From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: from mp11.migadu.com ([2001:41d0:8:6d80::]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 (256/256 bits)) by ms5.migadu.com with LMTPS id gGkrCc30sWJJJgAAbAwnHQ (envelope-from ) for ; Tue, 21 Jun 2022 18:41:49 +0200 Received: from aspmx1.migadu.com ([2001:41d0:8:6d80::]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 (256/256 bits)) by mp11.migadu.com with LMTPS id QM4VCc30sWIJHwAA9RJhRA (envelope-from ) for ; Tue, 21 Jun 2022 18:41:49 +0200 Received: from lists.gnu.org (lists.gnu.org [209.51.188.17]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by aspmx1.migadu.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id CED909F64 for ; Tue, 21 Jun 2022 18:41:48 +0200 (CEST) Received: from localhost ([::1]:54212 helo=lists1p.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1o3gwl-0004yH-1c for larch@yhetil.org; Tue, 21 Jun 2022 12:41:47 -0400 Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::10]:48918) by lists.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1o3guq-0004xL-Vi for emacs-orgmode@gnu.org; Tue, 21 Jun 2022 12:39:48 -0400 Received: from ciao.gmane.io ([116.202.254.214]:44186) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1o3gud-0001vs-DU for emacs-orgmode@gnu.org; Tue, 21 Jun 2022 12:39:48 -0400 Received: from list by ciao.gmane.io with local (Exim 4.92) (envelope-from ) id 1o3guW-00027j-OK for emacs-orgmode@gnu.org; Tue, 21 Jun 2022 18:39:28 +0200 X-Injected-Via-Gmane: http://gmane.org/ To: emacs-orgmode@gnu.org From: Max Nikulin Subject: Re: About 'inline special blocks' Date: Tue, 21 Jun 2022 23:39:17 +0700 Message-ID: References: <87a6b8pbhg.fsf@posteo.net> <875ykwvmz7.fsf@posteo.net> <87bkunb1e5.fsf@posteo.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; Linux x86_64; rv:91.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/91.9.1 Content-Language: en-US In-Reply-To: <87bkunb1e5.fsf@posteo.net> Received-SPF: pass client-ip=116.202.254.214; envelope-from=geo-emacs-orgmode@m.gmane-mx.org; helo=ciao.gmane.io X-Spam_score_int: 28 X-Spam_score: 2.8 X-Spam_bar: ++ X-Spam_report: (2.8 / 5.0 requ) BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_ADSP_CUSTOM_MED=0.001, FORGED_GMAIL_RCVD=1, FORGED_MUA_MOZILLA=2.309, FREEMAIL_FORGED_FROMDOMAIN=0.249, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, HEADER_FROM_DIFFERENT_DOMAINS=0.249, NICE_REPLY_A=-0.001, NML_ADSP_CUSTOM_MED=0.9, T_SCC_BODY_TEXT_LINE=-0.01, T_SPF_HELO_TEMPERROR=0.01, T_SPF_TEMPERROR=0.01 autolearn=no autolearn_force=no X-Spam_action: no action X-BeenThere: emacs-orgmode@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: "General discussions about Org-mode." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: emacs-orgmode-bounces+larch=yhetil.org@gnu.org Sender: "Emacs-orgmode" X-Migadu-Flow: FLOW_IN X-Migadu-To: larch@yhetil.org X-Migadu-Country: US ARC-Message-Signature: i=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=yhetil.org; s=key1; t=1655829709; h=from:from:sender:sender:reply-to:subject:subject:date:date: message-id:message-id:to:to:cc:mime-version:mime-version: content-type:content-type: content-transfer-encoding:content-transfer-encoding: in-reply-to:in-reply-to:references:references:list-id:list-help: