From: Rainer M Krug <Rainer@krugs.de>
To: Rasmus <rasmus@gmx.us>
Cc: emacs-orgmode@gnu.org
Subject: Re: Some projects
Date: Tue, 27 Oct 2015 14:19:23 +0100 [thread overview]
Message-ID: <m2h9lce9es.fsf@krugs.de> (raw)
In-Reply-To: <87k2q8mqwj.fsf@gmx.us> (rasmus@gmx.us's message of "Tue, 27 Oct 2015 13:34:20 +0100")
[-- Attachment #1: Type: text/plain, Size: 4783 bytes --]
Rasmus <rasmus@gmx.us> writes:
> Aaron Ecay <aaronecay@gmail.com> writes:
>
>> Hi Richard, hi all,
>>
>> 2015ko urriak 26an, Richard Lawrence-ek idatzi zuen:
>>>
>>
>> [...]
>>
>>>> I was working on this rather intensively at one time, but I had to stop
>>>> because other aspects of life intruded. I have just been coming back
>>>> towards a situation where I can imagine myself having some (still small,
>>>> but non-zero) chunks of time to devote to working on org. So I hope I
>>>> will be able to pick this back up, but (regrettably) I’m not able to
>>>> make any promises.
>>>>
>>>> Based on my recollection, here’s what the problems were when I stopped:
>>>>
>>>> - The only “off the shelf”-capable citation processing library that we
>>>> found last time is in Haskell, which introduced some difficulties for
>>>> distributing the resulting tool. I know some projects
>>>> (e.g. git-annex) are written in Haskell and distributed as static
>>>> binaries for windows/mac/linux/etc. We’d need to figure out how to do
>>>> this, or find another citation processing library in an
>>>> easier-to-distribute language.
>>>
>>> Yes, this is my understanding, too. In particular, there does not seem
>>> to be an Elisp CSL library, and it would be a lot of work to write one.
>>>
>>> The other CSL library that looks complete and usable is citeproc-js; but
>>> like the Haskell library (pandoc-citeproc) it would need to be wrapped
>>> somehow so that it can talk with Org.
>>>
>>> It should be relatively straightforward for someone who knows Javascript
>>> to write such a wrapper, if anyone wants to work on that. But this does
>>> not really solve the problem with distribution.
>>
>> It solves many of the hard problems though. Node.js is distributed
>> as a binary for many platforms. We’d just have to direct users to
>> install this in the “normal way,” and use the installed binary to
>> interpret the JS source. Whereas for haskell we’d be stuck building
>> the binary ourselves, worrying about static linking/dll hell/32-bit
>> dinosaurs/any of a half-dozen other problems that I don’t really
>> understand.
>
> I would feel more comfortable relying on a JS library. Perhaps it’s also
> easier to find people who are willing to work on/knows JS over the long
> haul...
>
>> OTOH, pandoc-citeproc includes a bibtex parser; we’d need to write a JS
>> one and wire it up to citeproc-js. When I looked (quite some time ago),
>> there did not seem to be any good bibtex parsing libraries in JS (and
>> several third-rate ones).
>
> Bibtex support is essential, of course.
>
> Can someone remind me why citeproc-java isn’t good? AFAIR, it has a
> bibtex parser. But probably it lacks in some other dimension...
>
>> OT3rdH, responding to Matt’s message
>> <http://mid.gmane.org/CAN_Dec_52SP6ghR56PudHiH69KSPrQ0VDw2ZMnP5799-CtaVeQ@mail.gmail.com>,
>>
>>> The disadvantage is that, from what I can tell, the javascript
>>> implementation is the canonical version of citeproc, and the place where
>>> improvements are pushed first. So, for instance, if one wanted to
>>> implement an org-syntax output format for citeproc, citeproc-js would be
>>> the most likely project to support that work.
>>
>> Pandoc can output org syntax, so it may be that we can just link with
>> the main pandoc haskell library as well as pandoc-citeproc and solve
>> this ourselves, without needing upstream support.
>
> Do we WANT to depend on Pandoc? I would say "no". In my OS, where we
> finally got a binary distribution of pandoc, the size of pandoc is still
> 1600Mb! I don’t know if this is representative of other systems, though.
> E.g. what is the size of pandoc+deps in Debian?
I don't know which OS you are using, but just checking on
[[https://github.com/jgm/pandoc/releases/1.15.1]] and [[https://github.com/jgm/pandoc/releases/tag/1.15.1.1]]:
Windows: 19.7 MB
Mac : 27.9 MB
Deb : 20.2 MB
The 1600MB must be including LaTeX?
In General, I like the idea of using the Pandoc approach, as Pandoc
provides a very useful framework for all kinds of conversions (and I
don't like java...)
Nevertheless, I would be happy with whatever is used to implement
proper citation support.
