Re: Quotes for LaTeX export

[Rasmus <rasmus@gmx.us>]

Hi Laurens,

Laurens Van Houtven <_@lvh.io> writes:

> Hi Rasmus,
>
> On Tue, Feb 4, 2014 at 10:42 PM, Rasmus <rasmus@gmx.us> wrote:
>
>> Hi Laurens,
>>
>> Laurens Van Houtven <_@lvh.io> writes:
>>
>> > I'm writing a book using org-mode. On export, org-mode turns double
>> quotes
>> > like "hello" into ``hello''. Some modern LaTeXes no longer support that
>> > form, instead preferring semantic markup. (The reasoning being that the
>> > markup implies a particular quote style, whereas quotation style is
>> > language-dependent.)
>>
>> This is not true.  Quotes depend on your LANGUAGE-cookie.  See
>> org-export-smart-quotes-alist.
>>
>
> To more accurately: *my* org-mode is turning double quotes into
> ``something'' when I export to LaTeX. I do not have an explicit language
> cookie set. That is the part you objected to, not the LaTeX part, right?

The language is org-export-default-language if no LANGUAGE is set.

>> > As a result, I get
>> >
>> > The preferred way to do that these days is, in the preamble:
>> >
>> > \usepackage{csquotes}
>> >
>> > ... and then later:
>> >
>> > \enquote{something}
>>
>> But this would require us to load an extra package.  Org is quite
>> capable of handling this on the lisp side (and Org ≠ LaTeX).  Clearly,
>> we could have a org-export-user-smart-quote-alist taking priority over
d>> the predefined one.
>>
>
> A package that, IIUC, is quite commonly available. Plus, the consequence is
> that on a bunch of new setups, you get busted quotes, whereas the csquote +
> enquote approach AFAIK works on pretty much any reasonable LaTeX
> installation.

This is exactly the reasons why I don't want to use csquotes:

     \enquote{something}.

But check for instance org-latex-tables-booktabs, which makes optional
support for booktabs.  That kind of support for csquote is of course
OK.  One reason I'd not use this is that the quotes exported to HTML
and LaTeX are no longer in sync.  Which is why I'd rather see
customization through a user smart quote alist.


>  > I think it would make sense to support this for org, and perhaps
>> eventually
>> > make it default behavior. FWIW: I had no idea about this until it bit me
>> > when my LaTeX document suddenly had bogus quotes in it.
>>
>> This has never happened to me, despite extensive usage of LaTeX for
>> almost ten years.
>>
>
> This is a fairly new occurrence, and it is not true for all LaTeXes
> currently available. The motivation is the one that I have given above:

See below.

> quotations are language-specific and semantic markup is preferable. 

Org already has semantic quote characters, namely '"' and "'".
Compare the output of

#+LANGUAGE: fr
#+OPTIONS: ':t
"test"

and

#+LANGUAGE: en
#+OPTIONS: ':t
"test"


> I don't have an exact list of which, but e.g. in ConTeXt MkIV it is
> now the default, and it is also the default for me on the current
> TeX Live when using lualatex or xelatex. This leads me to believe
> that perhaps it is not a *common* issue, but it
>
> Here is an example:
> https://f.cloud.github.com/assets/97816/2078835/cac687b6-8dc2-11e3-8b6a-00c1a8175c94.png

I'm unable to reproduce with TeXLive up-to-date 2013 with both XeLaTeX
and LuaLaTeX.  I don't have context installed.  Here's my code where I
tried to disable fancy features of fontspec:

   \documentclass{article}
   \usepackage{fontspec}
   \addfontfeatures{Mapping=}
   \addfontfeatures{Ligatures=}
   \begin{document}
   ``test''
   \end{document}

Could you share a snip that reproduces your problem?

–Rasmus

-- 
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