2022-10-24 16:42 ` Jeffrey DeLeo
2022-10-24 17:16 ` Fraga, Eric
@ 2022-10-25 11:06 ` Eduardo Suarez-Santana
2022-10-25 14:03 ` Fraga, Eric
1 sibling, 1 reply; 28+ messages in thread
From: Eduardo Suarez-Santana @ 2022-10-25 11:06 UTC (permalink / raw)
To: emacs-orgmode
FTR, I'm a happy Onyx Boox user.
I considered remarkable, but I read somewhere (can't find it) that handwritten
PDF annotations were not coded as vector graphics, so I went for Onyx.
^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 28+ messages in thread
* Re: [off-topic] E-readers and Org-Mode
2022-10-25 11:06 ` Eduardo Suarez-Santana
@ 2022-10-25 14:03 ` Fraga, Eric
0 siblings, 0 replies; 28+ messages in thread
From: Fraga, Eric @ 2022-10-25 14:03 UTC (permalink / raw)
To: Eduardo Suarez-Santana; +Cc: emacs-orgmode@gnu.org
On Tuesday, 25 Oct 2022 at 12:06, Eduardo Suarez-Santana wrote:
> I considered remarkable, but I read somewhere (can't find it) that
> handwritten PDF annotations were not coded as vector graphics, so I
> went for Onyx.
Conversion scripts (including my own adapted ones) take the rM notation
and create polylines (in creating an SVG version) so it is vector
graphics as far as I can tell. But the input mechanism does no
smoothing etc. so the actual annotations may consist of many very small
line segments, depending on your handwriting, I guess.
--
: Eric S Fraga, with org release_9.5.5-1028-gcd835d in Emacs 29.0.50
^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 28+ messages in thread
* Re: [off-topic] E-readers and Org-Mode
2022-10-23 15:16 Juan Manuel Macías
2022-10-24 7:09 ` Fraga, Eric
2022-10-24 16:42 ` Jeffrey DeLeo
@ 2022-10-25 14:37 ` Max Nikulin
2022-10-25 15:21 ` Fraga, Eric
2 siblings, 1 reply; 28+ messages in thread
From: Max Nikulin @ 2022-10-25 14:37 UTC (permalink / raw)
To: emacs-orgmode
On 23/10/2022 22:16, Juan Manuel Macías wrote:
>
> As I am beginning to have serious eye fatigue problems, I am thinking of
> buying an e-ink device, not to read books but to read documents. My idea
> is that it be an Android device and that it supports the installation of
> apk, to be able to install Termux/Emacs/Org-Mode and Nextcloud to sync
> with my desktop PC or my laptop.
E-ink displays are slow (my device was manufactured 15 years ago but I
do not expect dramatic improvement), so applications should be heavily
optimized to provide acceptable experience. I do not think that Emacs is
suitable.
The wonderful property of reflective display is that its brightness
follows ambient conditions. (Almost) direct sunlight during image
refresh (page switching) may cause low contrast noisy image. A
workaround is to move the book into shadow or close cover for a moment.
For static image bright light is not a problem.
I am curious if pdf-tools is able to display annotations created on
devices with stilus.
^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 28+ messages in thread
* Re: [off-topic] E-readers and Org-Mode
2022-10-25 14:37 ` Max Nikulin
@ 2022-10-25 15:21 ` Fraga, Eric
2022-10-25 16:59 ` Ken Mankoff
0 siblings, 1 reply; 28+ messages in thread
From: Fraga, Eric @ 2022-10-25 15:21 UTC (permalink / raw)
To: Max Nikulin; +Cc: emacs-orgmode@gnu.org
On Tuesday, 25 Oct 2022 at 21:37, Max Nikulin wrote:
> E-ink displays are slow (my device was manufactured 15 years ago but I
We are venturing well into OT for this list... ;-)
E-ink displays are getting significantly faster, with some claiming 60
Hz refresh rates (cf. the PineNote). Often, however, they are tied to
low power and low performance processors given their use case: mostly
reading with some annotations.
