* current status of citation syntax discussion @ 2015-06-15 19:08 Matt Price 2015-06-16 19:51 ` Rasmus 0 siblings, 1 reply; 8+ messages in thread From: Matt Price @ 2015-06-15 19:08 UTC (permalink / raw) To: Org Mode [-- Attachment #1: Type: text/plain, Size: 390 bytes --] Hi folks, Am just wondering what the current status is of the work that was being done earlier this year on improved citation support in org. Has an official syntax been settled on? Are there blessed citation managers and export solutions? I would like to figure out a personal system over the summer, and would prefer to adhere to whatever stand(s) others have settled on. Thanks, Matt [-- Attachment #2: Type: text/html, Size: 469 bytes --] ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 8+ messages in thread
* Re: current status of citation syntax discussion 2015-06-15 19:08 current status of citation syntax discussion Matt Price @ 2015-06-16 19:51 ` Rasmus [not found] ` <CAN_Dec9TP8BR+ZhF+4GQiDuT+KcotSeiybQ+Bx8Y36=JeaqQNg@mail.gmail.com> 2015-06-18 15:26 ` Richard Lawrence 0 siblings, 2 replies; 8+ messages in thread From: Rasmus @ 2015-06-16 19:51 UTC (permalink / raw) To: emacs-orgmode Matt Price <moptop99@gmail.com> writes: > Am just wondering what the current status is of the work that was being > done earlier this year on improved citation support in org. Has an > official syntax been settled on? AFAIK: No. Some people wanted something like [cite/type: pre @key post]. Some people wanted additional key-value support, something like [cite: pre @key post]{:key val}. Some people wanted @key to be able to contain arbitrary characters such as punctuation. > Are there blessed citation managers and export solutions? ox-bibtex supports \cite{key} and I think [[cite:key]]. > I would like to figure out a personal system over the summer, and would > prefer to adhere to whatever stand(s) others have settled on. There's about as many systems as there are org users. I use [[citetype: pre @key post]]. Rasmus -- May the Force be with you ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 8+ messages in thread
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* Re: current status of citation syntax discussion [not found] ` <CAN_Dec_w89fLBLraXLBLju3pxsJtDsBwJvp63mxFi1=jxAawaw@mail.gmail.com> @ 2015-06-16 20:18 ` Matt Price 2015-06-16 20:29 ` Rasmus 2015-06-16 20:43 ` Nicolas Goaziou 0 siblings, 2 replies; 8+ messages in thread From: Matt Price @ 2015-06-16 20:18 UTC (permalink / raw) To: Rasmus; +Cc: Org Mode [-- Attachment #1: Type: text/plain, Size: 1338 bytes --] On Jun 16, 2015 3:51 PM, "Rasmus" <rasmus@gmx.us> wrote: > > Matt Price <moptop99@gmail.com> writes: > > > Am just wondering what the current status is of the work that was being > > done earlier this year on improved citation support in org. Has an > > official syntax been settled on? > > AFAIK: No. Some people wanted something like [cite/type: pre @key post]. > Some people wanted additional key-value support, something like > [cite: pre @key post]{:key val}. Some people wanted @key > to be able to contain arbitrary characters such as punctuation. Is the discussion stalled out then? What would have to happen to move it along? > > > Are there blessed citation managers and export solutions? > > ox-bibtex supports \cite{key} and I think [[cite:key]]. > > > I would like to figure out a personal system over the summer, and would > > prefer to adhere to whatever stand(s) others have settled on. > > There's about as many systems as there are org users. I use > [[citetype: pre @key post]]. (hmm, are spaces allowed in pre and post? If so how is the expression parsed? ) > If it's not too much trouble, could you provide some examples of code you use to - generate cite links - export those links to (preferably non-latex) formats ? Thanks as always, Matt > Rasmus > > -- > May the Force be with you And with you. > > [-- Attachment #2: Type: text/html, Size: 1832 bytes --] ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 8+ messages in thread
