From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: from mp10.migadu.com ([2001:41d0:8:6d80::]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 (256/256 bits)) by ms5.migadu.com with LMTPS id SPxbKOVDz2OGwQAAbAwnHQ (envelope-from ) for ; Tue, 24 Jan 2023 03:35:17 +0100 Received: from aspmx1.migadu.com ([2001:41d0:8:6d80::]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 (256/256 bits)) by mp10.migadu.com with LMTPS id WC51J+VDz2MJHwAAG6o9tA (envelope-from ) for ; Tue, 24 Jan 2023 03:35:17 +0100 Received: from lists.gnu.org (lists.gnu.org [209.51.188.17]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by aspmx1.migadu.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 67AA626F05 for ; Tue, 24 Jan 2023 03:35:17 +0100 (CET) Received: from localhost ([::1] helo=lists1p.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1pK98m-00060W-Jh; Mon, 23 Jan 2023 21:34:28 -0500 Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::10]) by lists.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1pK98k-000604-2X for emacs-orgmode@gnu.org; Mon, 23 Jan 2023 21:34:26 -0500 Received: from ciao.gmane.io ([116.202.254.214]) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1pK98i-0000bR-MO for emacs-orgmode@gnu.org; Mon, 23 Jan 2023 21:34:25 -0500 Received: from list by ciao.gmane.io with local (Exim 4.92) (envelope-from ) id 1pK98g-0001Hs-KY for emacs-orgmode@gnu.org; Tue, 24 Jan 2023 03:34:22 +0100 X-Injected-Via-Gmane: http://gmane.org/ To: emacs-orgmode@gnu.org From: Max Nikulin Subject: Re: UTC or not UTC for timestamps in the past ([FEATURE REQUEST] Timezone support in org-mode) Date: Tue, 24 Jan 2023 09:34:15 +0700 Message-ID: References: <87lelxk87a.fsf@tsdye.online> <63ca5101.630a0220.b2298.3363@mx.google.com> <63cb2d0b.630a0220.f919a.6174@mx.google.com> <63cc5983.620a0220.a7d40.68f6@mx.google.com> <87r0vnhxj6.fsf@tsdye.online> <87ilgyiid8.fsf@tsdye.online> <87edrli4sr.fsf@tsdye.online> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; Linux x86_64; rv:102.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/102.4.2 Content-Language: en-US In-Reply-To: <87edrli4sr.fsf@tsdye.online> Received-SPF: pass client-ip=116.202.254.214; envelope-from=geo-emacs-orgmode@m.gmane-mx.org; helo=ciao.gmane.io X-Spam_score_int: 16 X-Spam_score: 1.6 X-Spam_bar: + X-Spam_report: (1.6 / 5.0 requ) BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_ADSP_CUSTOM_MED=0.001, FORGED_GMAIL_RCVD=1, FORGED_MUA_MOZILLA=2.309, FREEMAIL_FORGED_FROMDOMAIN=0.149, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, HEADER_FROM_DIFFERENT_DOMAINS=0.248, NICE_REPLY_A=-1.147, NML_ADSP_CUSTOM_MED=0.9, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001 autolearn=no autolearn_force=no X-Spam_action: no action X-BeenThere: emacs-orgmode@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: "General discussions about Org-mode." