Clarify bug report requirements wrt mailing list subscription

Clarify bug report requirements wrt mailing list subscription

[Carlos Pita]

Hi all,

I find the instructions about bug reporting in [1] lacking a heads-up
that subscription to the mailing list is a (soft?) prerequisite. It's
true that it links to [2] which states:

    You can subscribe to the list from this web page. If you are not a
    member of the mailing list, your mail will be passed to the list
    after a moderator has approved

but also it's true [3] states:

    The Org mailing list is a members only mailing list to prevent
    spam. Membership is freely available and only requires that you
    subscribe to the list and confirm your email address.

Moreover, that it seemingly is a soft requirement implies that I'm not
getting any feedback for some time about the status of my report.

All this ended up in that, after some years, I reported a bug again but
from an alternative address following the instructions in [1], but
without reading [2], and since hours later I wasn't seeing my report in
the list I checked [3], subscribe to the list and resent the report,
which probably will arrive twice now, except that a moderator catches
the dup.

I reckon that I could have been more careful regarding [2] but still the
instructions in [1] are somewhat misleading and I would say that [3]
just contradicts [2], whatever is true.

What do you think of:

- Adding some brief mention to subscription in [1].

- Resolve the apparent contradiction about subscription being a
  prerequisite or not between [2] and [3].

Best regards,
Carlos

---

[1] https://orgmode.org/worg/org-issues.html

[2] https://orgmode.org/org.html#Feedback

[3] https://orgmode.org/worg/org-mailing-list.html

Re: Clarify bug report requirements wrt mailing list subscription

[Russell Adams]

On Wed, Oct 20, 2021 at 08:33:42PM -0300, Carlos Pita wrote:
> I find the instructions about bug reporting in [1] lacking a heads-up
> that subscription to the mailing list is a (soft?) prerequisite. It's
> true that it links to [2] which states:
>
>     You can subscribe to the list from this web page. If you are not a
>     member of the mailing list, your mail will be passed to the list
>     after a moderator has approved

Subscription is not a prerequisite to sending your message to the
mailing list. If you do not subscribe, your message will wait for
moderation. There is no guarantee that your message will pass
moderation quickly, it could be many days because we have only
volunteer moderators.

Once your address has passed moderation, if you aren't already a
subscriber, you will be added to a list of authorized senders so you
don't have to wait in moderation again.

Either way it's true that the mailing list has some reasonable
protections against spam. I'm sorry if that's caused you some
frustration, but we're all just volunteers with limited time.

I find the Org list policy to be very liberal. I am on other mailing
lists where subscription is mandatory to send any message, and
unauthorized senders are ignored completely.

> but also it's true [3] states:
>
>     The Org mailing list is a members only mailing list to prevent
>     spam. Membership is freely available and only requires that you
>     subscribe to the list and confirm your email address.
>
> Moreover, that it seemingly is a soft requirement implies that I'm not
> getting any feedback for some time about the status of my report.

Indeed. Spam protections can cause problems.

However, what are your expectations regarding a response for a bug
report? Specifically are you referring to the time until your report
shows up on the list archive, or the issue itself is addressed?

I agree we should try to effectively communicate what you should
expect when posting a bug report the first time, and how quickly your
report can reach the list. (ie: instantly if you subscribe, or expect
delays in moderation)

As to how fast the bug can be confirmed or addressed, there are no
guarantees.

> What do you think of:
>
> - Adding some brief mention to subscription in [1].

I've updated the Worg page, it should be pushed out soon.

> - Resolve the apparent contradiction about subscription being a
>   prerequisite or not between [2] and [3].

I've updated [3] as well, pending next update.

> [1] https://orgmode.org/worg/org-issues.html
>
> [2] https://orgmode.org/org.html#Feedback
>
> [3] https://orgmode.org/worg/org-mailing-list.html




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