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* FWD: Org-Babel Support for Powershell
       [not found] <M90MAnN--3-2@tutanota.com>
@ 2020-06-05 21:32 ` stanislaw_lem--- via General discussions about Org-mode.
  2020-06-06 10:43   ` Russell Adams
                     ` (2 more replies)
  0 siblings, 3 replies; 9+ messages in thread
From: stanislaw_lem--- via General discussions about Org-mode. @ 2020-06-05 21:32 UTC (permalink / raw)
  To: emacs-orgmode

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Hi,

I ask the maintainer of org-babel Bastien Guerry <http://bzg.fr>, if it is possible to include Powershell support for org-babel. Monsieur Guerry told me to ask you via email.

Powershell 5.1 is now an important tool for Infrastructure as Code in the Windows Server world. Windows administrator often encounter mixed IT Landscape with Windows and Linux servers. While it is possible to do network automation with Python with org-babel for the Linux server - you still cannot do Literate Programming in Powershell for Windows server.

I think Literate Programming is a very productive idea for system administration. It is very difficult to establish a Living Documentation policy with Powershell, because of the lack of Literate Programming tools with Powershell support. Currently available Powershell support for Powershell is limited to syntax highlighting and external execution of Powershell commands from code fences. The results of execution of Powershell code snippets is not shown within the Emacs buffer.

With Powershell 7 we got now a cross-platform scripting language for Windows and Linux OS. I think in the future Powershell administration will get more and more important - not only for deployment, but also for cyber security defense of Windows server.
 
Yours sincerely

Stanislaw Lem

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Date: Jun 5, 2020, 00:03
From: stanislaw_lem@tutanota.com
To: bzg@bzg.fr
Subject: Org-Babel Support for Powershell


> Bonjour Monsieur,
>
> Do you plan to include Powershell in org-babel ?
>
> Powershell is an important scripting languages for administration of Windows servers. I like to write installation scripts with the literate programming paradigm, but I cannot find a good tool - org-babel already supports Python, which is very important for network automation. It will be a perfect match, if it will be possible to write Python and Powershell in the same org-babel file.
>
> Thanks for your time.
>
> Yours sincerely
>
> Stanislaw
>
>
> -- 
> Securely sent with Tutanota. Get your own encrypted, ad-free mailbox: 
> https://tutanota.com
>


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^ permalink raw reply	[flat|nested] 9+ messages in thread

* Re: FWD: Org-Babel Support for Powershell
  2020-06-05 21:32 ` FWD: Org-Babel Support for Powershell stanislaw_lem--- via General discussions about Org-mode.
@ 2020-06-06 10:43   ` Russell Adams
  2020-06-06 23:38     ` Gustav Wikström
  2020-06-06 14:01   ` stardiviner
  2020-09-05  7:49   ` Bastien
  2 siblings, 1 reply; 9+ messages in thread
From: Russell Adams @ 2020-06-06 10:43 UTC (permalink / raw)
  To: emacs-orgmode

On Fri, Jun 05, 2020 at 11:32:45PM +0200, stanislaw_lem--- via General discussions about Org-mode. wrote:
> With Powershell 7 we got now a cross-platform scripting language for Windows
> and Linux OS.

Can you provide an example script you would run, and the example output?
Basically a minimum working example, except the part where Babel would run it
for you?

What executable does it need to run?

Does Powershell have a REPL, or is it single commands?

These would help figure out if Babel could work with it. I have the impression
Babel wraps REPL languages quite easily. You'll have more luck trying to have
this feature added if you can help supply this kind of information.

I think Org-Babel working with many languages is a noble goal, but I expect
there would be difficulty getting Powershell support added to the core
distribution. It might be limited to a separate package as it is very specific
to a Windows only non-free language from a vendor with a long and sordid history
of anti-OSS practices.

My opinion is I would never consider using Powershell on Linux, despite your
positive impression.