* Re: current status of citation syntax discussion 2015-06-16 20:18 ` Matt Price @ 2015-06-16 20:29 ` Rasmus 2015-06-16 20:43 ` Nicolas Goaziou 1 sibling, 0 replies; 8+ messages in thread From: Rasmus @ 2015-06-16 20:29 UTC (permalink / raw) To: moptop99; +Cc: emacs-orgmode Matt Price <moptop99@gmail.com> writes: > Is the discussion stalled out then? What would have to happen to move it > along? Everybody got time constrains. Mine are binding severely at the moment (not that I have contributed org-cite code). I think it will be more of a priority after org 8.3. -- The Kids call him Billy the Saint ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 8+ messages in thread
* Re: current status of citation syntax discussion 2015-06-16 20:18 ` Matt Price 2015-06-16 20:29 ` Rasmus @ 2015-06-16 20:43 ` Nicolas Goaziou 2015-08-18 7:53 ` Joseph Vidal-Rosset 1 sibling, 1 reply; 8+ messages in thread From: Nicolas Goaziou @ 2015-06-16 20:43 UTC (permalink / raw) To: Matt Price; +Cc: Org Mode, Rasmus Hello, Matt Price <moptop99@gmail.com> writes: > Is the discussion stalled out then? What would have to happen to move it > along? There is a "wip-cite" branch in the git repo with basic Org syntax for citations. We're mainly waiting for implementations making use of it, on both export and references management side. Regards, -- Nicolas Goaziou ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 8+ messages in thread
* Re: current status of citation syntax discussion 2015-06-16 20:43 ` Nicolas Goaziou @ 2015-08-18 7:53 ` Joseph Vidal-Rosset 2015-08-18 14:38 ` Joseph Vidal-Rosset 0 siblings, 1 reply; 8+ messages in thread From: Joseph Vidal-Rosset @ 2015-08-18 7:53 UTC (permalink / raw) To: Matt Price, Rasmus, Org Mode [-- Attachment #1: Type: text/plain, Size: 941 bytes --] Hi everybody, Thanks to Eric's example (here : https://lists.gnu.org/archive/html/emacs-orgmode/2014-01/msg01262.html ) I have succeeded to use ox-bibtex.el. \cite{} in the org file works both for html and latex. Nevertheless, I wonder how to get for org-file the org citation syntax [[cite: ]] instead of \cite{} when I choose a reference from my references.bib file . Is it possible to change this point in order to get the same org file than in Eric's example ? Best wishes, Jo. 2015-06-16 22:43 GMT+02:00 Nicolas Goaziou <mail@nicolasgoaziou.fr>: > Hello, > > Matt Price <moptop99@gmail.com> writes: > > > Is the discussion stalled out then? What would have to happen to move it > > along? > > There is a "wip-cite" branch in the git repo with basic Org syntax for > citations. We're mainly waiting for implementations making use of it, on > both export and references management side. > > > Regards, > > -- > Nicolas Goaziou > > [-- Attachment #2: Type: text/html, Size: 1619 bytes --] ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 8+ messages in thread
* Re: current status of citation syntax discussion 2015-08-18 7:53 ` Joseph Vidal-Rosset @ 2015-08-18 14:38 ` Joseph Vidal-Rosset 0 siblings, 0 replies; 8+ messages in thread From: Joseph Vidal-Rosset @ 2015-08-18 14:38 UTC (permalink / raw) To: Matt Price, Rasmus, Org Mode; +Cc: eschulte [-- Attachment #1: Type: text/plain, Size: 1356 bytes --] 2015-08-18 9:53 GMT+02:00 Joseph Vidal-Rosset <joseph.vidal.rosset@gmail.com >: > Thanks to Eric's example (here : > https://lists.gnu.org/archive/html/emacs-orgmode/2014-01/msg01262.html ) > I have succeeded to use ox-bibtex.el. \cite{} in the org file works both > for html and latex. > > Nevertheless, I wonder how to get for org-file the org citation syntax > [[cite: ]] instead of \cite{} when I choose a reference from my > references.bib file . Is it possible to change this point in order to get > the same org file than in Eric's example ? I just finded a solution here : https://tincman.wordpress.com/2011/01/04/research-paper-management-with-emacs-org-mode-and-reftex/ and here is the adaptation of the code in my init.el : (defun org-mode-reftex-setup () (load-library "reftex") (and (buffer-file-name) (file-exists-p (buffer-file-name)) (progn ;enable auto-revert-mode to update reftex when bibtex file changes on disk (global-auto-revert-mode t) (reftex-parse-all) ;add a custom reftex cite format to insert links (reftex-set-cite-format '((?c . "[[cite:%l]]"))))) (define-key org-mode-map (kbd "C-c ]") 'reftex-citation)) (add-hook 'org-mode-hook 'org-mode-reftex-setup) with # \bibliography{reforg} at the beginning of my .org file, referring to my .bib file, it works. Best wishes, Jo. [-- Attachment #2: Type: text/html, Size: 2227 bytes --] ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 8+ messages in thread
