* speed keys for plain lists?
@ 2016-05-09 11:30 Bill White
2016-05-09 14:15 ` Bill White
[not found] ` <ccf2f9fe1b2e4df7a1dd48a046c6a86a@HE1PR01MB1898.eurprd01.prod.exchangelabs.com>
0 siblings, 2 replies; 16+ messages in thread
From: Bill White @ 2016-05-09 11:30 UTC (permalink / raw)
To: emacs-orgmode
I'm working on a project that uses deeply-nested plain lists, and I'm
finding navigation to be a chore. Is there a way to enable speed keys
(info "(org) Speed keys") for navigation of plain lists?
Thanks -
bw
--
Bill White . billw@wolfram.com
"No ma'am, we're musicians."
^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 16+ messages in thread* Re: speed keys for plain lists? 2016-05-09 11:30 speed keys for plain lists? Bill White @ 2016-05-09 14:15 ` Bill White 2016-05-09 14:57 ` Kaushal Modi [not found] ` <ccf2f9fe1b2e4df7a1dd48a046c6a86a@HE1PR01MB1898.eurprd01.prod.exchangelabs.com> 1 sibling, 1 reply; 16+ messages in thread From: Bill White @ 2016-05-09 14:15 UTC (permalink / raw) To: emacs-orgmode On Mon May 09 2016 at 06:30, Bill White <billw@wolfram.com> wrote: > I'm working on a project that uses deeply-nested plain lists, and I'm > finding navigation to be a chore. Is there a way to enable speed keys > (info "(org) Speed keys") for navigation of plain lists? Following the ancient tradition of stumbling upon an answer ten minutes after asking the question... I just found that org-forward-element and org-backward-element will do the job, and they work fairly intelligently with org-beginning-of-line. Now if only one could bind these to more-convenient keys than M-{ and M-} when in a plain list. Cheers - bw Bill White . billw@wolfram.com "No ma'am, we're musicians." ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 16+ messages in thread
* Re: speed keys for plain lists? 2016-05-09 14:15 ` Bill White @ 2016-05-09 14:57 ` Kaushal Modi 2016-05-09 15:43 ` Marcin Borkowski 0 siblings, 1 reply; 16+ messages in thread From: Kaushal Modi @ 2016-05-09 14:57 UTC (permalink / raw) To: Bill White, emacs-orgmode [-- Attachment #1: Type: text/plain, Size: 338 bytes --] On Mon, May 9, 2016 at 10:47 AM Bill White <billw@wolfram.com> wrote: > Now if only one could bind these to more-convenient keys than M-{ and > M-} when in a plain list. Now only if emacs allowed changing the default key bindings :P :) Check out C-h f define-key (define-key org-mode-map (kbd "KEY") #'COMMAND) -- -- Kaushal Modi [-- Attachment #2: Type: text/html, Size: 706 bytes --] ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 16+ messages in thread
* Re: speed keys for plain lists? 2016-05-09 14:57 ` Kaushal Modi @ 2016-05-09 15:43 ` Marcin Borkowski 2016-05-09 16:58 ` John Kitchin ` (2 more replies) 0 siblings, 3 replies; 16+ messages in thread From: Marcin Borkowski @ 2016-05-09 15:43 UTC (permalink / raw) To: Kaushal Modi; +Cc: emacs-orgmode, Bill White On 2016-05-09, at 16:57, Kaushal Modi <kaushal.modi@gmail.com> wrote: > On Mon, May 9, 2016 at 10:47 AM Bill White <billw@wolfram.com> wrote: > >> Now if only one could bind these to more-convenient keys than M-{ and >> M-} when in a plain list. > > > Now only if emacs allowed changing the default key bindings :P :) > > Check out C-h f define-key > > (define-key org-mode-map (kbd "KEY") #'COMMAND) I guess that OP would like some key to do this only when in plain list. It's slightly less easy then, and the preferred way (advice/new function/maybe some hook) might depend on the particular choice of the keys. Best, -- Marcin Borkowski http://octd.wmi.amu.edu.pl/en/Marcin_Borkowski Faculty of Mathematics and Computer Science Adam Mickiewicz University ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 16+ messages in thread
* Re: speed keys for plain lists? 