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From: "Gustav Wikström" <gustav.erik@gmail.com>
To: Marcelo de Moraes Serpa <celoserpa@gmail.com>
Cc: Org Mode <emacs-orgmode@gnu.org>
Subject: Re: [OT] Defining System, process, methodology and framework
Date: Fri, 13 Apr 2012 10:43:19 +0200	[thread overview]
Message-ID: <CA+SyOP_P+1dm8wFWz4pho0V_5psJLLwU6K8jmwwOS_RjJowD6w@mail.gmail.com> (raw)
In-Reply-To: <CACHMzOGC2+VvKP0+QuSKgU8rZ3pwX2HOGfHKwDKmTQSjrCdd3g@mail.gmail.com>

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Not stupid, maybe a bit confusing ;) But thinking normally is, until you
reason it out. =) (And that's a process!)

I wanted to write something about your mail but didn't find anything of
relevance in my mind (In my system, to share your terminology ;) ).

Please share your insights afterwards!


On Fri, Apr 13, 2012 at 6:59 AM, Marcelo de Moraes Serpa <
celoserpa@gmail.com> wrote:

> Well, looks like my text was kind of stupid and or confusing...
> Anyway, I started reading "An Introduction To General Systems Thinking" -
> surprisingly interesting book, and it's helping me answer most of those
> questions in deeper ways. I needed to do some additional investigation
> before starting to ask questions ;)
> I'll share the insights after I finish it,
> Thanks!
> Marcelo.
> On Tue, Apr 10, 2012 at 9:24 PM, Marcelo de Moraes Serpa <
> celoserpa@gmail.com> wrote:
>> Hi guys,
>> I know there are quite a few smart brains around here, and I think this
>> is valid discussion for this mailing list, even if OT.
>> I'm not a cientist, nor work inside an academic environment. I'm just a
>> regular guy trying to understand this world and making better use of my
>> resources, specially time. For this, I have read dozens of books on
>> personal productivity, including GTD, Making it All Work, and Work the
>> System. All great books.
>> I've started to notice a pattern though. All of them talk about systems
>> and processes (and some might even use the word framework and methodology /
>> or method), and although you can live by and be quite productivity if you
>> apply the principles, I knew I had to understand in an even lower and basic
>> level. I then asked myself "What the heck is a system" and what is the
>> relationship it has with "process", "methodology" and "frameworks" ?
>> I found out, for example, that "System" and "Process" sometimes are used
>> inter-changeably. So I went to google to try to find out the answer. The
>> simplest answers simply say that "a process is what a system is made of".
>> It did not convince me.
>> By reading the wikipedia article about System (
>> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/System), I found out this paragraph under
>> "System concepts":
>> Process and transformation process
>>> A system can also be viewed as a bounded transformation process, that
>>> is, a process or collection of processes that transforms inputs into
>>> outputs. Inputs are consumed; outputs are produced. The concept of input
>>> and output here is very broad. E.g., an output of a passenger ship is the
>>> movement of people from departure to destination.
>> A system can viewed as a process? Hmm, confusing.
>> Right now, my mental model basically says that a "system" is like
>> blueprint with different components that communicate, and a process is what
>> runs on it (or in on of its components). "Framework" is like a collection
>> of systems and a "methodology" is basically akin to system (in my
>> understanding).
>> Why am I obsessing about this?
>> The reason is systems thinking. I think it's a quite interesting mindset
>> and way to perceive the world. By trying to view yourself and what
>> surrounds you as systems (with sub-systems), it's much easier to document
>> (them), get feedback, and improve, automating your life even further,
>> understanding it more, and living better.
>> For example, from this perspective I think, GTD is simply a product of an
>> elevated point of view from the author David Allen. He simply viewed things
>> systematically and documented them. That's why he says it's 'common-sense'.
>> But before that, it would be nice to know exactly what a System is, and
>> it's relationship with "process", "methodology" and "framework", in
>> abstract terms.
>>  What do you think? I'm sure there are quite a few people here that might
>> be crazy enough to have the same question, or perhaps, I'm just too crazy.
>> Let me know, any insights very much appreciated.
>> Cheers,
>> - Marcelo.

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  reply	other threads:[~2012-04-13  8:43 UTC|newest]

Thread overview: 7+ messages / expand[flat|nested]  mbox.gz  Atom feed  top
2012-04-11  2:24 [OT] Defining System, process, methodology and framework Marcelo de Moraes Serpa
2012-04-13  4:59 ` Marcelo de Moraes Serpa
2012-04-13  8:43   ` Gustav Wikström [this message]
2012-04-13 16:14     ` Marcelo de Moraes Serpa
2012-04-22 10:48   ` Karl Voit
2012-04-23 18:48     ` Marcelo de Moraes Serpa
2012-04-25 13:29 ` Eric Fraga

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