From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: from mp11.migadu.com ([2001:41d0:8:6d80::]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 (256/256 bits)) by ms0.migadu.com with LMTPS id gCIyMGIYO2LALwEAgWs5BA (envelope-from ) for ; Wed, 23 Mar 2022 13:53:54 +0100 Received: from aspmx1.migadu.com ([2001:41d0:8:6d80::]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 (256/256 bits)) by mp11.migadu.com with LMTPS id 8L6WLWIYO2Jq1wAA9RJhRA (envelope-from ) for ; Wed, 23 Mar 2022 13:53:54 +0100 Received: from lists.gnu.org (lists.gnu.org [209.51.188.17]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by aspmx1.migadu.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 48BB2FF50 for ; Wed, 23 Mar 2022 13:53:53 +0100 (CET) Received: from localhost ([::1]:46466 helo=lists1p.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1nX0Uq-0002Mm-0o for larch@yhetil.org; Wed, 23 Mar 2022 08:53:52 -0400 Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([209.51.188.92]:58196) by lists.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1nX0ME-00019G-T5 for emacs-orgmode@gnu.org; Wed, 23 Mar 2022 08:44:58 -0400 Received: from ciao.gmane.io ([116.202.254.214]:38886) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1nX0MD-0006Lh-8S for emacs-orgmode@gnu.org; Wed, 23 Mar 2022 08:44:58 -0400 Received: from list by ciao.gmane.io with local (Exim 4.92) (envelope-from ) id 1nX0MA-0006Ho-W8 for emacs-orgmode@gnu.org; Wed, 23 Mar 2022 13:44:54 +0100 X-Injected-Via-Gmane: http://gmane.org/ To: emacs-orgmode@gnu.org From: Max Nikulin Subject: Re: citations: org-cite vs org-ref 3.0 Date: Wed, 23 Mar 2022 19:44:46 +0700 Message-ID: References: <87wngosqvm.fsf@nicolasgoaziou.fr> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; Linux x86_64; rv:91.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/91.5.0 Content-Language: en-US In-Reply-To: Received-SPF: pass client-ip=116.202.254.214; envelope-from=geo-emacs-orgmode@m.gmane-mx.org; helo=ciao.gmane.io X-Spam_score_int: 28 X-Spam_score: 2.8 X-Spam_bar: ++ X-Spam_report: (2.8 / 5.0 requ) BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_ADSP_CUSTOM_MED=0.001, FORGED_GMAIL_RCVD=1, FORGED_MUA_MOZILLA=2.309, FREEMAIL_FORGED_FROMDOMAIN=0.249, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, HEADER_FROM_DIFFERENT_DOMAINS=0.249, NICE_REPLY_A=-0.001, NML_ADSP_CUSTOM_MED=0.9, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, T_SCC_BODY_TEXT_LINE=-0.01 autolearn=no autolearn_force=no X-Spam_action: no action X-BeenThere: emacs-orgmode@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: "General discussions about Org-mode." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: emacs-orgmode-bounces+larch=yhetil.org@gnu.org Sender: "Emacs-orgmode" X-Migadu-Flow: FLOW_IN X-Migadu-To: larch@yhetil.org X-Migadu-Country: US ARC-Message-Signature: i=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=yhetil.org; s=key1; t=1648040033; h=from:from:sender:sender:reply-to:subject:subject:date:date: message-id:message-id:to:to:cc:mime-version:mime-version: content-type:content-type: content-transfer-encoding:content-transfer-encoding: in-reply-to:in-reply-to:references:references:list-id:list-help: list-unsubscribe:list-subscribe:list-post; bh=kZnAJ+TSE95JvrPk81Ul+JWm1Kb9UcQ71W89wSwLQUI=; b=TBBW3PltVDVN6pSCQpjZNr5kPBVXDsd5lOf++nO6IRoN388SKaO40bCpB+gxYBjWQBPeqm