2016-05-09 15:43 ` Marcin Borkowski @ 2016-05-09 16:58 ` John Kitchin 2016-05-09 17:27 ` Kaushal Modi [not found] ` <153f4aedb6cc4ab181e9a168513c4a49@HE1PR01MB1898.eurprd01.prod.exchangelabs.com> 2 siblings, 0 replies; 16+ messages in thread From: John Kitchin @ 2016-05-09 16:58 UTC (permalink / raw) To: Marcin Borkowski; +Cc: emacs-orgmode, Bill White, Kaushal Modi I found this approach to context aware key bindings useful: http://endlessparentheses.com/define-context-aware-keys-in-emacs.html Marcin Borkowski writes: > On 2016-05-09, at 16:57, Kaushal Modi <kaushal.modi@gmail.com> wrote: > >> On Mon, May 9, 2016 at 10:47 AM Bill White <billw@wolfram.com> wrote: >> >>> Now if only one could bind these to more-convenient keys than M-{ and >>> M-} when in a plain list. >> >> >> Now only if emacs allowed changing the default key bindings :P :) >> >> Check out C-h f define-key >> >> (define-key org-mode-map (kbd "KEY") #'COMMAND) > > I guess that OP would like some key to do this only when in plain list. > It's slightly less easy then, and the preferred way (advice/new > function/maybe some hook) might depend on the particular choice of the > keys. > > Best, -- Professor John Kitchin Doherty Hall A207F Department of Chemical Engineering Carnegie Mellon University Pittsburgh, PA 15213 412-268-7803 @johnkitchin http://kitchingroup.cheme.cmu.edu ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 16+ messages in thread
* Re: speed keys for plain lists? 2016-05-09 15:43 ` Marcin Borkowski 2016-05-09 16:58 ` John Kitchin @ 2016-05-09 17:27 ` Kaushal Modi [not found] ` <153f4aedb6cc4ab181e9a168513c4a49@HE1PR01MB1898.eurprd01.prod.exchangelabs.com> 2 siblings, 0 replies; 16+ messages in thread From: Kaushal Modi @ 2016-05-09 17:27 UTC (permalink / raw) To: Marcin Borkowski; +Cc: emacs-orgmode, Bill White [-- Attachment #1: Type: text/plain, Size: 864 bytes --] On Mon, May 9, 2016 at 11:43 AM Marcin Borkowski <mbork@mbork.pl> wrote: > I guess that OP would like some key to do this only when in plain list. > It's slightly less easy then, and the preferred way (advice/new > function/maybe some hook) might depend on the particular choice of the > keys. > Right, the define-key solution was under the assumption that M-{ and M-} already do what the OP needs. They are bound to org-backward-element and org-forward-element by default in org-mode-map. So if M-{/M-} already does what he want, he can simply bind the same commands to keys of his liking. Actually org uses org-defkey instead of define-key for these bindings. But they are not context-aware keys; they apply to org-mode-map: http://orgmode.org/cgit.cgi/org-mode.git/tree/lisp/org.el?id=8127b3c30d8a2217468068a73f23bfa4945573dc#n19895 -- -- Kaushal Modi [-- Attachment #2: Type: text/html, Size: 1372 bytes --] ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 16+ messages in thread
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* Re: speed keys for plain lists? [not found] ` <153f4aedb6cc4ab181e9a168513c4a49@HE1PR01MB1898.eurprd01.prod.exchangelabs.com> @ 2016-05-09 18:44 ` Eric S Fraga 2016-05-09 19:59 ` Bill White 0 siblings, 1 reply; 16+ messages in thread From: Eric S Fraga @ 2016-05-09 18:44 UTC (permalink / raw) To: Kaushal Modi; +Cc: emacs-orgmode@gnu.org, Bill White Jumping in again: I wonder if the OP would prefer org-forward-sentence (M-e) instead of org-forward-element? It's a bit finer in granularity... -- : Eric S Fraga (0xFFFCF67D), Emacs 25.0.92.1, Org release_8.3.4-739-g789412 ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 16+ messages in thread
* Re: speed keys for plain lists? 2016-05-09 18:44 ` Eric S Fraga @ 2016-05-09 19:59 ` Bill White 2016-05-10 8:21 ` Karl Voit 0 siblings, 1 reply; 16+ messages in thread From: Bill White @ 2016-05-09 19:59 UTC (permalink / raw) To: emacs-orgmode [-- Attachment #1: Type: text/plain, Size: 311 bytes --] On Mon May 09 2016 at 13:44, Eric S Fraga <e.fraga@ucl.ac.uk> wrote: > Jumping in again: I wonder if the OP would prefer org-forward-sentence > (M-e) instead of org-forward-element? It's a bit finer in > granularity... Thank you all for the suggestions thus far. I'll attach the org file I'm working with: [-- Attachment #2: OED entry --] [-- Type: text/x-org, Size: 17231 bytes --] - Volume 1 - Abate 1 - Abate (ăbēⁱ⸳t), v.¹ - [a. OFr. abat-re, abat-tre, f. à prep. to + batre battre to beat: — late L. battĕre, batĕre, from cl. L. batuĕre. In the technical senses 18, 19, the identity of the prefix is uncertain, and the relation to the other senses undetermined.] - I. To beat down, demolish, destroy. - 1. trans. To beat down, throw down, demolish, level with the ground. Obsolete except in Law. - 1366 Maundev.: viii. 95 (1839) :: Jerusalem hath often tyme ben distroyed, & the Walles abated & beten doun. - c 1420 Palladius on Husb. II. 5 :: Hem to desolate Of erthe, and all from every roote abate. - 1494 Fabyan: vii. 490 :: Yᵉ gates of Bruges, of Ipre, of Courtray, and of other townes were abated and throwyn downe. - 1576 Lambarde: Peramb. Kent 185 (1826) :: Bycause Apultre was not of sufficient strength for their defence and coverture they abated it to the ground. - 1643 Prynne: Doom of Cowardice & Treach. 