------------------------------------------------------------------
Russell Adams                            RLAdams@AdamsInfoServ.com

PGP Key ID:     0x1160DCB3           http://www.adamsinfoserv.com/

Fingerprint:    1723 D8CA 4280 1EC9 557F  66E8 1154 E018 1160 DCB3


^ permalink raw reply	[flat|nested] 9+ messages in thread

* Re: FWD: Org-Babel Support for Powershell
  2020-06-05 21:32 ` FWD: Org-Babel Support for Powershell stanislaw_lem--- via General discussions about Org-mode.
  2020-06-06 10:43   ` Russell Adams
@ 2020-06-06 14:01   ` stardiviner
  2020-06-09 13:08     ` Neil Cherry
  2020-09-05  7:49   ` Bastien
  2 siblings, 1 reply; 9+ messages in thread
From: stardiviner @ 2020-06-06 14:01 UTC (permalink / raw)
  To: stanislaw_lem; +Cc: emacs-orgmode

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
Hash: SHA256


stanislaw_lem--- via General discussions about Org-mode. <emacs-orgmode@gnu.org> writes:

> Hi,
>
> I ask the maintainer of org-babel Bastien Guerry <http://bzg.fr>, if it is possible to include Powershell support for org-babel. Monsieur Guerry told me to ask you via email.
>
> Powershell 5.1 is now an important tool for Infrastructure as Code in the Windows Server world. Windows administrator often encounter mixed IT Landscape with Windows and Linux servers. While it is possible to do network automation with Python with org-babel for the Linux server - you still cannot do Literate Programming in Powershell for Windows server.
>
> I think Literate Programming is a very productive idea for system administration. It is very difficult to establish a Living Documentation policy with Powershell, because of the lack of Literate Programming tools with Powershell support. Currently available Powershell support for Powershell is limited to syntax highlighting and external execution of Powershell commands from code fences. The results of execution of Powershell code snippets is not shown within the Emacs buffer.
>
> With Powershell 7 we got now a cross-platform scripting language for Windows and Linux OS. I think in the future Powershell administration will get more and more important - not only for deployment, but also for cyber security defense of Windows server.
>  
> Yours sincerely
>
> Stanislaw Lem

I remember already there are some ob-powershell relative projects. You might
want to work and improve features on those work. And integrate it into Org Mode.

- - https://gist.github.com/cbilson/ae0d90d163be4d769f8a15ddb58292bc
- - https://github.com/togakangaroo/ob-pwsh

- -- 
[ stardiviner ]
       I try to make every word tell the meaning that I want to express.

       Blog: https://stardiviner.github.io/
       IRC(freenode): stardiviner, Matrix: stardiviner
       GPG: F09F650D7D674819892591401B5DF1C95AE89AC3
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^ permalink raw reply	[flat|nested] 9+ messages in thread

* RE: FWD: Org-Babel Support for Powershell
  2020-06-06 10:43   ` Russell Adams
@ 2020-06-06 23:38     ` Gustav Wikström
  2020-06-07 11:47       ` Russell Adams
  0 siblings, 1 reply; 9+ messages in thread
From: Gustav Wikström @ 2020-06-06 23:38 UTC (permalink / raw)
  To: Russell Adams, emacs-orgmode, stanislaw_lem

Hi,

Org babel support for Powershell is a great idea!

Powershell is very ...*ahem*... powerful, and it would likely benefit many users if it was usable and executable from within Org mode!

> -----Original Message-----
> From: Emacs-orgmode <emacs-orgmode-bounces+gustav=whil.se@gnu.org> On Behalf
> Of Russell Adams
> Sent: den 6 juni 2020 12:43
> To: emacs-orgmode@gnu.org
> Subject: Re: FWD: Org-Babel Support for Powershell
> 
> On Fri, Jun 05, 2020 at 11:32:45PM +0200, stanislaw_lem--- via General
> discussions about Org-mode. wrote:
> > With Powershell 7 we got now a cross-platform scripting language for Windows
> > and Linux OS.
> 
> Can you provide an example script you would run, and the example output?
> Basically a minimum working example, except the part where Babel would run it
> for you?