--
: Eric S Fraga, with org release_9.5.5-1028-gcd835d in Emacs 29.0.50
^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 28+ messages in thread
* Re: [off-topic] E-readers and Org-Mode
2022-10-25 15:21 ` Fraga, Eric
@ 2022-10-25 16:59 ` Ken Mankoff
2022-10-27 17:20 ` Max Nikulin
0 siblings, 1 reply; 28+ messages in thread
From: Ken Mankoff @ 2022-10-25 16:59 UTC (permalink / raw)
To: Org Mode List; +Cc: Max Nikulin
[-- Attachment #1: Type: text/plain, Size: 931 bytes --]
See also Dasung NotEReader. Full Android tablet, no lockdown like the
ReMarkable. Looks fast - can watch YouTube videos for example. If it's
really full Android, then it should be able to install and run emacs
natively. 10.3 or 7.8 inch versions.
-k.
Please excuse brevity. Sent from tiny pocket computer with non-haptic
feedback keyboard.
On Tue, Oct 25, 2022, 08:27 Fraga, Eric <e.fraga@ucl.ac.uk> wrote:
> On Tuesday, 25 Oct 2022 at 21:37, Max Nikulin wrote:
> > E-ink displays are slow (my device was manufactured 15 years ago but I
>
> We are venturing well into OT for this list... ;-)
>
> E-ink displays are getting significantly faster, with some claiming 60
> Hz refresh rates (cf. the PineNote). Often, however, they are tied to
> low power and low performance processors given their use case: mostly
> reading with some annotations.
>
> --
> : Eric S Fraga, with org release_9.5.5-1028-gcd835d in Emacs 29.0.50
>
[-- Attachment #2: Type: text/html, Size: 1295 bytes --]
^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 28+ messages in thread
* Re: [off-topic] E-readers and Org-Mode
2022-10-25 16:59 ` Ken Mankoff
@ 2022-10-27 17:20 ` Max Nikulin
2022-10-27 17:53 ` Juan Manuel Macías
0 siblings, 1 reply; 28+ messages in thread
From: Max Nikulin @ 2022-10-27 17:20 UTC (permalink / raw)
To: emacs-orgmode
I am impressed, but I still believe that UI optimized for e-ink may be
more convenient for specific tasks involving org files than generic
Emacs build for Android. Perhaps conversion of handwritten notes to text
should be delegated to a laptop or a PC.
On 25/10/2022 23:59, Ken Mankoff wrote:
> See also Dasung NotEReader. Full Android tablet, no lockdown like the
> ReMarkable. Looks fast - can watch YouTube videos for example. If it's
> really full Android, then it should be able to install and run emacs
> natively. 10.3 or 7.8 inch versions.
I see that definitely it is possible, but I am unsure it is more
convenient than OLED or LCD tablet. 4 regimes for screen is an indicator
of some complications. Choice of Android may be a way to avoid
development of custom UI. I have not checked if it is possible to build
custom Android variant, unlock bootloader and still get comparable
performance.
Where was a period when LCD monitors were slow in comparison to CRT ones
and people complained concerning annoying trails on dynamic images...
> On Tue, Oct 25, 2022, 08:27 Fraga, Eric wrote:
>
> On Tuesday, 25 Oct 2022 at 21:37, Max Nikulin wrote:
> > E-ink displays are slow (my device was manufactured 15 years ago
..
> E-ink displays are getting significantly faster, with some claiming 60
> Hz refresh rates (cf. the PineNote). Often, however, they are tied to
> low power and low performance processors given their use case: mostly
> reading with some annotations.
There is no reason to install high performance CPU if the goal is to get
time between battery charging noticeably longer that for regular
gadgets. Highest refresh rate means 5W power consumption in the case of
PineNote.
It is not apparent for not-ereader, but I see the same black and back
flickering magic to fight with ghosts and to achieve uniform background
with high contrast on remarkable. My impression is that change in time
to pass whole cycle is not dramatic. Likely long enough pause is
necessary to let particles orientation to settle.
^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 28+ messages in thread
* Re: [off-topic] E-readers and Org-Mode
2022-10-27 17:20 ` Max Nikulin
@ 2022-10-27 17:53 ` Juan Manuel Macías
2022-10-28 4:40 ` Ihor Radchenko
2022-10-29 12:54 ` Max Nikulin
0 siblings, 2 replies; 28+ messages in thread
From: Juan Manuel Macías @ 2022-10-27 17:53 UTC (permalink / raw)
To: Max Nikulin; +Cc: emacs-orgmode
Max Nikulin writes:
> I see that definitely it is possible, but I am unsure it is more
> convenient than OLED or LCD tablet. 4 regimes for screen is an
> indicator of some complications. Choice of Android may be a way to
> avoid development of custom UI. I have not checked if it is possible
> to build custom Android variant, unlock bootloader and still get
> comparable performance.