4 :: And that night came a great party of them, and by fine force made an assault and abated the Baracadoes. - 1664 Evelyn: Kal. Hort. 13 (1729) :: During the hottest months carefully abate the weeds. - 1809 Tomlins: Law Dict. s.v. :: To abate; to prostrate, break down, or destroy. In law to abate a castle or fort is to beat it down. - 1864 Wandsw. Br. Act 44 :: If any work made by the Company in, over, or across the River Thames .. be abandoned or suffered to fall into disuse or decay, the Conservators of the River Thames may abate and remove the same. - † 2. fig. To put down, put an end to, do away with (any state or condition of things). Obs. - c 1270 E. E. Poems, Old Age 149 :: When eld blowid he is blode . his ble is sone abatid. - 1340 Hampole: Pr. Consc. 1672 :: Ded [=death], of al þat it comes to, abates And chaunges all myghtes and states. - c 1350 Will. Palerne 1141 :: To abate þe bost of þat breme duke. - 1413 Lydgate Pylg. Sowle v. xii. 103 (1843) :: And fynally abatid is the strif. - 1585 Abp. Sandys: Serm. 79 (1841) :: St. Paul abateth this opinion. Ibid. 293 To abate the haughty conceit which naturally we have of ourselves. - 3. Esp. Law. - a. To put an end to, do away with (as a nuisance, or an action). - *1297* R. Glouc. 447 :: And oþer monye luþer lawes, þat hys elderne adde ywroʒt, He behet, þat he wolde abate. - *1768* Blackstone: Comm. III. 168 :: The primitive sense is that of abating or beating down a nusance. - *1780* Burke: Sp. on Econ. Ref. Wks. III. 247 :: They abate the nuisance, they pull down the house. - *1844* H. Rogers: Essays I. ii. 88 :: He has not lived in vain who has successfully endeavoured to abate the nuisances of his own time. - *1859* De Quincey: The Cæsars Wks. X. 104 :: To put him down and abate him as a monster. - b. To render null and void (a writ). - *1580* Baret: Alvearie :: His accusation or writte is abated or ouerthrowne when the Attorney by ignorance declareth not the processe in due forme, or the writte abateth. - *1621* Sanderson: Serm. Ad. Cl. II. xxii. 30 (1674) :: And any one short Clause or Proviso, not legal, is sufficient to abate the whole Writ or Instrument. - *1726* Ayliffe: Parergon 266 :: This only suspends but does not abate the action. - *1741* Robinson: Gavelkind vi. 109 :: The Writ was abated by the Court. - *1809* Tomlins: Law Dict. s. v. :: To abate a nuisance is to destroy, remove, or put an end to it. .. To abate a writ is to defeat or overthrow it by shewing some error or exception. - 4. intr. (through refl.) To be at an end, to become null or void; esp. of writs, actions, appeals. - *1602* W. Fulbecke: First Part of Parallele 62 :: In the summons A. was omitted, wherefore the writte abated. - *1745* De Foe: Eng. Tradesm. I. xvi. 148 :: Commissions shall not abate by the death of his majesty. - *1768* Blackstone: Comm. III. 247 :: The suit is of no effect, and the writ shall abate. - *1809* Tomlins Law Dict. s.v. :: It is said an appeal shall abate, and be defeated by reason of covin or deceit. - *1860* Massey: Hist. Engl. III. xxxi. 437 :: The Committee of Privileges resolved, that impeachments stood on the same footing as appeals and writs of error; consequently they did not abate. - II. To bring down, lower, depress. - † 5. To bring down (a person) physically, socially, or mentally; to depress, humble, degrade; to cast down, deject. Obs. - c *1325* Grosseteste: Castel of Loue 1334 :: He was abated of his tour [= in his turn]. - c 1386 Chaucer: Persones T. 118 :: The heyher that they were in this present lif, the more schuln thay ben abatid and defouled in helle. - *1470-85* Malory: Morte Arthur (1634 repr. 1816) I. 241 :: Then sir Beaumains abated his countenance. - *1564* Bauldwin Moral Phil. (ed. Palfr.) iii. 4 :: Hee is to be honoured among them that be honoured, that fortune abateth without fault. - *1618* Raleigh: Remains (1644) 27 :: If any great person to be abated, not to deal with him by calumniation or forged matter. - *1651* Jer. Taylor: Sermons I. ix. 104 :: They were abated with humane infirmities and not at all heightened by the Spirit. - † 6. intr. To fall, be dejected, humbled. Obs. - *1306* Political Songs (Camd. S.) 216 :: Ys continaunce abated eny bost to make. - *1387* Trevisa: Higden Rolls Ser. II. 185 :: Þe bolde nolle abateþ [cervix deprimitur]. - c *1460* Urbanitatis in Babees Book (1868) 16 :: Lette not þy contynaunce also abate. - *1642* Rogers: Naaman 30 :: The naturall spirit of the hautiest .. will abate and come downe. - † 7. To abate of; to bring down (a person) from; hence to deprive of, curtail of. Obs. - c 1430 Octouian Imperator 1316 (Weber III. 212) :: He was abated of all hys hete. - c 1530 Ld. Berners: Arthur of Lytell Bryt. 105 (1814) :: That she be not thereby abbated of her noblenesse and estate. - 1605 Shakespeare: Lear II. iv. 161 :: She hath abated me of halfe my Traine. - 1637 Lisle tr.: Du Bartas 30 :: Mens bodies were abated of their bignesse. - III. To bring down in size, amount, value, force. - † 8. To beat back the edge or point of anything; to turn the edge; to blunt, lit. and fig. Obs. - 1548 Hall: Chron. 689 :: Such wepons as the capitain of the Castle shall occupie, that is, Morrice pike sworde target, the poynt and edge abated. - 1594 Shakespeare: Rich. III, V. v. 35 :: Abate the edge of Traitors, gracious Lord. - 1613 W. Browne: Brit. Past. I. iv. (1772) 107 :: With plaints which might abate a tyrant’s knife. - 1625 Bacon: Essays ix :: To abate the edge of envy. - 1634 Heywood: Maidenh. lost xi. 120 :: The name of Childe Abates my Swords keene edge. - 1699 Evelyn: Acetaria 145 (1729) :: Such as abate and take off the keeness. - 9. To bring down in size; lower, lessen or diminish (things tangible). arch. - 1398 Trevisa: Barth. De Pr. Rerum (1495) XVII. lxxviii. 652 :: Gutta abatyth all swellynge and bolnynge. - 1611 Bible: Gen. viii. 3 :: After the end of the hundred and fiftie dayes, the waters were abated. - 1611 Woodall: Surgeon’s Mate Wks. (1653) 11 :: Small Files are used .. to abate any end of a bone .. which is fractured. - 1662 Evelyn: Chalcog. (1769) 59 :: In wood, which is a graving much more difficult; because all the work is to be abated and cut hollow. - 1813 Scott: Peveril (1865) 241 :: A lucky accident had abated Chiffinch’s party to their own number. - 10. intr. To decrease in size or bulk. arch. - 1587 Golding: Mornay’s Chr. Relig. xiv. 220 (1617) :: The more that the body abateth in flesh, the more workfull is the mind. - 1597 Warner: Albion’s Eng. III. xviii. 86 :: Their poyson, growing when it seemeth to abate. - 1726 De Foe: Hist. Devil I. x. 121 (1840) :: The arke rested, the waters abating. - 11. trans. To bring down in value, price, or estimation. arch. - 1340 Ayenb. 28 :: Vor þe guode los to abatye, and hire guodes to loʒy, þe envious agrayþeþ alle his gynnes. - c 1400 Rom. Rose 286 :: She ne might all abate his prise. - c 1460 Fortescue: Absol. & Lim. Mon. (1714) 116 :: Hou the Pricys of Merchaundises, growyn in this Lond, may be holdyn up, and encreasyd, and the Prycys of Merchaundise, brought into this Lond abatyd. - 1651 Hobbes: Leviathan II. xxii. 119 :: They raise the price of those, and abate the price of these. - 1670 R. Coke: Disc. of Trade 33 :: If the Importation of Irish Cattel had abated the Rents of England one half. - 12. intr. To fall in amount, value, or price, suffer reduction, be reduced. arch. exc. in Law. - 1745 De Foe: Eng. Tradesm. II. xxxii. 101 :: As wages abate to the poor, provisions must abate in the market, and rents must sink and abate to the landlords. - 1768 Blackstone: Comm. II. 512 :: And in case of a deficiency of assets, all the general legacies must abate proportionably, in order to pay the debts. - 13. trans. To lessen or lower in force or intensity (a quality, feeling, action, etc.); to diminish, lessen, lighten, relieve, mitigate. - 1330 R. Brunne: Chron. 269 :: His moder Helianore abated þer grete bale. - 1340 Hampole: Pr. Consc. 2840 :: For na thyng may abate þair pyne. - 1574 tr. Murlorats Apocalips 33 :: Charitie is lyke fyre, whyche is easyly put oute if it be abated. - 1593 T. Hyll: Profitable Arte of Gard. 137 :: The sauor of them [garlic] wilbe greatly abated. - 1599 Shakespeare: Hen. V, III. ii. 24 :: Abate thy Rage, abate thy manly Rage. - 1611 Bible: Deut, xxxiv. 7 :: His eye was not dimme, nor his naturall force abated. - 1670 Walton: Lives IV. 288 :: Lord, abate my great affliction, or increase my patience. - 1759 Robertson: Hist. Scot. I. 11. 