From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: from mp11.migadu.com ([2001:41d0:2:4a6f::]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 (256/256 bits)) by ms9.migadu.com with LMTPS id iH6pDt6WNWRQWwAASxT56A (envelope-from ) for ; Tue, 11 Apr 2023 19:20:30 +0200 Received: from aspmx1.migadu.com ([2001:41d0:2:4a6f::]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 (256/256 bits)) by mp11.migadu.com with LMTPS id SAh5Dt6WNWTouAAA9RJhRA (envelope-from ) for ; Tue, 11 Apr 2023 19:20:30 +0200 Received: from lists.gnu.org (lists.gnu.org [209.51.188.17]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by aspmx1.migadu.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id B16B1398DD for ; Tue, 11 Apr 2023 19:20:29 +0200 (CEST) Received: from localhost ([::1] helo=lists1p.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1pmHee-0000W4-4V; Tue, 11 Apr 2023 13:19:40 -0400 Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::10]) by lists.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1pmHeb-0000Vb-Sx for emacs-orgmode@gnu.org; Tue, 11 Apr 2023 13:19:37 -0400 Received: from netyu.xyz ([152.44.41.246] helo=mail.netyu.xyz) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1pmHeZ-0008Ck-GP for emacs-orgmode@gnu.org; Tue, 11 Apr 2023 13:19:37 -0400 Received: from fw.net.yu.netyu.xyz ( [27.18.242.10]) by netyu.xyz (OpenSMTPD) with ESMTPSA id 6e0f61c4 (TLSv1.3:TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256:NO); Tue, 11 Apr 2023 17:19:33 +0000 (UTC) References: <87a5zeu136.fsf@localhost> User-agent: mu4e 1.9.22; emacs 30.0.50 To: Ihor Radchenko Cc: Emacs Org Mode , Timothy Subject: Re: [orgweb/zh-CN] [DRAFT PATCH] Tentative zh-CN translation Date: Wed, 12 Apr 2023 00:39:25 +0800 In-reply-to: <87a5zeu136.fsf@localhost> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Received-SPF: pass client-ip=152.44.41.246; envelope-from=ruijie@netyu.xyz; helo=mail.netyu.xyz X-Spam_score_int: -18 X-Spam_score: -1.9 X-Spam_bar: - X-Spam_report: (-1.9 / 5.0 requ) BAYES_00=-1.9, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001 autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no X-Spam_action: no action X-BeenThere: emacs-orgmode@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: "General discussions about Org-mode." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Reply-to: Ruijie Yu From: Ruijie Yu via "General discussions about Org-mode." Errors-To: emacs-orgmode-bounces+larch=yhetil.org@gnu.org Sender: emacs-orgmode-bounces+larch=yhetil.org@gnu.org X-Migadu-Country: US X-Migadu-Flow: FLOW_IN ARC-Seal: i=1; s=key1; d=yhetil.org; t=1681233629; a=rsa-sha256; cv=none; b=gkAeCl9KsRZ6wE7ketk0wBp1cFdUDczJAYnfraObWUiBtUNOVYI/2VfB5RXQrAG8P/it3o FfEo2UiBuVIesBZwWBXt2YCNRcyc0FSs3uPKx3m9uM56sDS3EY1hh1dgJDEtMZAe6oLLkP +s8ek4fMxVgHD6CvJ9NG/Z5ZOJ7ybS56cUY7vRb1ZCrjgFsLBW8CrRW3p+3a5r7Jc2KY7h Mle5NifY2qpR4Us8BWgocOJFpPVTwZoHBjG/57ZIb6cDA9EZIRCuVVjtjw00bAnWrmYu6c pNMjZy43u2IuerVdRxoRutjLl+z2YDb5CkEYiOQX8yl1wQXpnMBCAwaxeV1QPA== ARC-Authentication-Results: i=1; aspmx1.migadu.com; dkim=none; dmarc=pass (policy=none) header.from=gnu.org; spf=pass (aspmx1.migadu.com: domain of "emacs-orgmode-bounces+larch=yhetil.org@gnu.org" designates 209.51.188.17 as permitted sender) smtp.mailfrom="emacs-orgmode-bounces+larch=yhetil.org@gnu.org" ARC-Message-Signature: i=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=yhetil.org; s=key1; t=1681233629; h=from:from:sender:sender:reply-to:reply-to:subject:subject:date:date: message-id:message-id:to:to:cc:cc:mime-version:mime-version: content-type:content-type: content-transfer-encoding:content-transfer-encoding: in-reply-to:in-reply-to:references:references:list-id:list-help: list-unsubscribe:list-subscribe:list-post; bh=zFcFkws6UQHqApBrQOYJqJ8jqgeFKceH/qvZ7LNt4WU=; b=ZNOU4PrwBBShJk8Cp8szKWdtun1psENRq9LRvHhDhcu2tCYnrRpEJ/xZjkYLjCahDb/0+8 AkKpt5OSg7P4t9pH9/Bn3gVOdkG+XBebkLcYdkfUUMjPTRMqe2wgO6T5st5b1pkKtDE1+R D1+uLjU6NyuVeBV2WKnGnaE53mJDaPjHxRLC3hNtS4Fxlx9XVVp8TznSUAt/50EDzbQozS fbzFEJkbrB+NrCaWvogNPQKP0G5L7FCBhHUaMNb8vwtIkb2Xrvqf0W7Ex7Oinl8AbHuRo0 v1HdX9zsTTKHiLSMrldB8H5EpAk9g0i39RrLwmiBJln2CbJG4go1YYj8xD3NvA== X-Migadu-Spam-Score: -3.52 X-Migadu-Scanner: scn1.migadu.com Authentication-Results: aspmx1.migadu.com; dkim=none; dmarc=pass (policy=none) header.from=gnu.org; spf=pass (aspmx1.migadu.com: domain of "emacs-orgmode-bounces+larch=yhetil.org@gnu.org" designates 209.51.188.17 as permitted sender) smtp.mailfrom="emacs-orgmode-bounces+larch=yhetil.org@gnu.org" X-Spam-Score: -3.52 X-Migadu-Queue-Id: B16B1398DD X-TUID: mYXV1iOuxPBg Hello Ihor, Thanks for your response. I made some changes accordingly, which can be found here: https://git.sr.ht/~ruijieyu/orgweb/tree/translate/zh-CN--v2 . More responses inline below. Ihor Radchenko writes: > Ruijie Yu via "General discussions about Org-mode." > writes: > >> This is a tentative patchset for orgweb zh_CN translation. > > Thanks! > >> * How do I change the heading for the footnote section? In >> particular, can I set it in a file- or dir-local variable, or in the >> setup.org file? This is needed for _fully_ translating >> /quickstart.org. > > You just need to use #+language: zh-CN (note dash). Thank you, that fixes it. I am therefore updating all traces of "zh_CN" into "zh-CN". >> * Is translating /elpa.org worth it? I presume not, because part of >> it describes the use of the now-deprecated Org Elpa repository. > > This page is, AFAIK, not referenced anywhere. And obsolete. No need to > bother. Noted. I therefore made zh-CN/elpa.org a symlink. >> * I noticed that /resources/postamble.html is unused in all languages. >> Should it be deleted? > > It is used in every single html. See /publish.sh. Got it. I have hence added my translation of postamble.html, and slightly modified publish.sh so that it makes use of the translation. >> * I have added additional notes regarding zero-width spaces, because >> CJK languages rarely use spaces whereas markups need them. I >> presume this is an acceptable addition. >> + This addition would also be helpful for when _eventually_ the >> Japanese version is updated or some other CJK language is added. > > You can also link to https://orgmode.org/manual/Escape-Character.html Got it. >> * I left the changes in a series of commits, each handling one file -- >> please let me know if I should squash them into fewer commits. >> Alternatively, let me know if I should push this to some online Git >> repo. > > Series of commits is ok. I have decided to push the changes to an unlisted cloned project on sourcehut (https://sr.ht/~ruijieyu/orgweb), since otherwise I would have to generate the patchset in every iteration, and attach the files to emails _one by one_ on mu4e. Let me know if you need me to attach the patchset to keep a trace on the ML -- it takes me a while but I can do it. >> * Please let me know if there are any guidelines for commit messages >> which I should follow. > > See https://orgmode.org/worg/org-contribute.html#commit-messages Tried to abide, please confirm. >> * I think the "#+description:" portion of each *.org file can be just >> moved into setup.org? That way we don't duplicate it twenty times. > > Agree. Noted. I did not touch the descriptions outside of zh-CN; please let me know if I should. >> * There are hyperlinks which link to sites unreachable from mainland >> China. I have marked them as "external sites" (=E5=A4=96=E7=BD=91) = for now, but I >> wonder if I should look for equivalent sites accessible from within >> mainland China. > > It will be useful to add alternative websites in Mandarin/Cantonese as a > secondary link. Sounds good, will do on my next iteration. One more question: should I add the secondary link next to the primary link, or should I add them as footnotes? > You should not assume that all the Chinese users experience the same set > of blocked websites. Different provinces have slightly varying rules, > the rules change with time, and Hong Kong in particular is not likely to > block much. Not to mention VPN. Yes, I understand, as I have had first-hand experience on the aforementioned differences. What I have observed is that Wikipedia and Google are the two main sites that came to my mind which are universally blocked from mainland China, both of which are referenced in some degree in the English version. And at least in the case of Wikipedia, I offer to look for alternative sites because the task should be relatively easy for me. [And small nit, Hong Kong is not a province but a S.A.R. :) ] >> * When translating /index.org, I noticed that, within the first >> section, the spacing between the icons and their texts (e.g., the >> rocket icon and its accompanying text "quickstart") in >> /zh_CN/index.org are smaller than that of /index.org. I don't know >> if it is because I unintentionally changed something that caused >> this. > > Timothy, may you take a look? On second look, this may just be because I ran `C-c C-e h h'. I tried to run this command on the English site, and the generated site also behaves like what I described above. I am curious about the differences between `C-c C-e h h' and publish.sh. I didn't run publish.sh because I don't think the publish script should be run locally as-is, since it contains hardcoded paths. >> * Should I mark English links as "English", and if so, how >> aggressively should I mark them? Or do you think it is too >> distracting for readers? I ask because there are some links in /ja >> that are marked as "English". > > I am not sure here. I suggest asking other Chinese users about how > useful it is. > >> - Chinese speakers >> * Please check for consistency on all major terminologies. The >> translation was done during a long timespan, and I may have >> unintentionally chosen different words for the same term on >> different days. >> >> * Please suggest alternative translations for various portions if you >> see fit. There were some portions where I _struggled_ to come up >> with sound translations. > > You may also ask at https://emacs-china.org/ Thanks, I visited it once but had since forgotten about it. I will post the three questions above there within the next few days and hopefully get some feedback about them. --=20 Best, RY