From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: from mp12.migadu.com ([2001:41d0:2:bcc0::]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 (256/256 bits)) by ms5.migadu.com with LMTPS id 8F/mCncVWGMqvwAAbAwnHQ (envelope-from ) for ; Tue, 25 Oct 2022 18:57:27 +0200 Received: from aspmx1.migadu.com ([2001:41d0:2:bcc0::]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 (256/256 bits)) by mp12.migadu.com with LMTPS id qI/gCncVWGN07AAAauVa8A (envelope-from ) for ; Tue, 25 Oct 2022 18:57:27 +0200 Received: from lists.gnu.org (lists.gnu.org [209.51.188.17]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by aspmx1.migadu.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id D0FCC37B75 for ; Tue, 25 Oct 2022 18:57:26 +0200 (CEST) Received: from localhost ([::1] helo=lists1p.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1onNE5-00016p-Sz; Tue, 25 Oct 2022 12:56:30 -0400 Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::10]) by lists.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1onNE3-0000ij-OA for emacs-orgmode@gnu.org; Tue, 25 Oct 2022 12:56:28 -0400 Received: from ciao.gmane.io ([116.202.254.214]) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1onNE1-0004hn-JZ for emacs-orgmode@gnu.org; Tue, 25 Oct 2022 12:56:27 -0400 Received: from list by ciao.gmane.io with local (Exim 4.92) (envelope-from ) id 1onNDz-000A1r-I2 for emacs-orgmode@gnu.org; Tue, 25 Oct 2022 18:56:23 +0200 X-Injected-Via-Gmane: http://gmane.org/ To: emacs-orgmode@gnu.org From: Max Nikulin Subject: Re: Best android app Date: Tue, 25 Oct 2022 23:56:15 +0700 Message-ID: References: <6ce1e2e6-3d21-4ee0-9e3c-80f424984a60@gmail.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; Linux x86_64; rv:102.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/102.2.2 Content-Language: en-US In-Reply-To: Received-SPF: pass client-ip=116.202.254.214; envelope-from=geo-emacs-orgmode@m.gmane-mx.org; helo=ciao.gmane.io X-Spam_score_int: 26 X-Spam_score: 2.6 X-Spam_bar: ++ X-Spam_report: (2.6 / 5.0 requ) BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_ADSP_CUSTOM_MED=0.001, FORGED_GMAIL_RCVD=1, FORGED_MUA_MOZILLA=2.309, FREEMAIL_FORGED_FROMDOMAIN=0.001, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, HEADER_FROM_DIFFERENT_DOMAINS=0.25, NICE_REPLY_A=-0.001, NML_ADSP_CUSTOM_MED=0.9, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001 autolearn=no autolearn_force=no X-Spam_action: no action X-BeenThere: emacs-orgmode@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: "General discussions about Org-mode." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: "Emacs-orgmode" Errors-To: emacs-orgmode-bounces+larch=yhetil.org@gnu.org X-Migadu-Flow: FLOW_IN X-Migadu-Country: US ARC-Message-Signature: i=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=yhetil.org; s=key1; t=1666717046; h=from:from:sender:sender:reply-to:subject:subject:date:date: message-id:message-id:to:to:cc:mime-version:mime-version: content-type:content-type: content-transfer-encoding:content-transfer-encoding: in-reply-to:in-reply-to:references:references:list-id:list-help: list-unsubscribe:list-subscribe:list-post; bh=Hk0p4dW+ExpBd8mCsGAcvdgQsYah1exrQ+47CMW7tds=; b=iVFP9a/3oZWtp0lDlJh92OKdpjjRj5+8HdeEK427WYEjaNvMFS4CU+1z7ZLVQT4YJC2rxw R8NM468bJyTFYFBWVZoRGRUZyGHZzaTsQXTYemRHfrycQF5zsubgL/n3Pomr8dpoP8wBoV fyQqmnP72OxhIfT1USt4Ip3jI0bhhsI013AQtIU/M6tGBXaZuBY/Z3MqO2UfasqK/nHEpm 0ydfqiH7vfZexx8Uya+/og3Bw02q04XfZTyNMaBki8k2nug6ioso/NJDQZ06gmhRrwzFLo 