156 :: She shook the fidelity, or abated the ardour of some. - 1859 Mill: Liberty ii. 68 :: To abate the force of these considerations. - 14. intr. To fall off in force or intensity; grow less, calm down. - c 1400 Destr. Troy XI. 4665 :: Sesit the wyndis; The bremnes abated. - 1599 Shakespeare: Hen. V, IV.iv.50 :: My fury shall abate, and I The Crownes will take. - 1697 Dryden: Virg. Georg. I. 463 (1721) :: When Winter’s Rage abates, when chearful Hours Awake the Spring. - 1720 De Foe: Capt. Singleton xvi. 274 :: Towards morning the wind abated a little. - 1837 Carlyle Fr. Rev. I. VI. iii. 322 :: This conflagration of the South-East will abate. - 1869 Echo Oct. 9 :: The Foot and Mouth Disease which has been raging with some virulence is now beginning to abate. - IV. To strike off, deduct. - 15. trans. To strike off or take away a part, to deduct, subtract. - a. with of (put of, from obs.). - c 1391 Chaucer: Astrolabe 34 :: Abate thanne thees degrees And minutes owt of 90. - 1413 Lydgate: Pylgr. Sowle IV. viii. 62 (1483) :: He nele noo thynge abaten of the prys. - 1551 Recorde: Pathway to Knowl. II. Introd. :: And if you abate euen portions from things that are equal, those paries that remain shall be equall also. - 1570 Dee: Math. Praef. 9 :: If from 4. ye abate 1. there resteth 3. - 1611 Bible: Lev. xxvii, 18 :: It shall be abated from thy estimation. - 1679-88 Secret Service Moneys of Chas. & Jas. II, 126 (Camd. S. 1851) :: To be abated out of the moneys that are or shall be due to him for work. - 1741 Complete Family-Piece I. ii. 192 :: Take .. 9 eggs, abating 4 whites. - 1745 De Foe: Eng. Tradesm. I. xix. 178 :: Rather than abate a farthing of the price they had asked. - 1866 Rogers Agric. & Prices I. xx. 506 :: The merchant abating something of his morning price. - b. with obj. (orig. dative} of the person. - 1465 Manners & Househ. Exps. 465 :: Roberd Thrope lente me l.s. .. and herof he moste a bate me [ = to me] .xiiij.s. - 1647 Sanderson: Sermons Ad Aul. XV. I. (1673) 209 :: He therefore sendeth for his Master’s Debtors forthwith; abateth them of their several Sums, and makes the Books agree. - 1671 Flavel: Fount. of Life iii. 6 :: When the Payment was making, he will not abate him one Farthing. - 1771 Franklin: Autobiog. Wks. 1840 I. 61 :: She would abate me two shillings a week for the future. - c. absol. To make an abatement. - 1530 Palsgr. 420 :: I alowe or abate upon a reckenyng or accompte made. - 1745 De Foe: Eng. Tradesm. I. xix. 179 :: He cannot abate without underselling the market, or underrating the value of his goods. - 1817 Jas. Mill: Brit. India II. IV. iv. 134 :: Lacey offered to abate in his pecuniary demand. - 16. fig. To omit, leave out of count; to bar or except. - 1588 Shakespeare:: L. L. L. v. ii. 547 :: Abate [a] throw at Novum, and the whole world againe, Cannot pricke out five such. - 1700 Law: Council of Trade 253 (1751) :: Abating accidents which happen but seldom. - 1772 Johnson in Boswell (1816) II. 149 :: Abating his brutality, he was a very good master. - 1865 Sala: Diary in America I. 307 :: Abating the gold and silver plate. - 17. To abate of (a thing): to deduct something from, make an abatement from; to lower, or lessen in amount. arch. - 1644 Bulwer: Chirologia 144 :: It falls short and abates of the perfection of the thing. - 1645 Bp. Hall: Remedy of Discontent. 27 :: Their fading condition justly abates of their value. - 1653 Izaak Walton: Compl. Angler 2 :: [I shall] either abate of my pace, or mend it, to enjoy such a companion. - 1765 Tucker Lt. of Nat. II. 635 :: Their own experience and the world they converse with will abate of this excess. - 1810 Scott: Lady of Lake V. iii. 22 :: The guide abating of his pace Led slowly through the pass’s jaws. - V. Technical. - † 18. Falconry. To beat with the wings, flutter. More commonly aphetized to BATE. Obs. - c 1430 Bk. of Hawkyng in Ret. Antiq. I. 297 :: If that she [the hawk] abate, let her flee, but be war that thou constreyne her not to flee. - 1575 Turberville: Booke of Falc. 135 :: You shall keepe hir alwayes in best plighte and leaste daunger to abate. - † 19. In Horsemanship. ‘A Horse is said to Abate, when working upon Curvets, he puts his two hind Legs to the Ground, both at once, and observes the same Exactness at all Times.’ Bailey 1721; whence in J. and subseq. Dicts. Obs. [-- Attachment #3: Type: text/plain, Size: 545 bytes --] I'm hoping for something that works the way heading navigation works with speed keys, since n, p, and u in that context are burned into my synapses: ctrl-a out to the heading markup then n, p, or u, as needed to go to the same relative place among the markup in the target line. Perhaps endlessparentheses' context-aware method could be adapted to use org-list.el's various org-at-x-p and org-in-x-p functions. I just need to find a block of time to think clearly :-/ Cheers - bw Bill White . billw@wolfram.com "No ma'am, we're musicians." ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 16+ messages in thread