* Re: current status of citation syntax discussion 2015-06-16 19:51 ` Rasmus [not found] ` <CAN_Dec9TP8BR+ZhF+4GQiDuT+KcotSeiybQ+Bx8Y36=JeaqQNg@mail.gmail.com> @ 2015-06-18 15:26 ` Richard Lawrence 1 sibling, 0 replies; 8+ messages in thread From: Richard Lawrence @ 2015-06-18 15:26 UTC (permalink / raw) To: emacs-orgmode Hi Rasmus and all, Rasmus <rasmus@gmx.us> writes: > Matt Price <moptop99@gmail.com> writes: > >> Am just wondering what the current status is of the work that was being >> done earlier this year on improved citation support in org. Has an >> official syntax been settled on? > > AFAIK: No. Some people wanted something like [cite/type: pre @key post]. > Some people wanted additional key-value support, something like > [cite: pre @key post]{:key val}. Some people wanted @key > to be able to contain arbitrary characters such as punctuation. I just wanted to chime in about this. While Rasmus is right that we didn't reach complete agreement on everything, it seemed to me that we agreed on quite a lot. As Nicolas notes, the core of what we agreed on has been implemented in Org syntax in the wip-cite branch. Consensus seemed to be that we should hold off on adopting any standard syntax for the points of disagreement Rasmus mentions until we have a greater sense of what's needed, based on real-world use. There has also been some work on implementing the semantics for the citation syntax. Aaron Ecay wrote an org-cite library that uses citeproc-java to process citations on export. His version is in the wip-cite-awe branch. I believe (though I don't remember exactly) that Aaron's version of org-cite doesn't support the full syntax in the wip-cite branch yet. I further modified Aaron's org-cite library to support the full syntax and to do citation processing via pandoc-citeproc, rather than citeproc-java. My version is in the wip-cite-org-citeproc branch, available here: https://github.com/wyleyr/org-mode To use this code, you also need org-citeproc, a command-line wrapper around pandoc-citeproc that the org-cite library talks to: https://github.com/wyleyr/org-citeproc I got this setup working pretty well with at least Chicago-like citation styles. More work is needed to make org-citeproc work with footnote or numeric styles. Vaidheeswaran also added support for processing citations via JabRef. His work is here: http://repo.or.cz/w/org-mode/org-cv.git I believe that at the moment, Vaidheeswaran's implementation is only integrated with the ODT exporter, though I am not sure. AFAIK, that's the state of things. I personally haven't had much time for hacking on org-cite or org-citeproc, though I hope to get back to it in a couple of weeks. To be honest, I have been a bit reluctant to press on with it because at least some people (Aaron, Rasmus) seem to feel pretty strongly that they don't want Org citation processing to depend on a Haskell-based tool. That's fine, but it means we need an alternative. The main non-Haskell contenders for CSL processing are citeproc-java and citeproc-js. So, if that's the way we want to go, someone needs to write the equivalent of org-citeproc for one of these libraries: a wrapper around them that allows the org-cite library to make use of them during export. (Unfortunately, that means I am not the man for the job. I don't know Java or JavaScript, and I am not really interested in learning them just for the sake of this project.) I hope I haven't missed anything; those are my impressions of where we're at! Best, Richard ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 8+ messages in thread
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2015-06-15 19:08 current status of citation syntax discussion Matt Price
2015-06-16 19:51 ` Rasmus
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2015-06-16 20:18 ` Matt Price
2015-06-16 20:29 ` Rasmus
2015-06-16 20:43 ` Nicolas Goaziou
2015-08-18 7:53 ` Joseph Vidal-Rosset
2015-08-18 14:38 ` Joseph Vidal-Rosset
2015-06-18 15:26 ` Richard Lawrence
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