5JKnxXvR9p9k2rNJWhjlWA8iduw48W1IWwc5iV20xP6/DWe4jRZs+T/oVGiM3A== ARC-Seal: i=1; s=key1; d=yhetil.org; t=1666717046; a=rsa-sha256; cv=none; b=Mus4IvyuUGUAZHeCJTO0KrWB1ym7/2gdO+4POBW7Dr0kqgPUToSU8BFaxvnSzs9kewrc2a Vv92dZf33NyqHG5YJ+T0rsWWPi15/NLc73a2OIkbIpconu1VWYxSdnvXCco1JCyuBtsD6D LUeTCiOOShei6WSlc0yyaGaGTiV/DBpXgGZ5AYho28a8yfgEgWUeVeUuQr9TYrf74xVX5t CS70tkaS8Y1Z/IQZME0rrTiREQ/ksfT3S7KaZKKhg+4F/kCNsjhfbFsbKPWot5VmG6IMFz 3YxxyZmuZuQYhgLLxPiCSI/JJo+e7MwVrneWfCjWzyIoBSuHEn2fhEPkmyZh5A== ARC-Authentication-Results: i=1; aspmx1.migadu.com; dkim=none; dmarc=fail reason="SPF not aligned (relaxed), No valid DKIM" header.from=gmail.com (policy=none); spf=pass (aspmx1.migadu.com: domain of "emacs-orgmode-bounces+larch=yhetil.org@gnu.org" designates 209.51.188.17 as permitted sender) smtp.mailfrom="emacs-orgmode-bounces+larch=yhetil.org@gnu.org" X-Migadu-Spam-Score: 1.99 Authentication-Results: aspmx1.migadu.com; dkim=none; dmarc=fail reason="SPF not aligned (relaxed), No valid DKIM" header.from=gmail.com (policy=none); spf=pass (aspmx1.migadu.com: domain of "emacs-orgmode-bounces+larch=yhetil.org@gnu.org" designates 209.51.188.17 as permitted sender) smtp.mailfrom="emacs-orgmode-bounces+larch=yhetil.org@gnu.org" X-Migadu-Queue-Id: D0FCC37B75 X-Spam-Score: 1.99 X-Migadu-Scanner: scn0.migadu.com X-TUID: w3OeUhj6Th28 On 20/10/2022 06:46, Jean Louis wrote: > * Max Nikulin [2022-10-19 15:53]: >> The person may be already familiar with that non-free apps. We had >> a chance to ask about features missed in free applications and actual >> experience. Perhaps the same tasks may be performed in a bit different >> and less obvious way and no modification of Org and Co is required. >> However you insist that we have to through away such possibilities and >> adding outcome from such conversations to web site is prohibited, so it >> makes it significantly harder to use obtained information in later >> discussions. >> Better balanced position is necessary otherwise it would be just weakness in >> communication with people who do not care if some software is free. > > Then such people have the chance to learn what is free software. Their > weakness is not to know what it is. I mean weakness of free software proponents. People will learn nothing if they meet just unreasonably harsh reaction or absence of convincing arguments. >>> I find it unfortunate that some people create proprietary software >>> that uses Org files. >> >> It sounds like you regret about absence of a kind of vendor lock. File >> formats and communication protocols must be free. There are enough examples >> when free software can not be developed due to lack of specifications. Why >> would you expect cooperation from vendors if you wish to have fences at your >> side in similar cases? > > Vendor: > https://www.gnu.org/philosophy/words-to-avoid.html#Vendor My mistake is that precise term should be "vendor lock-in". I am not a native English speaker, but I believe that the word "vendor" was used properly. I meant namely vendors, not suppliers. > You have misunderstood the idea. I have never mentioned "absence of a > kind of vendor lock" or similar. > > So let us close that discussion and keep creating free software. You expressed that you do not like that some proprietary software uses Org file. Such position is mirroring behavior of software vendors that are trying to prevent usage of file formats by other developers (vendor lock-in). More people considering restrictions on file formats acceptable means more obstacles for development of free software.