From: Herbert Sitz <hsitz@nwlink.com>
To: emacs-orgmode@gnu.org
Subject: Re: An Org-mode clone for Vim
Date: Fri, 5 Nov 2010 23:30:40 +0000 (UTC) [thread overview]
Message-ID: <loom.20101106T000604-907@post.gmane.org> (raw)
In-Reply-To: AANLkTi=24BvMy+0WUcok1WPcx+1tfFdq5KGph4SVFOKs@mail.gmail.com
John Hendy <jw.hendy <at> gmail.com> writes:
>
>
> Wow! This is pretty neat. You've done some really cool things.
>
John -- Thanks for the kind words. I've responded to some of your comments
below to clarify just what my project is and what it isn't.
>
> I started learning emacs only for org-mode and have never really used vim
>except for editing a few config files when nano is not available. Since I
>started with emacs and it has what I want (org-mode), I can't think of a
>reason to learn yet another program with it's own set of shortcut
> oddities :) I can relate to the shortcuts... Sometimes two in a row
> involving ctrl makes me scratch my head. Though with emacs I'm
> pretty sure you can literally change anything you want.
>
> Also, since you're using the export features of org-mode,
> and as you said you can use vimperator or whatever to
> emulate vim keystrokes in emacs... is there
> anything really that you can do with the vim version that emacs
> can't do? I completely understand #5 below -- do it just to
> do it and it's fun. Other than that, though, aside from some
> navigation differences and the (#_of_lines) at the
> end of folded headers I was unsure what was to be different.
> Now you work in vim and just call org-mode to export?
>
You've got it right. For someone who is comfortable with Emacs
and Org-mode there's no reason at all for them to be interested
in what I'm doing. The appeal of my project is pretty much
limited to those people who have a strong preference for using
Vim rather than Emacs. Even the people who strongly
prefer Vim, if they are heavy Org-mode users and depend on a
wide range of it features and multitude of options, might
have little use for my project in its current state.
> 2. Some people are of the opinion that, while Emacs is admittedly
> a great
> operating system/development environment, it lacks a decent text
> editor. ;)
>
> I've heard this but never understood what was being said.
>
That comment is mostly an often repeated joke. I think it gets to a
major difference between Emacs and Vim, which is that Emacs is used
by many to become the central application they use, with all their
sub-applications implemented in Emacs-lisp. Vim isn't really used
that way, partly because it's not as suitable for it, and partly
because its main author has taken a
stance against that sort of use, in favor of a more Unixey-approach
of merely interacting with outside applications.
>
> - Navigation. I definitely feel the emacs shortcut pain for certain
> things. I don't mind exporting. I'm so used to it that
> do C-x C-s C-c C-e p without blinking to publish to PDF.
> But, I highly dislike things like C-c C-[n/p] or C-c C-[f/b] for
> navigating headlines. Your arrow navigation was appealing,
> perhaps only because I'm not as used to these shortcuts as
> others. I find myself using two finger scroll, pg[up/dn] and
> crtl+[right/left arrow] to move around much
> more than the emacs built-in shortcuts. As I said earlier,
> though, surely they can be changed... I just haven't.
Yes, I agree that having navigation keys as multi-keypress chord
combination is sub-optimal. I'm sure remappings could be done in
Org, hard thing might be deciding on what key combinations.
The section-moving commands in Org-mode are already mapped to
keys similar to the ones I use, don't require multi-keypress
chords even now.
>
> Great work and very cool project. Thanks for sharing and I
> really enjoyed the video!
>
Thanks again,
Herb
next prev parent reply other threads:[~2010-11-05 23:31 UTC|newest]
Thread overview: 12+ messages / expand[flat|nested] mbox.gz Atom feed top
2010-11-05 19:39 An Org-mode clone for Vim Herbert Sitz
2010-11-05 19:48 ` A. Ryan Reynolds
2010-11-06 11:28 ` Jean-Marie Gaillourdet
2010-11-05 21:50 ` John Hendy
2010-11-05 23:30 ` Herbert Sitz [this message]
2010-11-06 0:09 ` suvayu ali
2010-11-06 6:05 ` Carsten Dominik
2010-11-06 10:27 ` Detlef Steuer
2010-11-06 20:36 ` Eric S Fraga
2010-11-06 11:23 ` Jean-Marie Gaillourdet
2010-11-07 11:09 ` Urs Rau (UK)
2010-11-08 16:59 ` Nathan Neff
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