I know the question wasn't for me. But since I'm answering to your mail I can just as well provide an example anyhow:

#+begin_src powershell
  2+2
#+end_src

#+RESULTS:
: 4

> I think Org-Babel working with many languages is a noble goal, but I expect
> there would be difficulty getting Powershell support added to the core
> distribution. It might be limited to a separate package as it is very specific
> to a Windows only non-free language from a vendor with a long and sordid
> history
> of anti-OSS practices.

There should be zero issues in including it into core. Powershell is MIT-licensed and works across all platforms.

> My opinion is I would never consider using Powershell on Linux, despite your
> positive impression.

And I say the opposite. I would certainly use it!

/of topic
It's safe to say the free software movement has gained a strong footing in the software world. If it's "enemies" from the past are starting to walk in the same direction it would serve the free software advocates well to embrace and further encourage those steps. It would in my opinion be signs of maturity and true, good intentions. Judge not from where one comes, but for where one is heading.

Kind regards
Gustav


^ permalink raw reply	[flat|nested] 9+ messages in thread

* Re: FWD: Org-Babel Support for Powershell
  2020-06-06 23:38     ` Gustav Wikström
@ 2020-06-07 11:47       ` Russell Adams
  2020-06-07 12:01         ` tomas
  0 siblings, 1 reply; 9+ messages in thread
From: Russell Adams @ 2020-06-07 11:47 UTC (permalink / raw)
  To: emacs-orgmode

On Sat, Jun 06, 2020 at 11:38:38PM +0000, Gustav Wikström wrote:
> #+begin_src powershell
>   2+2
> #+end_src
>
> #+RESULTS:
> : 4

That's pretty easy. What executable should it run?

> /of topic It's safe to say the free software movement has gained a strong
> footing in the software world. If it's "enemies" from the past are starting to
> walk in the same direction it would serve the free software advocates well to
> embrace and further encourage those steps. It would in my opinion be signs of
> maturity and true, good intentions. Judge not from where one comes, but for
> where one is heading.

I think it's dangerously ignorant to choose to ignore 20+ years (in my career)
of the actively user and OSS hostile actions that MS has taken. They are still
an abusive monopoly.

------------------------------------------------------------------
Russell Adams                            RLAdams@AdamsInfoServ.com

PGP Key ID:     0x1160DCB3           http://www.adamsinfoserv.com/

Fingerprint:    1723 D8CA 4280 1EC9 557F  66E8 1154 E018 1160 DCB3


^ permalink raw reply	[flat|nested] 9+ messages in thread

* Re: FWD: Org-Babel Support for Powershell
  2020-06-07 11:47       ` Russell Adams
@ 2020-06-07 12:01         ` tomas
  0 siblings, 0 replies; 9+ messages in thread
From: tomas @ 2020-06-07 12:01 UTC (permalink / raw)
  To: emacs-orgmode

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On Sun, Jun 07, 2020 at 01:47:45PM +0200, Russell Adams wrote:
> On Sat, Jun 06, 2020 at 11:38:38PM +0000, Gustav Wikström wrote:
> > #+begin_src powershell
> >   2+2
> > #+end_src
> >
> > #+RESULTS:
> > : 4
> 
> That's pretty easy. What executable should it run?
> 
> > /of topic It's safe to say the free software movement has gained a strong
> > footing [...]

> I think it's dangerously ignorant to choose to ignore 20+ years (in my career)
> of the actively user and OSS hostile actions that MS has taken. They are still
> an abusive monopoly.

Plus... they still are up to shenanigans. They just do it more quietly.

For a recent case, see their spat with the Privacy Commissioner of the City
of Berlin (sorry, German).

  https://t3n.de/news/microsoft-mahnt-berlin-wegen-ab-1281556/
  https://www.tagesspiegel.de/berlin/warnung-vor-teams-skype-und-zoom-berlins-datenschutzbeauftragte-beugt-sich-vorlaeufig-microsoft/25841622.html

They're a corporation. They are out to make money. Other aspects
tend to stay behind. That's simple, ain't it?