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: emacs-orgmode-bounces+larch=yhetil.org@gnu.org Sender: emacs-orgmode-bounces+larch=yhetil.org@gnu.org X-Migadu-Country: US X-Migadu-Flow: FLOW_IN ARC-Authentication-Results: i=1; aspmx1.migadu.com; dkim=none; spf=pass (aspmx1.migadu.com: domain of "emacs-orgmode-bounces+larch=yhetil.org@gnu.org" designates 209.51.188.17 as permitted sender) smtp.mailfrom="emacs-orgmode-bounces+larch=yhetil.org@gnu.org"; dmarc=fail reason="SPF not aligned (relaxed), No valid DKIM" header.from=gmail.com (policy=none) ARC-Seal: i=1; s=key1; d=yhetil.org; t=1674527717; a=rsa-sha256; cv=none; b=AgeW23nAOeRS2Nz4hCXzkaCfpjz6sQonshYqJHZ30IkBLZ9PMP1ZeWNkG4mL4yDSmI97nN gvg2G+l2w/qunIIuJuCoscYVv+cykOziQokjfd71PwAvAEqbUginbTP0whl9r3L9Wcd/Jp QPhhak8JRjDTWESaodBlGd7fDcE972cXSokDkNZ3mpvNgfFgjblaGO65HaLHQIfjj4ltha pm2M4HVLhUxa5K3530gv+q4HlOSyuuJRuXh0Ya4WjzxHglAfWAjw1t0OzuW8o97UVet8ge OX976cNxnBSW9bek8xXcrZG1VadcQRMHj/3p1e9wy4mxm5HfIh+dTTvFbMuM7Q== ARC-Message-Signature: i=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=yhetil.org; s=key1; t=1674527717; h=from:from:sender:sender:reply-to:subject:subject:date:date: message-id:message-id:to:to:cc:mime-version:mime-version: content-type:content-type: content-transfer-encoding:content-transfer-encoding: in-reply-to:in-reply-to:references:references:list-id:list-help: list-unsubscribe:list-subscribe:list-post; bh=z0nla6rCYMNWQOJ1LaBYTyJw+EdYGiCCSLlVDF5Th5Y=; b=ovjMdxZohy484mkK8PrBNQ6lJwnf3m/KBxz0RrJ/d8BVpAX2LWQzpJ+wkU+nQda5ETtfK1 lDyTmxXX8j7r36JDh5kX4WDGRfJO9NXr1rUd1ld+jW+xf0OgaSUlXuvFrom9GFcMS+KuYa h0LWWBOYda/UW+mVa7U/LzZTMg8yXVpAlo8F0ZhxxpKA8+gSZEDc14b21mu5mmj9bm/mP+ YqVhZ1tAyt+2HsZDUoZXVupHqUfcaKq0QzZs60HlVCJXjTlF6v/nmHo47AE9gDxu/Nl6sQ xCIAfLFBF33A1x4CbRx9811SfrCp7bNpjbdqtx6JyehFjOyrUHf6HZNeTIFYMA== X-Spam-Score: -1.09 X-Migadu-Queue-Id: 67AA626F05 X-Migadu-Scanner: scn0.migadu.com Authentication-Results: aspmx1.migadu.com; dkim=none; spf=pass (aspmx1.migadu.com: domain of "emacs-orgmode-bounces+larch=yhetil.org@gnu.org" designates 209.51.188.17 as permitted sender) smtp.mailfrom="emacs-orgmode-bounces+larch=yhetil.org@gnu.org"; dmarc=fail reason="SPF not aligned (relaxed), No valid DKIM" header.from=gmail.com (policy=none) X-Migadu-Spam-Score: -1.09 X-TUID: cf9p8VEoWDpn On 23/01/2023 23:04, Thomas S. Dye wrote: >> I understand above that it is easier understandable when reading >> [2023-01-22 Sun 08:29@+1100] as it is assumed by poster (I guess Max) >> that user will understand that there is +11 hours ahead. >> > Yes, the offset here is ambiguous--is it offset from some timezone or > from UTC? Are you aware of usage base time other than UTC nowadays? My impression is that various libraries do not allow to get such formats easily. That is why e.g. web sites tends to present time in the server timezone (often not explicitly specified) or use JavaScript to convert it to browser timezone. I believed that [2023-01-22 Sun 08:29@+1100] unambiguously suggests offset from UTC. Are there local references that may confuse users? I mean something like 9 hours ahead of Moscow (Asia/Kamchatka) used in USSR.