* Re: speed keys for plain lists? 2016-05-09 19:59 ` Bill White @ 2016-05-10 8:21 ` Karl Voit 2016-05-12 17:12 ` Bill White 0 siblings, 1 reply; 16+ messages in thread From: Karl Voit @ 2016-05-10 8:21 UTC (permalink / raw) To: emacs-orgmode * Bill White <billw@wolfram.com> wrote: > > Thank you all for the suggestions thus far. I'll attach the org file > I'm working with: Being curious on your motivation: why do you use only plain list items instead of headings with paragraphs or headings with plain lists? -- mail|git|SVN|photos|postings|SMS|phonecalls|RSS|CSV|XML to Org-mode: > get Memacs from https://github.com/novoid/Memacs < https://github.com/novoid/extract_pdf_annotations_to_orgmode + more on github ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 16+ messages in thread
* Re: speed keys for plain lists? 2016-05-10 8:21 ` Karl Voit @ 2016-05-12 17:12 ` Bill White 2016-05-16 18:17 ` Grant Rettke 0 siblings, 1 reply; 16+ messages in thread From: Bill White @ 2016-05-12 17:12 UTC (permalink / raw) To: emacs-orgmode; +Cc: devnull On Tue May 10 2016 at 03:21, Karl Voit <devnull@Karl-Voit.at> wrote: > * Bill White <billw@wolfram.com> wrote: >> >> Thank you all for the suggestions thus far. I'll attach the org file >> I'm working with: > > Being curious on your motivation: why do you use only plain list items > instead of headings with paragraphs or headings with plain lists? Mainly because I'm still playing around with possible formats. Some manual correction of the ocr text is required for each entry, which provides a frictionless opportunity to add a little bit of list markup and then get on with the next entry. My final goal is a simple electronic version of the old Oxford English Dictionary as outlined by Corey Doctorow http://www.theguardian.com/technology/2013/aug/23/oxford-english-dictionary-future-digitally based on files at the Internet Archive - volume 1 is at https://archive.org/details/oed01arch I'd like the thing to be as close to plaintext as possible with a minimum of markup: - org list notation is minimal - it's useful within orgmode - it doesn't get in the user's way in non-emacs ecosystems - it avoids the endless quagmire of adding significant markup to such a huge body of text - it's a necessary first step for some other brave soul who wants to add markup & organization But I'm open to suggestions & discussion - now's the time to play around with formats to find the right balance between playing with words and slogging through markup. Perhaps this isn't the right mailing list for that discussion, though. Cheers - bw Bill White . billw@wolfram.com "No ma'am, we're musicians." ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 16+ messages in thread
* Re: speed keys for plain lists? 2016-05-12 17:12 ` Bill White @ 2016-05-16 18:17 ` Grant Rettke 2016-05-17 11:46 ` Karl Voit 2016-05-17 15:54 ` Bill White 0 siblings, 2 replies; 16+ messages in thread From: Grant Rettke @ 2016-05-16 18:17 UTC (permalink / raw) To: Bill White; +Cc: devnull, emacs-orgmode@gnu.org On Thu, May 12, 2016 at 12:12 PM, Bill White <billw@wolfram.com> wrote: > But I'm open to suggestions & discussion - now's the time to play around > with formats to find the right balance between playing with words and > slogging through markup. Perhaps this isn't the right mailing list for > that discussion, though. If it isn't then please post the name of that list when you find it. I started out using only lists too because they are exactly as you describe them. Eventually I wanted to attach metadata to the lists, and now I love headings. The case for Org-Mode only as a markup alone isn't very interesting because it is competing against everything from SGML to ASCIIDoc. When you throw in the community and infrastructure of tools and literature then Org-Mode wins. It takes some time for it all to sink in though. My gut reaction to learning Org-Mode (all aspects listed above) was recalling this quote from Eric Weisstein: "Created, developed, and nurtured by Eric Weisstein at Wolfram Research" [http://mathworld.wolfram.com/] Org-Mode makes it easy to do that with whatever document you are nurturing. ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 16+ messages in thread