>
> Where was a period when LCD monitors were slow in comparison to CRT
> ones and people complained concerning annoying trails on dynamic
> images...
Precisely, a couple of days ago, in my search for information on this
subject, I found a e-ink device, likebook, that a) runs Android and b)
has an option to be able to see things on the screen like a normal
tablet, that is, that you can watch videos and more. Grayscale, of
course, but without the problems of a typical e-ink screen. In yt there
are some videos that show this double use. It's interesting. Anyway I
don't know if a custom build of Android can be installed on this device.
Actually, the idea of a device running Android is interesting because it
allows you to install termux and thus Emacs. You could even use Emacs
GUI by installing a GNU/Linux distro in termux and loading it as proot
(+ vnc), or just activating the X11 repo in termux, but I don't know
what the performance would be like. Probably horrible.
On the other hand, the only free app to annotate PDFs on Android is
pen&pdf (based on muPDF), but it hasn't been maintained for several
years. It can be installed on F-droid by adding the IzzyOnDroid
repository, but I don't know if installing it would be a security
risk...
Everything said in this threed is very interesting, but now I am
hesitating between buying one of these devices or simply a 10-inch
tablet with a good screen, and then applying all possible blue light
filters to it. By activating the developer options, you can also turn
Android grayscale. Of course it's not the same as an e-ink screen, but
maybe I can work it out.
Best regards,
Juan Manuel
^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 28+ messages in thread
* Re: [off-topic] E-readers and Org-Mode
2022-10-27 17:53 ` Juan Manuel Macías
@ 2022-10-28 4:40 ` Ihor Radchenko
2022-10-29 12:54 ` Max Nikulin
1 sibling, 0 replies; 28+ messages in thread
From: Ihor Radchenko @ 2022-10-28 4:40 UTC (permalink / raw)
To: Juan Manuel Macías; +Cc: Max Nikulin, emacs-orgmode
Juan Manuel Macías <maciaschain@posteo.net> writes:
> Actually, the idea of a device running Android is interesting because it
> allows you to install termux and thus Emacs. You could even use Emacs
> GUI by installing a GNU/Linux distro in termux and loading it as proot
> (+ vnc), or just activating the X11 repo in termux, but I don't know
> what the performance would be like. Probably horrible.
I am using MobiScribe. It is running android. Though it is more tailored
for writing and drawing.
> Everything said in this threed is very interesting, but now I am
> hesitating between buying one of these devices or simply a 10-inch
> tablet with a good screen, and then applying all possible blue light
> filters to it. By activating the developer options, you can also turn
> Android grayscale. Of course it's not the same as an e-ink screen, but
> maybe I can work it out.
There is a world of difference between e-ink and normal screen. You
really need to try at least once before you decide.
--
Ihor Radchenko // yantar92,
Org mode contributor,
Learn more about Org mode at <https://orgmode.org/>.
Support Org development at <https://liberapay.com/org-mode>,
or support my work at <https://liberapay.com/yantar92>
^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 28+ messages in thread
* Re: [off-topic] E-readers and Org-Mode
2022-10-27 17:53 ` Juan Manuel Macías
2022-10-28 4:40 ` Ihor Radchenko
@ 2022-10-29 12:54 ` Max Nikulin
2022-10-31 12:18 ` Juan Manuel Macías
1 sibling, 1 reply; 28+ messages in thread
From: Max Nikulin @ 2022-10-29 12:54 UTC (permalink / raw)
To: emacs-orgmode
On 28/10/2022 00:53, Juan Manuel Macías wrote:
>
> Everything said in this threed is very interesting, but now I am
> hesitating between buying one of these devices or simply a 10-inch
> tablet with a good screen, and then applying all possible blue light
> filters to it.
Another option is a hardware filter: yellow glasses. I am unsure if the
following statement is trustworthy, but marketing is based on suppressed
chromatic aberration inside eyes.
I think, you should decide what is better for your sight: active screen
and perhaps dark theme or paper-like reflective display. Some people
complains that particular devices may have annoying flickering at low
screen brightness due to pulse width modulation. Some devices have too
bright screen even when brightness is set to min value.
If it is acceptable to you to limit device usage to reading and
handwritten notes then a e-Ink might be really great. You can extend
such notes in Emacs on a PC later.