Cheers
-- t

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^ permalink raw reply	[flat|nested] 9+ messages in thread

* Re: FWD: Org-Babel Support for Powershell
  2020-06-06 14:01   ` stardiviner
@ 2020-06-09 13:08     ` Neil Cherry
       [not found]       ` <M9PnDEh--3-2@tutanota.com>
  0 siblings, 1 reply; 9+ messages in thread
From: Neil Cherry @ 2020-06-09 13:08 UTC (permalink / raw)
  To: numbchild, stanislaw_lem; +Cc: emacs-orgmode


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On 6/6/20 10:01 AM, stardiviner wrote:

> I remember already there are some ob-powershell relative projects. You might
> want to work and improve features on those work. And integrate it into Org Mode.
> 
> - https://gist.github.com/cbilson/ae0d90d163be4d769f8a15ddb58292bc

Using this in Windows 10.

I found that I've had to change:

"-NoLogo -NonInteractive"))

to

"-NoLogo -NonInteractive -ExecutionPolicy Bypass  ")) ;;; need to avoid MS no scripts policy

I needed to user powershell to get around some of the stdout issues with cygwin
and mgwin.

I've not used powershell before so I'm still learning it. Definitely not in
Unix anymore. Thirty five  years of Unix and DOS makes this a very strange
beast.

> - https://github.com/togakangaroo/ob-pwsh

I hadn't seen this one, I'll take a look at it later.

-- 
Linux Home Automation         Neil Cherry       ncherry@linuxha.com
http://www.linuxha.com/                         Main site
http://linuxha.blogspot.com/                    My HA Blog
Author of:    	Linux Smart Homes For Dummies


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^ permalink raw reply	[flat|nested] 9+ messages in thread

* FWD: Re: FWD: Org-Babel Support for Powershell
       [not found]       ` <M9PnDEh--3-2@tutanota.com>
@ 2020-06-09 20:45         ` stanislaw_lem--- via General discussions about Org-mode.
  0 siblings, 0 replies; 9+ messages in thread
From: stanislaw_lem--- via General discussions about Org-mode. @ 2020-06-09 20:45 UTC (permalink / raw)
  To: Emacs Orgmode

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Hi,

I thought about four possible solutions to include Powershell 7 in Emacs. I understand that Powershell 5.1 is not Open Source. But is is not the case with Powershell 7.

I share my idea with ncherry@linuxha.com below. I am still not very familiar with the vast emacs universe. But I am very good in generating ideas. Unfortunately, I am not very confident to get my ideas working on my own.

Yours sincerely

Stanislaw
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Date: Jun 9, 2020, 22:37
From: stanislaw_lem@tutanota.com
To: ncherry@linuxha.com
Subject: Re: FWD: Org-Babel Support for Powershell