* Re: speed keys for plain lists? 2016-05-16 18:17 ` Grant Rettke @ 2016-05-17 11:46 ` Karl Voit 2016-05-17 15:54 ` Bill White 1 sibling, 0 replies; 16+ messages in thread From: Karl Voit @ 2016-05-17 11:46 UTC (permalink / raw) To: emacs-orgmode * Grant Rettke <gcr@wisdomandwonder.com> wrote: > On Thu, May 12, 2016 at 12:12 PM, Bill White <billw@wolfram.com> wrote: >> But I'm open to suggestions & discussion - now's the time to play around >> with formats to find the right balance between playing with words and >> slogging through markup. Perhaps this isn't the right mailing list for >> that discussion, though. > > Eventually I wanted to attach metadata to the lists, and now I love headings. This is exactly my point: you can't add any meta-data to list items. However, you've got plenty of possibilities to enrich headings with suitable meta-data: tags, multiple/own drawers, standardized properties. -- mail|git|SVN|photos|postings|SMS|phonecalls|RSS|CSV|XML to Org-mode: > get Memacs from https://github.com/novoid/Memacs < https://github.com/novoid/extract_pdf_annotations_to_orgmode + more on github ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 16+ messages in thread
* Re: speed keys for plain lists? 2016-05-16 18:17 ` Grant Rettke 2016-05-17 11:46 ` Karl Voit @ 2016-05-17 15:54 ` Bill White 2016-05-18 7:30 ` Karl Voit 2016-05-19 2:48 ` Grant Rettke 1 sibling, 2 replies; 16+ messages in thread From: Bill White @ 2016-05-17 15:54 UTC (permalink / raw) To: Grant Rettke; +Cc: devnull, emacs-orgmode@gnu.org On Mon May 16 2016 at 13:17, Grant Rettke <gcr@wisdomandwonder.com> wrote: > On Thu, May 12, 2016 at 12:12 PM, Bill White <billw@wolfram.com> wrote: >> But I'm open to suggestions & discussion - now's the time to play around >> with formats to find the right balance between playing with words and >> slogging through markup. Perhaps this isn't the right mailing list for >> that discussion, though. > > If it isn't then please post the name of that list when you find it. I'm happy to post here, especially since I can't see moving this project out of orgmode. > I started out using only lists too because they are exactly as you > describe them. > > Eventually I wanted to attach metadata to the lists, and now I love > headings. Could you post an example? Here's a sample of my second iteration. A poor man's database - still pure orgmode and still plain text, but easily parsable: - main word|subordinate word, subdivided into grammatical relations A, B, C, &c. - identification - main form :: Abbacy - obsolete † :: no - non-naturalized ‖ :: no - pronunciation :: æ•băsi - part of speech :: substantive - specification :: none - status :: default - spellings :: 5-6 abbasy, 6-7 abbacie - inflections :: none - [morphology] - derivation (etymology) :: A modification of the earlier ABBATIE, assimilated to forms like prelacy, mediaeval Latin -acia, -atia. - subsequent form-history :: - miscellaneous facts :: - TODO: significations & illustrative quotations > "Created, developed, and nurtured by Eric Weisstein at Wolfram > Research" [http://mathworld.wolfram.com/] > > Org-Mode makes it easy to do that with whatever document you are > nurturing. That describes most of my uses of orgmode - thanks! bw -- http://members.wolfram.com/billw ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 16+ messages in thread
