* Properties Drawer versus tags
@ 2019-12-20 6:24 Lawrence Bottorff
[not found] ` <CACv55yT8Lg+Z=gR0hyUhQ-08bFqn9xMtLn6JP=EZQzQMf_SXqg@mail.gmail.com>
` (3 more replies)
0 siblings, 4 replies; 7+ messages in thread
From: Lawrence Bottorff @ 2019-12-20 6:24 UTC (permalink / raw)
To: emacs-orgmode Mailinglist
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Very simple, largely philosophical question: When/why use a properties
drawer below a heading versus just using tags on the heading? What are the
advantages, disadvantages of both?
LB
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^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 7+ messages in thread[parent not found: <CACv55yT8Lg+Z=gR0hyUhQ-08bFqn9xMtLn6JP=EZQzQMf_SXqg@mail.gmail.com>]
* Re: Properties Drawer versus tags [not found] ` <CACv55yT8Lg+Z=gR0hyUhQ-08bFqn9xMtLn6JP=EZQzQMf_SXqg@mail.gmail.com> @ 2019-12-20 6:46 ` David R 2019-12-20 6:47 ` Fwd: " David R 1 sibling, 0 replies; 7+ messages in thread From: David R @ 2019-12-20 6:46 UTC (permalink / raw) To: Lawrence Bottorff, emacs-orgmode list [-- Attachment #1: Type: text/plain, Size: 258 bytes --] I forgot something important, part of "the case in favor of properties": It's sometimes useful to be able to search for a category or sort by a category. It's harder to do that if you haven't explicitly entered that category anywhere. -- -- David Rogers [-- Attachment #2: Type: text/html, Size: 303 bytes --] ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 7+ messages in thread
* Fwd: Properties Drawer versus tags [not found] ` <CACv55yT8Lg+Z=gR0hyUhQ-08bFqn9xMtLn6JP=EZQzQMf_SXqg@mail.gmail.com> 2019-12-20 6:46 ` David R @ 2019-12-20 6:47 ` David R 1 sibling, 0 replies; 7+ messages in thread From: David R @ 2019-12-20 6:47 UTC (permalink / raw) To: emacs-orgmode list [-- Attachment #1: Type: text/plain, Size: 1107 bytes --] ---------- Forwarded message ---------- From: David R <davidandrewrogers@gmail.com> Date: Thursday, December 19, 2019 Subject: Properties Drawer versus tags To: Lawrence Bottorff <borgauf@gmail.com> On Thursday, December 19, 2019, Lawrence Bottorff <borgauf@gmail.com> wrote: > Very simple, largely philosophical question: When/why use a properties drawer below a heading versus just using tags on the heading? What are the advantages, disadvantages of both? > LB At the most basic level, the difference is simple: Properties connect two ideas, while tags are each a single idea. Properties often show a category along with a fact that belongs in that category, such as "Book type" - "Fiction". If you have several categories that continually come up, and those categories will have various facts tied to them, then you probably want properties. But if the categories are inconsistent from item to item, or if the categories don't matter and you only need the individual facts, then tags may make more sense. And there's nothing to stop you from using both. -- David Rogers -- -- David Rogers [-- Attachment #2: Type: text/html, Size: 1383 bytes --] ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 7+ messages in thread
* Re: Properties Drawer versus tags 2019-12-20 6:24 Properties Drawer versus tags Lawrence Bottorff [not found] ` <CACv55yT8Lg+Z=gR0hyUhQ-08bFqn9xMtLn6JP=EZQzQMf_SXqg@mail.gmail.com> @ 2019-12-20 11:54 ` Allen Li 2019-12-20 15:18 ` Ken Mankoff 2019-12-20 17:17 ` Adam Porter 3 siblings, 0 replies; 7+ messages in thread From: Allen Li @ 2019-12-20 11:54 UTC (permalink / raw) To: Lawrence Bottorff; +Cc: emacs-orgmode Mailinglist On Fri, Dec 20, 2019 at 3:25 PM Lawrence Bottorff <borgauf@gmail.com> wrote: > > Very simple, largely philosophical question: When/why use a properties drawer below a heading versus just using tags on the heading? What are the advantages, disadvantages of both? I believe tag filtering has better performance than property filtering. Also, I think that tags were initially designed/intended primarily for filtering in agenda views (more wizened users can correct me on both points). Tags also have better visibility, as they are visible by default on each heading line in the buffer and in the agenda. > > LB ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 7+ messages in thread