vPUlTdkyfewaPhoDNOq5E7jbChtNAqZUnLc5VlbegoLbLDadzJoHioPkCy1tE7jVLfhLgN yJd44NTbudf7BErHxHaNE+VLisuAx5GObNohqSVtrtJ4ptFcxB2Qg8pbzKNgoJGdA4n/xw Yorof14WcHf10g+43jtYwkVNyGF/bYZgXeqxFArO8Vbeo3KSftsTsdP3jS5aExN1V6hCMs ncuTUpIxTkR9U6JcKuGnJlmVjg821K4+imky6CxYk6B1l11lsn/yVxWNHo8TCg== ARC-Seal: i=1; s=key1; d=yhetil.org; t=1648040033; a=rsa-sha256; cv=none; b=CvKFncAnidniOSWcp+QhsPkCx7M/zhy3lFHfLPt3VWa0EDLSh5gCCJwZ0S8y7vA6wuhZKD vahs6YOHkDQr35YhV2gBB9C6yCgQFnXbmfVcTgU2Yyc5UAa5KhrAy8dxIyfcjCIKW0Vegr QmvNAf76GRxx65xSXNOGkzYigy+IkG1RF2XRnviw1rspv5J++zzJC/SXi7bp4ipSvLJeKl E45YT2egD4EaFRuVFMV+EYYI+NH0B4pjy9koqtGciGhwajiz0vJHHU+OOD6sBwSg+pDxdt H2jahHCQhVfc8CZ1/uSIFA3SpbAQZyog9wOlIw6kqSsH9GWFZCPwsvZdVvzvOg== ARC-Authentication-Results: i=1; aspmx1.migadu.com; dkim=none; dmarc=fail reason="SPF not aligned (relaxed), No valid DKIM" header.from=gmail.com (policy=none); spf=pass (aspmx1.migadu.com: domain of "emacs-orgmode-bounces+larch=yhetil.org@gnu.org" designates 209.51.188.17 as permitted sender) smtp.mailfrom="emacs-orgmode-bounces+larch=yhetil.org@gnu.org" X-Migadu-Spam-Score: 2.60 Authentication-Results: aspmx1.migadu.com; dkim=none; dmarc=fail reason="SPF not aligned (relaxed), No valid DKIM" header.from=gmail.com (policy=none); spf=pass (aspmx1.migadu.com: domain of "emacs-orgmode-bounces+larch=yhetil.org@gnu.org" designates 209.51.188.17 as permitted sender) smtp.mailfrom="emacs-orgmode-bounces+larch=yhetil.org@gnu.org" X-Migadu-Queue-Id: 48BB2FF50 X-Spam-Score: 2.60 X-Migadu-Scanner: scn0.migadu.com X-TUID: 5Snd+kZageRI On 23/03/2022 00:20, Bruce D'Arcus wrote: > On Tue, Mar 22, 2022 at 10:42 AM Max Nikulin wrote: >> >> John Kitchin, this thread, Sun, 20 Mar 2022 20:31:29 -0400. >> https://list.orgmode.org/m2sfrc149c.fsf@andrew.cmu.edu: >> >>> I don't know the equivalent of \citenum in CSL. > > Right; so John or someone else should send a message to the list > requesting it specifically? From my point of view he has already requested support of \citenum by that message. I am taking into account that he is the developer org-ref and he is happy with this package. John made a lot to adopt org-cite syntax to ensure feature parity. Bruce, you should know it better than me since you participated in discussions while I am merely and observer. John does not really need \citenum namely in org-cite since his tool is org-ref, but his words may affect perception of org-cite. I have an impression that the ball is on the side of the org-cite, and next steps may be to ask for real documents (e.g. open access papers) that are prepared with such format and to discuss most suitable style for CSL. > One possible idea to consider is to allow two systems in each of > LaTeX-oriented processors: what we might call a default "org-cite" > one, and an optional "literal" one. So if you only use oc-natbib, and > you want the natbib commands directly, you might change a variable to > get that. Maybe I will share my idea in response to the message from Nicolas https://list.orgmode.org/871qytlf49.fsf@nicolasgoaziou.fr Wed, 23 Mar 2022 00:52:22 +0100, this thread. Since John explicitly confirmed that org-ref for cross-references may be combined with org-cite for citations, it may be great that Org has 2 independent implementations for citations. When a user meets some corner case their has an opportunity to try another package.