> Hi,
>
> recently, I got some hints from Google Bing. Jupyter notebook offer a powershell kernel. Jupyter notebook can be accessed from Emacs. I thought of several ways to include Powershell in emacs:
>
> I. Use Powershell kernel in Jupyter notebook. Use Emacs to access Jupyter notebook
>
> The Powershell kernel is community-driven and Azure actually use it. The Powershell kernel is used with Anaconda - that is not light-weight. 
>
> https://github.com/Jaykul/Jupyter-PowerShel <https://github.com/Jaykul/Jupyter-PowerShell>> l <https://github.com/Jaykul/Jupyter-PowerShell>
>
> Emacs supports w3m - a text browser - Microsoft recommends installing Windows Server OS without GUI, because you can avoid update problems. 
>
> II. Adapt polymode in Emacs for Powershell
>
> But I think, we need something like webmode in order to mix different code snippets. I take a look how polymode work in emacs this weekend.
>
> III. Use language-agnostic literate programming tool
>
> I got another idea to find a very simple language-agnostic literate programming tool. 
>
> https://github.com/zyedidia/Literate
>
> This little language-agnostic tool looks very simple - maybe it can be adapt for powershell. It used awk to extract the code snippets inside the code fences
>
> https://github.com/0atman/blaze
>
> IV. Embedding Powershell in Python or Ruby and make configuration readable with reverse literate programming tool
>
> Another idea of mine is embedding Powershell code in Python and Ruby code and make it readable with a reverse literate programming tool:
>
> Python support: > https://github.com/7enderhead/antiweb
>
> Ruby support: > https://github.com/orenbenkiki/codnar
>
> I am not very familiar with all these tools. Maybe someone has daily experience with these toolsand can publish his configurations. 
>
> Yours sincerely
>
> Stanislaw
>
> -- 
> Securely sent with Tutanota. Get your own encrypted, ad-free mailbox: 
> https://tutanota.com
>
>
> Jun 9, 2020, 15:08 by ncherry@linuxha.com:
>
>> On 6/6/20 10:01 AM, stardiviner wrote:
>>
>>> I remember already there are some ob-powershell relative projects. You might
>>> want to work and improve features on those work. And integrate it into Org Mode.
>>>
>>> - https://gist.github.com/cbilson/ae0d90d163be4d769f8a15ddb58292bc
>>>
>>
>> Using this in Windows 10.
>>
>> I found that I've had to change:
>>
>> "-NoLogo -NonInteractive"))
>>
>> to
>>
>> "-NoLogo -NonInteractive -ExecutionPolicy Bypass  ")) ;;; need to avoid MS no scripts policy
>>
>> I needed to user powershell to get around some of the stdout issues with cygwin
>> and mgwin.
>>
>> I've not used powershell before so I'm still learning it. Definitely not in
>> Unix anymore. Thirty five  years of Unix and DOS makes this a very strange
>> beast.
>>
>>> - https://github.com/togakangaroo/ob-pwsh
>>>
>>
>> I hadn't seen this one, I'll take a look at it later.
>>
>> -- 
>> Linux Home Automation         Neil Cherry       ncherry@linuxha.com
>> http://www.linuxha.com/                         Main site
>> http://linuxha.blogspot.com/                    My HA Blog
>> Author of:    	Linux Smart Homes For Dummies
>>
>
>


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^ permalink raw reply	[flat|nested] 9+ messages in thread

* Re: FWD: Org-Babel Support for Powershell
  2020-06-05 21:32 ` FWD: Org-Babel Support for Powershell stanislaw_lem--- via General discussions about Org-mode.
  2020-06-06 10:43   ` Russell Adams
  2020-06-06 14:01   ` stardiviner
@ 2020-09-05  7:49   ` Bastien
  2 siblings, 0 replies; 9+ messages in thread
From: Bastien @ 2020-09-05  7:49 UTC (permalink / raw)
  To: stanislaw_lem--- via General discussions about Org-mode.; +Cc: stanislaw_lem

Hi Stanislaw,

stanislaw_lem--- via "General discussions about Org-mode."
<emacs-orgmode@gnu.org> writes:

> I ask the maintainer of org-babel Bastien Guerry, if it is possible
> to include Powershell support for org-babel. Monsieur Guerry told me
> to ask you via email.

sorry for the late reply.  As I just said to Ian, new Babel libraries
are always good, but the route ahead for Org is to have *less* of such
libraries in Org's core, not more.

So please host and share your code in a way that is easy for anyone to
find, and we will do our best to promote external useful Babel libraries.

Thanks,

-- 
 Bastien


^ permalink raw reply	[flat|nested] 9+ messages in thread

end of thread, other threads:[~2020-09-05  7:50 UTC | newest]

Thread overview: 9+ messages (download: mbox.gz / follow: Atom feed)
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     [not found] <M90MAnN--3-2@tutanota.com>
2020-06-05 21:32 ` FWD: Org-Babel Support for Powershell stanislaw_lem--- via General discussions about Org-mode.
2020-06-06 10:43   ` Russell Adams
2020-06-06 23:38     ` Gustav Wikström
2020-06-07 11:47       ` Russell Adams
2020-06-07 12:01         ` tomas
2020-06-06 14:01   ` stardiviner
2020-06-09 13:08     ` Neil Cherry
     [not found]       ` <M9PnDEh--3-2@tutanota.com>
2020-06-09 20:45         ` FWD: " stanislaw_lem--- via General discussions about Org-mode.
2020-09-05  7:49   ` Bastien

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