* Re: Properties Drawer versus tags 2019-12-20 6:24 Properties Drawer versus tags Lawrence Bottorff [not found] ` <CACv55yT8Lg+Z=gR0hyUhQ-08bFqn9xMtLn6JP=EZQzQMf_SXqg@mail.gmail.com> 2019-12-20 11:54 ` Allen Li @ 2019-12-20 15:18 ` Ken Mankoff 2019-12-20 16:35 ` Lawrence Bottorff 2019-12-20 17:17 ` Adam Porter 3 siblings, 1 reply; 7+ messages in thread From: Ken Mankoff @ 2019-12-20 15:18 UTC (permalink / raw) To: Lawrence Bottorff; +Cc: emacs-orgmode Mailinglist On 2019-12-19 at 22:24 -08, Lawrence Bottorff <borgauf@gmail.com> wrote... > Very simple, largely philosophical question: When/why use a properties > drawer below a heading versus just using tags on the heading? What are > the advantages, disadvantages of both? Tags are binary. They are there or not. Property drawers allow you to assign values to variables. I've never fully understood why some property drawers are set to binary. For controlling LaTeX export I have both a property ":clearpage: t" and a tag ":ignore:", and the tag makes more sense to me. Some of those may only exist in my personal config. -k. ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 7+ messages in thread
* Re: Properties Drawer versus tags 2019-12-20 15:18 ` Ken Mankoff @ 2019-12-20 16:35 ` Lawrence Bottorff 0 siblings, 0 replies; 7+ messages in thread From: Lawrence Bottorff @ 2019-12-20 16:35 UTC (permalink / raw) To: emacs-orgmode Mailinglist [-- Attachment #1: Type: text/plain, Size: 878 bytes --] I might add that a properties/drawer is a sort of "official heading metadata repo," while tags not so much. It would be nice to see (lots of) examples. On Fri, Dec 20, 2019 at 9:18 AM Ken Mankoff <mankoff@gmail.com> wrote: > > On 2019-12-19 at 22:24 -08, Lawrence Bottorff <borgauf@gmail.com> > wrote... > > Very simple, largely philosophical question: When/why use a properties > > drawer below a heading versus just using tags on the heading? What are > > the advantages, disadvantages of both? > > Tags are binary. They are there or not. > > Property drawers allow you to assign values to variables. > > I've never fully understood why some property drawers are set to binary. > For controlling LaTeX export I have both a property ":clearpage: t" and a > tag ":ignore:", and the tag makes more sense to me. Some of those may only > exist in my personal config. > > -k. > [-- Attachment #2: Type: text/html, Size: 1299 bytes --] ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 7+ messages in thread
* Re: Properties Drawer versus tags 2019-12-20 6:24 Properties Drawer versus tags Lawrence Bottorff ` (2 preceding siblings ...) 2019-12-20 15:18 ` Ken Mankoff @ 2019-12-20 17:17 ` Adam Porter 3 siblings, 0 replies; 7+ messages in thread From: Adam Porter @ 2019-12-20 17:17 UTC (permalink / raw) To: emacs-orgmode I'll try to explain my view of tags. Let's see if it makes sense. :) Conceptually, properties are like a generic key-value store for headings, and tags are like a certain property. Imagine if, instead of tags being placed in headings, like this: * Blueberries :food:fruit: ...tags were implemented as properties, like this: * Blueberries :PROPERTIES: :TAGS: food fruit :END: The meaning would be essentially the same. From a technical perspective, putting tags on headings makes them much faster to search for, because a regexp can be used to search directly to them (local ones, anyway). In contrast, to find the next location of a certain property, a single regexp search is not enough, because even if a regexp search was done to find an entry like the previous example, like: (re-search-forward (rx bol ":TAGS:" (1+ blank) (0+ nonl) bow "food" eow) nil t) ...it would not be guaranteed that the result would actually be in a heading's property drawer, so additional checks must be done to ensure that. Some properties are special, like CATEGORY. As well, some properties are "virtual," like SCHEDULED, which is written like: * Heading SCHEDULED: <2019-12-20 Fri 11:00> ...but is accessible with org-entry-get, like a property in a drawer. So, use tags for applying simple, conceptual labels to headings, because they're faster to search for than properties and always visible. Use properties as a key-value store for details that are less likely to be used in a query and are less important to see. What do you think? :) ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 7+ messages in thread
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2019-12-20 6:24 Properties Drawer versus tags Lawrence Bottorff
[not found] ` <CACv55yT8Lg+Z=gR0hyUhQ-08bFqn9xMtLn6JP=EZQzQMf_SXqg@mail.gmail.com>
2019-12-20 6:46 ` David R
2019-12-20 6:47 ` Fwd: " David R
2019-12-20 11:54 ` Allen Li
2019-12-20 15:18 ` Ken Mankoff
2019-12-20 16:35 ` Lawrence Bottorff
2019-12-20 17:17 ` Adam Porter
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