* Re: speed keys for plain lists? 2016-05-17 15:54 ` Bill White @ 2016-05-18 7:30 ` Karl Voit 2016-05-19 2:48 ` Grant Rettke 1 sibling, 0 replies; 16+ messages in thread From: Karl Voit @ 2016-05-18 7:30 UTC (permalink / raw) To: emacs-orgmode * Bill White <billw@wolfram.com> wrote: > > Here's a sample of my second iteration. A poor man's database - still > pure orgmode and still plain text, but easily parsable: > > - main word|subordinate word, subdivided into grammatical relations A, B, C, &c. > - identification > - main form :: Abbacy > - obsolete † :: no > - non-naturalized ‖ :: no > - pronunciation :: æ•băsi > - part of speech :: substantive > - specification :: none > - status :: default > - spellings :: 5-6 abbasy, 6-7 abbacie > - inflections :: none > - [morphology] > - derivation (etymology) :: A modification of the earlier > ABBATIE, assimilated to forms like prelacy, mediaeval Latin > -acia, -atia. > - subsequent form-history :: > - miscellaneous facts :: > - TODO: significations & illustrative quotations I am certainly not thinking of all of your use-cases. However, here is a possible alternative «solution» with headings. Just being curious: What disadvantages do you see here compared to lists? *** main word|subordinate word, subdivided into grammatical relations A, B, C, &c. :PROPERTIES: ## or: :identification:-drawer :mainform: Abbacy :obsolete: no :nonnaturalized: no :pronunciation: æ•basi :partofspeech: substantive :specification: none :status: default :spellings: 5-6 abbasy, 6-7 abbacie :...OR...: :spelling: 5-6 abbasy :spelling: 6-7 abbacie :inflections: none :END: #+COMMENT: Previous list as properties does have multiple advantages #+COMMENT: such as column view (+ corresponding edit functionality) #+COMMENT: Following lines seem to contain potential multi-line #+COMMENT: text which does not qualify to be handled well in properties: - [morphology] - derivation (etymology) :: A modification of the earlier ABBATIE, assimilated to forms like prelacy, mediaeval Latin -acia, -atia. - subsequent form-history :: - miscellaneous facts :: **** TODO: significations & illustrative quotations #+COMMENT: I personally prefer todos that can possible get SCHEDULED #+COMMENT: and/or DEADLINE dates to be headings. -- mail|git|SVN|photos|postings|SMS|phonecalls|RSS|CSV|XML to Org-mode: > get Memacs from https://github.com/novoid/Memacs < https://github.com/novoid/extract_pdf_annotations_to_orgmode + more on github ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 16+ messages in thread
* Re: speed keys for plain lists? 2016-05-17 15:54 ` Bill White 2016-05-18 7:30 ` Karl Voit @ 2016-05-19 2:48 ` Grant Rettke 1 sibling, 0 replies; 16+ messages in thread From: Grant Rettke @ 2016-05-19 2:48 UTC (permalink / raw) To: Bill White; +Cc: devnull, emacs-orgmode@gnu.org On Tue, May 17, 2016 at 10:54 AM, Bill White <billw@wolfram.com> wrote: > Could you post an example? Sure. I wanted to refer to my heading by UID rather than name since I wasn't sure of the final format: https://raw.githubusercontent.com/grettke/help/master/help.org Karl provided a format for your example using properties. I would approach it the same way. The folks that use Org-Mode to maintain bibliographies and BBDB databases might have some feedback for you here, too. ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 16+ messages in thread
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* Re: speed keys for plain lists? [not found] ` <ccf2f9fe1b2e4df7a1dd48a046c6a86a@HE1PR01MB1898.eurprd01.prod.exchangelabs.com> @ 2016-05-09 15:19 ` Eric S Fraga 0 siblings, 0 replies; 16+ messages in thread From: Eric S Fraga @ 2016-05-09 15:19 UTC (permalink / raw) To: Bill White; +Cc: emacs-orgmode@gnu.org On Monday, 9 May 2016 at 14:15, Bill White wrote: > Now if only one could bind these to more-convenient keys than M-{ and > M-} when in a plain list. Have a look at avy or ace-jump-mode? I use evil with ace-jump-mode and it works really well for quick movement around the visible part of a buffer: two chars for moving to any line on the screen. -- : Eric S Fraga (0xFFFCF67D), Emacs 25.0.92.1, Org release_8.3.4-739-g789412 ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 16+ messages in thread
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2016-05-09 11:30 speed keys for plain lists? Bill White
2016-05-09 14:15 ` Bill White
2016-05-09 14:57 ` Kaushal Modi
2016-05-09 15:43 ` Marcin Borkowski
2016-05-09 16:58 ` John Kitchin
2016-05-09 17:27 ` Kaushal Modi
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2016-05-09 18:44 ` Eric S Fraga
2016-05-09 19:59 ` Bill White
2016-05-10 8:21 ` Karl Voit
2016-05-12 17:12 ` Bill White
2016-05-16 18:17 ` Grant Rettke
2016-05-17 11:46 ` Karl Voit
2016-05-17 15:54 ` Bill White
2016-05-18 7:30 ` Karl Voit
2016-05-19 2:48 ` Grant Rettke
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2016-05-09 15:19 ` Eric S Fraga
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