P.S. Concerning free PDF annotation tool, I have not tested if it is
convenient and available on Android, but Firefox-106 release notes have
the following entry:
> It is now possible to edit PDFs: including writing text, drawing, and
adding signatures.
Almost certainly "edit" in their parlance in namely annotations, not
real changes of PDF structure.
^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 28+ messages in thread
* Re: [off-topic] E-readers and Org-Mode
2022-10-29 12:54 ` Max Nikulin
@ 2022-10-31 12:18 ` Juan Manuel Macías
0 siblings, 0 replies; 28+ messages in thread
From: Juan Manuel Macías @ 2022-10-31 12:18 UTC (permalink / raw)
To: Max Nikulin; +Cc: emacs-orgmode
Max Nikulin writes:
> P.S. Concerning free PDF annotation tool, I have not tested if it is
> convenient and available on Android, but Firefox-106 release notes
> have the following entry:
>
>> It is now possible to edit PDFs: including writing text, drawing,
> and adding signatures.
>
> Almost certainly "edit" in their parlance in namely annotations, not
> real changes of PDF structure.
Interesting, I'll take a look at it. I haven't used firefox as my
default browser in a while. On desktop and laptop I use a combination of
Eww and Qutebrowser, which is more keyboard oriented. I have Firefox
almost relegated to negotiations with the Spanish government, such as
taxes and little else. On mobile I use Brave browser. And lately I've
noticed that it's not as hard as I thought to navigate with Eww-mode in
Termux/Emacs by touch! :-)
BTW, I have found another free app to annotate PDF on Android, KOReader:
https://f-droid.org/en/packages/org.koreader.launcher.fdroid/ It is
mainly intended for e-ink screen e-readers. It's under active
development as well (https://github.com/koreader), and even offers
builds and tutorials for installing it on specific non-Android devices
(Kobo, reMarkable, etc.).
I have tried to make some annotations on a PDF to open it later on the
desktop pc. Annotations are correctly read by pdf-tools, Atril, Evince,
Okular, etc. And they are also exported correctly to Org via the
org-noter function org-noter-create-skeleton, which I didn't know about
and is tremendously useful.
Best regards,
Juan Manuel
^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 28+ messages in thread
end of thread, other threads:[~2022-10-31 12:20 UTC | newest]
Thread overview: 28+ messages (download: mbox.gz / follow: Atom feed)
-- links below jump to the message on this page --
2022-10-25 14:44 [off-topic] E-readers and Org-Mode Payas Relekar
-- strict thread matches above, loose matches on Subject: below --
2022-10-24 7:12 Pedro Andres Aranda Gutierrez
2022-10-24 14:11 ` Juan Manuel Macías
2022-10-23 16:29 Ypo
2022-10-23 15:16 Juan Manuel Macías
2022-10-24 7:09 ` Fraga, Eric
2022-10-24 11:50 ` Juan Manuel Macías
2022-10-24 15:30 ` Fraga, Eric
2022-10-24 16:42 ` Jeffrey DeLeo
2022-10-24 17:16 ` Fraga, Eric
2022-10-24 18:34 ` Juan Manuel Macías
2022-10-25 7:57 ` Fraga, Eric
2022-10-25 12:55 ` Juan Manuel Macías
2022-10-25 13:59 ` Fraga, Eric
2022-10-26 13:31 ` L.C. Karssen
2022-10-26 14:00 ` Quiliro Ordóñez
2022-10-26 16:27 ` Fraga, Eric
2022-10-29 9:03 ` Juan Manuel Macías
2022-10-25 11:06 ` Eduardo Suarez-Santana
2022-10-25 14:03 ` Fraga, Eric
2022-10-25 14:37 ` Max Nikulin
2022-10-25 15:21 ` Fraga, Eric
2022-10-25 16:59 ` Ken Mankoff
2022-10-27 17:20 ` Max Nikulin
2022-10-27 17:53 ` Juan Manuel Macías
2022-10-28 4:40 ` Ihor Radchenko
2022-10-29 12:54 ` Max Nikulin
2022-10-31 12:18 ` Juan Manuel Macías
Code repositories for project(s) associated with this public inbox
https://git.savannah.gnu.org/cgit/emacs/org-mode.git
This is a public inbox, see mirroring instructions
for how to clone and mirror all data and code used for this inbox;
as well as URLs for read-only IMAP folder(s) and NNTP newsgroup(s).