From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: from mp10.migadu.com ([2001:41d0:2:bcc0::]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 (256/256 bits)) by ms5.migadu.com with LMTPS id mKUwNx3ulWNVBgEAbAwnHQ (envelope-from ) for ; Sun, 11 Dec 2022 15:50:06 +0100 Received: from aspmx1.migadu.com ([2001:41d0:2:bcc0::]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 (256/256 bits)) by mp10.migadu.com with LMTPS id qDZPNh3ulWMDMgEAG6o9tA (envelope-from ) for ; Sun, 11 Dec 2022 15:50:05 +0100 Received: from lists.gnu.org (lists.gnu.org [209.51.188.17]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by aspmx1.migadu.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 766CC160AF for ; Sun, 11 Dec 2022 15:50:05 +0100 (CET) Received: from localhost ([::1] helo=lists1p.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1p4Ndh-0007Kj-Kj; Sun, 11 Dec 2022 09:49:13 -0500 Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::10]) by lists.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1p4Ndg-0007Kb-Vf for emacs-orgmode@gnu.org; Sun, 11 Dec 2022 09:49:13 -0500 Received: from ciao.gmane.io ([116.202.254.214]) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1p4Ndf-0002R2-JJ for emacs-orgmode@gnu.org; Sun, 11 Dec 2022 09:49:12 -0500 Received: from list by ciao.gmane.io with local (Exim 4.92) (envelope-from ) id 1p4Ndc-000AHS-Sb for emacs-orgmode@gnu.org; Sun, 11 Dec 2022 15:49:08 +0100 X-Injected-Via-Gmane: http://gmane.org/ To: emacs-orgmode@gnu.org From: Max Nikulin Subject: Autoloading side effects (was: Re: [BUG] org-mouse is activated without explicit require) Date: Sun, 11 Dec 2022 21:49:03 +0700 Message-ID: References: <87r0x6sju1.fsf@fastmail.fm> <87iliie0j1.fsf@localhost> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; Linux x86_64; rv:102.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/102.4.2 Content-Language: en-US In-Reply-To: <87iliie0j1.fsf@localhost> Received-SPF: pass client-ip=116.202.254.214; envelope-from=geo-emacs-orgmode@m.gmane-mx.org; helo=ciao.gmane.io X-Spam_score_int: 26 X-Spam_score: 2.6 X-Spam_bar: ++ X-Spam_report: (2.6 / 5.0 requ) BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_ADSP_CUSTOM_MED=0.001, FORGED_GMAIL_RCVD=1, FORGED_MUA_MOZILLA=2.309, FREEMAIL_FORGED_FROMDOMAIN=0.001, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, HEADER_FROM_DIFFERENT_DOMAINS=0.25, NML_ADSP_CUSTOM_MED=0.9, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001 autolearn=no autolearn_force=no X-Spam_action: no action X-BeenThere: emacs-orgmode@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: "General discussions about Org-mode." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: emacs-orgmode-bounces+larch=yhetil.org@gnu.org Sender: emacs-orgmode-bounces+larch=yhetil.org@gnu.org X-Migadu-Flow: FLOW_IN X-Migadu-Country: US ARC-Message-Signature: i=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=yhetil.org; s=key1; t=1670770205; h=from:from:sender:sender:reply-to:subject:subject:date:date: message-id:message-id:to:to:cc:mime-version:mime-version: content-type:content-type: content-transfer-encoding:content-transfer-encoding: in-reply-to:in-reply-to:references:references:list-id:list-help: list-unsubscribe:list-subscribe:list-post; bh=02IgQOsJjUt4qDsEOQWvOApH574OYdhA92IqorDNzMA=; b=LaJ1sKLfFoaYi7UHNph/RCzB6cTyVSCwvC32qqcJLXrGE18nfzxRF40/+TSg4rcCzUagdJ aVUwafDzssLfDP6rKIDAX70HuEvUg2t+268otvxJWHI1U9EzO7MyosSZVM8Su2y74b36Fq P2jyH2BjLeiip1KtY+OPoe2rta3w7THjJvDqLNt/RW0xojQgLM/JGDrFbLWOe5B1AwNvIv l0FR/4DDQSUNCcC9Bkv2NNzFKi0A3rmVC2p0+cci42QM2LbutToU729rn1qWQ04Rl6olfF Dhw/Atgk7BirRGO1e4LBVFMwwpraw5hY3n96BFdebgGdvfeUQayJSS04Pg0c0Q== ARC-Seal: i=1; s=key1; d=yhetil.org; t=1670770205; a=rsa-sha256; cv=none; b=ALSBeqoLIfs7G/onMnZTD5RY6Z4KBcj25IM+tfAt70jbgtscMGE5LbbWnoyEofVYZtpP4H BIqoCcNgZn+3URiFUaq3puKJHF7CCTJ/11Ju77m5n+xtqve6C1Vq9AU9lfIqOu9N0VvRct a8+P/gP8m8zdb1kHwnHQWDiDjBTFkuoMRIk7t6NU7HdVGjDISI5skL/WFHTtvYMS/xVU8v pdqxWzbEbyd8lLLe/AejCvvSJ7SR2Kf6rUICqyKRhb2G4EgB2cRHF/rP5h/8+Kk8xAW1xp l0qdt5xlO6M8E6cKjLt/ArwxeHm/8zrNTJGJJKOtTKRakJ1NJshc0q/SklOpsg== ARC-Authentication-Results: i=1; aspmx1.migadu.com; dkim=none; dmarc=fail reason="SPF not aligned (relaxed), No valid DKIM" header.from=gmail.com (policy=none); spf=pass (aspmx1.migadu.com: domain of "emacs-orgmode-bounces+larch=yhetil.org@gnu.org" designates 209.51.188.17 as permitted sender) smtp.mailfrom="emacs-orgmode-bounces+larch=yhetil.org@gnu.org" X-Migadu-Spam-Score: 2.75 Authentication-Results: aspmx1.migadu.com; dkim=none; dmarc=fail reason="SPF not aligned (relaxed), No valid DKIM" header.from=gmail.com (policy=none); spf=pass (aspmx1.migadu.com: domain of "emacs-orgmode-bounces+larch=yhetil.org@gnu.org" designates 209.51.188.17 as permitted sender) smtp.mailfrom="emacs-orgmode-bounces+larch=yhetil.org@gnu.org" X-Migadu-Queue-Id: 766CC160AF X-Spam-Score: 2.75 X-Migadu-Scanner: scn1.migadu.com X-TUID: PxlXcJMlsLM2 On 11/12/2022 16:45, Ihor Radchenko wrote: > We cannot do much about Emacs' handling of autoloads, but what we can > (and should) do is changing org-mouse to become a global minor mode. > Then, loading org-mouse will cause no side effects. I am afraid, requirement that loading should not cause side effects is too strict and it will make usage inconvenient. Examples: - ol-info calls `org-link-set-parameters'. - org-protocol installs an advice for `server-visit-files'. (It should not be necessary, but currently Emacs does not provide a better option.) However I agree that it is undesired when attempt to call interactive help causes side effects. I would say that in such cases loading of packages should be sandboxed and should not propagate to global scope.