From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: from mp12.migadu.com ([2001:41d0:2:4a6f::]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 (256/256 bits)) by ms5.migadu.com with LMTPS id +FRGCHvkwmM2awAAbAwnHQ (envelope-from ) for ; Sat, 14 Jan 2023 18:20:59 +0100 Received: from aspmx1.migadu.com ([2001:41d0:2:4a6f::]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 (256/256 bits)) by mp12.migadu.com with LMTPS id WDseCHvkwmOdfgEAauVa8A (envelope-from ) for ; Sat, 14 Jan 2023 18:20:59 +0100 Received: from lists.gnu.org (lists.gnu.org [209.51.188.17]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by aspmx1.migadu.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id EFC7A2F64B for ; Sat, 14 Jan 2023 18:14:28 +0100 (CET) Received: from localhost ([::1] helo=lists1p.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1pGk6J-0005dz-L2; Sat, 14 Jan 2023 12:13:51 -0500 Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::10]) by lists.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1pGk6H-0005di-E2 for emacs-orgmode@gnu.org; Sat, 14 Jan 2023 12:13:49 -0500 Received: from mail.tuxteam.de ([5.199.139.25]) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1pGk6F-0007Gr-7D for emacs-orgmode@gnu.org; Sat, 14 Jan 2023 12:13:49 -0500 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; q=dns/txt; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=tuxteam.de; s=mail; h=In-Reply-To:Content-Type:MIME-Version:References:Message-ID:Subject :Cc:To:From:Date:Sender:Reply-To:Content-Transfer-Encoding:Content-ID: Content-Description:Resent-Date:Resent-From:Resent-Sender:Resent-To:Resent-Cc :Resent-Message-ID:List-Id:List-Help:List-Unsubscribe:List-Subscribe: List-Post:List-Owner:List-Archive; bh=MluDoX7bnN1hNDf2BKEKbp8geIun1Nmh3+HgOeVY7Kg=; b=OCVUbHQRHEeur7iRTFfBZ7Cw7S l8pv64y8qhs8/vboyXsPKpgQctyFnvTMAtFSRpI0u/AhbfBHk+joNijoxv/g0PK63Md8BngLn5A+4 QI0JOXfUU9eq0QuXYMR3lNTAEJvap9cpAg0QElh+G00przHT1cXMSw8OrKmX54RB7WR2jSE1iMW6E 6HZajD/QZK/ZU5ZA4DegqDxoU4AKQHsbGQyJh8sw/WUv712uhmEvIYXyLihxMEe8+gxWS/E3aRMlk 1bVjkzELC1A+8gyaDrRkprqJj9t9/1I74UTU9/Y+CQt53FPj3pgqXg/6UMrvqw5JZiTyO4pQJVL6s RoKYH+8w==; Received: from tomas by mail.tuxteam.de with local (Exim 4.94.2) (envelope-from ) id 1pGk6B-00076u-Fp; Sat, 14 Jan 2023 18:13:43 +0100 Date: Sat, 14 Jan 2023 18:13:43 +0100 From: tomas@tuxteam.de To: Ihor Radchenko Cc: emacs-orgmode@gnu.org Subject: Re: [FEATURE REQUEST] Timezone support in org-mode datestamps and org-agenda Message-ID: References: <63c287ca.a70a0220.4bd14.873b@mx.google.com> <87pmbh1hgx.fsf@localhost> <63c2b8e4.a70a0220.e3b6d.0051@mx.google.com> <87edrxyyeq.fsf@localhost> <87bkn1yx59.fsf@localhost> <87lem582qw.fsf@localhost> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/signed; micalg=pgp-sha1; protocol="application/pgp-signature"; boundary="Ws/W0mB9EBdNfMsO" Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: <87lem582qw.fsf@localhost> Received-SPF: pass client-ip=5.199.139.25; envelope-from=tomas@tuxteam.de; helo=mail.tuxteam.de X-Spam_score_int: -20 X-Spam_score: -2.1 X-Spam_bar: -- X-Spam_report: (-2.1 / 5.0 requ) BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_EF=-0.1, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001 autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no X-Spam_action: no action X-BeenThere: emacs-orgmode@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: "General discussions about Org-mode." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: emacs-orgmode-bounces+larch=yhetil.org@gnu.org Sender: emacs-orgmode-bounces+larch=yhetil.org@gnu.org X-Migadu-Country: US X-Migadu-Flow: FLOW_IN ARC-Seal: i=1; s=key1; d=yhetil.org; t=1673716469; a=rsa-sha256; cv=none; b=UpCQ0q93+CJ75svPxI8ybAPlSICfn6loq/7IzZjWzqj2KPgKAiWC6+/mslYbfhQ4d/c/yA XuuoPNMVY47/hOR3b0W8wqP8ZVPkmojkzlC79t0Xsf4xX+p9394IhMnT3UEF2Y6MKDFWFW ZH3NIvdm4Q23V47PJuS2wULxrF+YgRHCldb0J5G2JdRmrCB8qCyNIhXFJjrrv7Qd5WjJky y5EKJ/3GTCRmAsGJXlkfNj7tOw49Sjf++aN36Ihht4tdxCHeRZSwwv/WaFvnJJbETla7gx PJLaQnb6eNxXQ70pJIAhH0oMz6Lx/dinvoz2cV5NTs6/oZQc04OxW1XEZKAdfQ== ARC-Authentication-Results: i=1; aspmx1.migadu.com; dkim=fail ("headers rsa verify failed") header.d=tuxteam.de header.s=mail header.b=OCVUbHQR; spf=pass (aspmx1.migadu.com: domain of "emacs-orgmode-bounces+larch=yhetil.org@gnu.org" designates 209.51.188.17 as permitted sender) smtp.mailfrom="emacs-orgmode-bounces+larch=yhetil.org@gnu.org"; dmarc=none ARC-Message-Signature: i=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=yhetil.org; s=key1; t=1673716469; h=from:from:sender:sender:reply-to:subject:subject:date:date: message-id:message-id:to:to:cc:cc:mime-version:mime-version: content-type:content-type:in-reply-to:in-reply-to: references:references:list-id:list-help:list-unsubscribe: list-subscribe:list-post:dkim-signature; bh=MluDoX7bnN1hNDf2BKEKbp8geIun1Nmh3+HgOeVY7Kg=; b=kAu/+oNKYfyV0hd28yOIxf1fODHLQDYockagFZSonea8EfyFTRAvPxh7e8QQC6rZcgS16G yxfU3/aa5zvv9XY+0nhDoRBtqAVXQ/5LWmEL2RKULqCSsvq4/fYhUnqNPV7R25ZEDoZm52 w3keDbBpKZf3ZtfYxKV1m43YkK/b8IZzxFk9UGg1ZETj8p9EZ2SOMRruryPSg26o1XJXq7 4Xj82bfCJr1CBGDx9rRUQCrKn3EwXqixMl+zt4uy2WVncQR/5Ou9M0Guro7HTfw3mC34+N srFel/zTsjSDTSshQPckcYbsYBb88kvA8tfdyAijrooWFd9xt5lSLA41wVnLaA== X-Migadu-Spam-Score: -4.01 X-Spam-Score: -4.01 X-Migadu-Queue-Id: EFC7A2F64B X-Migadu-Scanner: scn1.migadu.com Authentication-Results: aspmx1.migadu.com; dkim=fail ("headers rsa verify failed") header.d=tuxteam.de header.s=mail header.b=OCVUbHQR; spf=pass (aspmx1.migadu.com: domain of "emacs-orgmode-bounces+larch=yhetil.org@gnu.org" designates 209.51.188.17 as permitted sender) smtp.mailfrom="emacs-orgmode-bounces+larch=yhetil.org@gnu.org"; dmarc=none X-TUID: VsjKwmI47x21 --Ws/W0mB9EBdNfMsO Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Disposition: inline Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable On Sat, Jan 14, 2023 at 05:06:31PM +0000, Ihor Radchenko wrote: > tomas@tuxteam.de writes: >=20 > >> ... Having an > >> ability to specify time zones manually will already cater needs for a > >> number of users. > > > > Definitely. But the time stamp (with time zone) in itself doesn't > > carry enough context to actually decide that [...] > This is basically what we have now - conform to "current" system time > zone. We are not going to remove this timestamp style. Just add an > ability to explicitly specify the timestamps if needed. IMO that totally makes sense. Most people just use time naively and aren't around at half-past-three in the night when things happen :) > > When you have appointments with people in totally diverse time zones, > > perhaps dates tend to be more fixed wrt UTC. >=20 > AFAIK, people don't usually bother. As long as you can map from specific > time zone (applying the currently active summer clock time changes) to > something like seconds from epoch, you can always calculate back to you > preferred time zone. Look at https://www.emacswiki.org/emacs/Usergroups. > They say, for example, "Europe/Berlin", which may be either CET or CEST. >=20 > In any case, selection of time zone for user timestamps is not something > we need to worry about in Org code. Users are to decide. Org might > assist, but I do not see anything meaningful we can do to help with DST. What I can imagine being useful (besides allowing timestamps to carry that extra info) is the possibility to set defaults, perhaps at the file (even, who knows, at the heading) level. A special attribute seems pretty adequate, if I'm not missing some monster. Cheers --=20 t --Ws/W0mB9EBdNfMsO Content-Type: application/pgp-signature; name="signature.asc" -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- iF0EABECAB0WIQRp53liolZD6iXhAoIFyCz1etHaRgUCY8LixwAKCRAFyCz1etHa Rj6bAJwI8Dz+ZCKcxTPYZOaItfd3bYJaogCggRg35YgobotvS0+fTPW3B8AcPZ0= =3qoD -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- --Ws/W0mB9EBdNfMsO--