list-unsubscribe:list-subscribe:list-post; bh=ZhSIvqpiaQ3XSfa+CojC2BWxgUcgG7y5OAPbQ0IC/Vg=; b=YE/2nVI8TluHPFy28l32iChN/TIZsjBXH2DMsIgaw3T1UelxSaM5gi3jEKQ7H6hJ7BAuYF oMRqkcejfIg5h4tAGjUY4e0NmxQp0GU0aB0UyDej86OP0XxyS6U7ex+vrL4JHuW29gHQQx 1QZXl8SaMQ7rbdH6hauwz0neWUPu2JzhU/1d/lyGDtMjaLJDsqmalKlbi3ijXsgE4oZQ1C w9YW7N60FUmk3X2gorXbTRaLt7PWGhmPRT8HmWODjS16vhnF50DFY1b4pOrJm8YsY5kaEI sQhocj+B7cwfjQOoZ9owpMZPIqfRltP7v2OdaRwLIslyaqEYBhLVythfiOddaQ== ARC-Seal: i=1; s=key1; d=yhetil.org; t=1655829709; a=rsa-sha256; cv=none; b=Qv3WmdgO9Raa+LvU0Lkk4NHvW2ppxhRlQ0MPo62r1hain4kf39fbu7iYC7UYEbx+n8yIdU jaOZ9mxsV5Og2O9U2SnwEf2UBOLLnZ9FiwrqmkLw6SI1iDAkmRJAKjWGchMVribbnvd0no okkpPJ0H+leVtWXNtUHzOOpVE5Vm7QCJ5l/apCosFVaGCfO8PI+yridF2qTY25I8Fjc4xC G+gYxLEsRBjTtr21aYmwhq+QXMqE34/JO6grEhN8JTh1U29960BbyffWwX+x678g+SlkI2 E9i4bwn3RJhdNfvEAaXfedK0gjcqL6Y45y+WZccwwDIhB+U+OBaUD9e2l65E0w== ARC-Authentication-Results: i=1; aspmx1.migadu.com; dkim=none; dmarc=fail reason="SPF not aligned (relaxed), No valid DKIM" header.from=gmail.com (policy=none); spf=pass (aspmx1.migadu.com: domain of "emacs-orgmode-bounces+larch=yhetil.org@gnu.org" designates 209.51.188.17 as permitted sender) smtp.mailfrom="emacs-orgmode-bounces+larch=yhetil.org@gnu.org" X-Migadu-Spam-Score: 4.42 Authentication-Results: aspmx1.migadu.com; dkim=none; dmarc=fail reason="SPF not aligned (relaxed), No valid DKIM" header.from=gmail.com (policy=none); spf=pass (aspmx1.migadu.com: domain of "emacs-orgmode-bounces+larch=yhetil.org@gnu.org" designates 209.51.188.17 as permitted sender) smtp.mailfrom="emacs-orgmode-bounces+larch=yhetil.org@gnu.org" X-Migadu-Queue-Id: CED909F64 X-Spam-Score: 4.42 X-Migadu-Scanner: scn0.migadu.com X-TUID: 5xOuLPVz+S9G On 21/06/2022 02:06, Juan Manuel Macías wrote: > Max Nikulin writes: > >> I would like to stress that styles can not be a rescue in some >> important cases. Let's leave aside ad hoc final tuning of formatting. >> In the case of HTML export there are still Description and >> attributes that are namely >> per-object, not part of style. > > You are right, but my question is: Could there be a similar use case > within inline special blocks? Keep in mind that this (for now, > hypothetical) element type would be intended only for very short > segments of text within the paragraph. I don't find a scenario where > it's worth overloading that with options and attributes, IMHO. Juan Manuel, your answer is not clear for me. Direct formatting is another issue. There are cases when attributes are part of *content*, not formatting. If alternative text for images and description of links are not convincing, there is e.g. Org document may be exported as HTML file. Do you consider inline special blocks solely for formatting and only for the kind of it that may be expressed through styles? Then attributes for inline objects should be another feature with its own syntax. >>> in html: >>> contents> >> >> Concerning vs. , is it the same for >> assistive technologies like screen readers to add >> text (or text) and > class="strong">text with "font-weight: bolder;" in CSS? > > "contents>": it was my confusion, sorry. I already explained > it here: https://list.orgmode.org/8735g0tnoh.fsf@posteo.net/ I am unsure that content should not be supported at all. However I admit that difference of the following code may be insignificant in reality: Do not do it! vs. Do not do it!