Cheers,
Rainer
>
> Rasmus
--
Rainer M. Krug, PhD (Conservation Ecology, SUN), MSc (Conservation Biology, UCT), Dipl. Phys. (Germany)
Centre of Excellence for Invasion Biology
Stellenbosch University
South Africa
Tel : +33 - (0)9 53 10 27 44
Cell: +33 - (0)6 85 62 59 98
Fax : +33 - (0)9 58 10 27 44
Fax (D): +49 - (0)3 21 21 25 22 44
email: Rainer@krugs.de
Skype: RMkrug
PGP: 0x0F52F982
[-- Attachment #2: signature.asc --]
[-- Type: application/pgp-signature, Size: 454 bytes --]
next prev parent reply other threads:[~2015-10-27 13:19 UTC|newest]
Thread overview: 62+ messages / expand[flat|nested] mbox.gz Atom feed top
2015-10-25 13:08 Some projects Nicolas Goaziou
2015-10-25 14:43 ` Marcin Borkowski
2015-10-25 16:11 ` Nicolas Goaziou
2015-10-25 15:45 ` Eric S Fraga
2015-10-25 16:16 ` Nicolas Goaziou
2015-10-25 16:18 ` Marcin Borkowski
2015-10-25 16:37 ` Nicolas Goaziou
2015-10-25 18:13 ` Marcin Borkowski
2015-10-25 18:24 ` Nicolas Goaziou
2015-10-25 17:57 ` Thomas S. Dye
2015-10-25 18:00 ` Fabrice Popineau
2015-10-25 18:12 ` Nicolas Goaziou
2015-10-25 18:22 ` Eric S Fraga
2015-10-25 19:12 ` Marcin Borkowski
2015-10-25 19:11 ` Marcin Borkowski
2015-10-25 21:18 ` Anders Johansson
2015-10-25 21:29 ` Anders Johansson
2015-10-25 19:33 ` Thomas S. Dye
2015-10-25 20:00 ` Nicolas Goaziou
2015-10-25 20:17 ` Thomas S. Dye
2015-10-25 20:03 ` Nicolas Goaziou
2015-10-25 19:02 ` Rasmus
2015-10-25 19:20 ` Marcin Borkowski
2015-10-26 2:23 ` Matt Price
2015-10-25 20:24 ` Samuel Wales
2015-10-25 20:25 ` Samuel Wales
2015-10-25 23:03 ` Aaron Ecay
2015-10-26 8:13 ` Marcin Borkowski
2015-10-26 9:20 ` Rasmus
2015-10-26 16:39 ` Richard Lawrence
2015-10-26 18:17 ` Nicolas Goaziou
2015-10-26 22:23 ` Richard Lawrence
2015-10-27 0:03 ` Matt Price
2015-10-27 12:01 ` Aaron Ecay
2015-10-27 12:34 ` Rasmus
2015-10-27 13:03 ` Aaron Ecay
2015-10-27 13:51 ` Rasmus
2015-10-28 1:05 ` Matt Price
2015-10-28 3:28 ` Aldric Giacomoni
2015-10-28 3:31 ` Matt Lundin
2015-10-28 14:36 ` Matt Price
2015-10-28 15:31 ` Matt Price
2015-10-28 1:05 ` Matt Price
2015-10-27 13:19 ` Rainer M Krug [this message]
2015-10-27 13:42 ` Rasmus
2015-10-27 14:49 ` Ista Zahn
2015-10-27 15:09 ` Rasmus Pank Roulund
2015-10-27 15:25 ` Ista Zahn
2015-10-27 15:36 ` Rainer M Krug
2015-10-28 2:52 ` Matt Lundin
2015-10-27 13:22 ` Richard Lawrence
2015-10-28 1:57 ` Matt Lundin
2015-10-28 8:56 ` Rasmus
2015-10-28 9:07 ` Rasmus
2015-10-26 17:20 ` Eric Abrahamsen
2015-10-27 8:30 ` Nicolas Goaziou
2015-10-27 18:53 ` Eric Abrahamsen
2015-10-27 19:23 ` Rasmus
2015-10-27 20:28 ` Eric Abrahamsen
2015-10-27 20:01 ` Marcin Borkowski
2015-10-27 21:53 ` Nicolas Goaziou
2015-10-26 18:20 ` Kaushal Modi
Reply instructions:
You may reply publicly to this message via plain-text email
using any one of the following methods:
* Save the following mbox file, import it into your mail client,
and reply-to-all from there: mbox
Avoid top-posting and favor interleaved quoting:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Posting_style#Interleaved_style
List information: https://www.orgmode.org/
* Reply using the --to, --cc, and --in-reply-to
switches of git-send-email(1):
git send-email \
--in-reply-to=m2h9lce9es.fsf@krugs.de \
--to=rainer@krugs.de \
--cc=emacs-orgmode@gnu.org \
--cc=rasmus@gmx.us \
/path/to/YOUR_REPLY
https://kernel.org/pub/software/scm/git/docs/git-send-email.html
* If your mail client supports setting the In-Reply-To header
via mailto: links, try the mailto: link
Be sure your reply has a Subject: header at the top and a blank line
before the message body.
Code repositories for project(s) associated with this public inbox
https://git.savannah.gnu.org/cgit/emacs/org-mode.git
This is a public inbox, see mirroring instructions
for how to clone and mirror all data and code used for this inbox;
as well as URLs for read-only IMAP folder(s) and NNTP newsgroup(s).