From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: from mp11.migadu.com ([2001:41d0:8:6d80::]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 (256/256 bits)) by ms5.migadu.com with LMTPS id 8K7hGpdetWOzKwAAbAwnHQ (envelope-from ) for ; Wed, 04 Jan 2023 12:10:15 +0100 Received: from aspmx1.migadu.com ([2001:41d0:8:6d80::]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 (256/256 bits)) by mp11.migadu.com with LMTPS id mGnoGpdetWOMYAAA9RJhRA (envelope-from ) for ; Wed, 04 Jan 2023 12:10:15 +0100 Received: from lists.gnu.org (lists.gnu.org [209.51.188.17]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by aspmx1.migadu.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 10AD72477A for ; Wed, 4 Jan 2023 12:10:14 +0100 (CET) Received: from localhost ([::1] helo=lists1p.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1pD1eL-0007Wf-Hs; Wed, 04 Jan 2023 06:09:37 -0500 Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::10]) by lists.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1pD1eK-0007WV-Aq for emacs-orgmode@gnu.org; Wed, 04 Jan 2023 06:09:36 -0500 Received: from stw1.rcdrun.com ([217.170.207.13]) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1pD1eG-0003PQ-6z for emacs-orgmode@gnu.org; Wed, 04 Jan 2023 06:09:36 -0500 Received: from localhost ([::ffff:197.239.10.238]) (AUTH: PLAIN admin, TLS: TLS1.3,256bits,ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384) by stw1.rcdrun.com with ESMTPSA id 0000000000055D66.0000000063B55E6C.000066AD; Wed, 04 Jan 2023 04:09:32 -0700 Date: Wed, 4 Jan 2023 14:08:44 +0300 From: Jean Louis To: Max Nikulin Cc: emacs-orgmode@gnu.org Subject: Re: Export Org with Org concept -- Re: Problems with C-c C-e file.org, Message-ID: Mail-Followup-To: Max Nikulin , emacs-orgmode@gnu.org References: <878rj469sk.fsf@localhost> <877cy673ot.fsf@localhost> <87edsckkym.fsf@localhost> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: User-Agent: Mutt/2.2.9+54 (af2080d) (2022-11-21) Received-SPF: pass client-ip=217.170.207.13; envelope-from=bugs@gnu.support; helo=stw1.rcdrun.com X-Spam_score_int: -17 X-Spam_score: -1.8 X-Spam_bar: - X-Spam_report: (-1.8 / 5.0 requ) BAYES_00=-1.9, GAPPY_SUBJECT=0.1, SPF_HELO_PASS=-0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001 autolearn=no autolearn_force=no X-Spam_action: no action X-BeenThere: emacs-orgmode@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: "General discussions about Org-mode." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: emacs-orgmode-bounces+larch=yhetil.org@gnu.org Sender: emacs-orgmode-bounces+larch=yhetil.org@gnu.org X-Migadu-Country: US X-Migadu-Flow: FLOW_IN ARC-Message-Signature: i=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=yhetil.org; s=key1; t=1672830615; h=from:from:sender:sender:reply-to:subject:subject:date:date: message-id:message-id:to:to:cc:cc:mime-version:mime-version: content-type:content-type: content-transfer-encoding:content-transfer-encoding: in-reply-to:in-reply-to:references:references:list-id:list-help: list-unsubscribe:list-subscribe:list-post; bh=3pOxKEdnFcfKmPTIXitUeI80EMlPbPqBVyfMCDKhioo=; b=T2I61+lUTAH2tkMbjt3HHfa6s/4zRwKfn9jFpLvTrfXbgM7X/EtJbk9JHRSQK9EVrScwtC g5bkwZjzi2xplMabiGgEusXjRwfEpsEp00jwLWuPAsuagUYBn5DZsBLTIYc9BcN6pgBmJb KU/zP10hzGaQkO8EOT+0jLKBQLH0iqD16+3MckwS492dmFCXcTxpll5MMIpitFkpZs1ntR qQPLIpc7lk2bHNYU2WZHFVu2+HF+MGxJqm1K7wIQPYsVYGxfElcX9WVogl6Eg2k1WDnQRN eNK8QInkyUtUOV3A3I/kLxPhcXuDBfBx4C03XP00/BjzHRtX7lOOH1kNJZsKFg== ARC-Authentication-Results: i=1; aspmx1.migadu.com; dkim=none; spf=pass (aspmx1.migadu.com: domain of "emacs-orgmode-bounces+larch=yhetil.org@gnu.org" designates 209.51.188.17 as permitted sender) smtp.mailfrom="emacs-orgmode-bounces+larch=yhetil.org@gnu.org"; dmarc=none ARC-Seal: i=1; s=key1; d=yhetil.org; t=1672830615; a=rsa-sha256; cv=none; b=hk941UAJM1+lN4OdrKiAeuJNbltsrSemilqjPKwxlrsPtu2xEsqiCn4R3zdhZBcMfhOPwD N1XZyWWonCbZnK/lnfmUM8oCdFaPUxpG+IKTwp0508nrU83YQv0QGNaj48KislQQ10lgzW 2/tpRs3aR7rSV8lGSKBfjJ1KxWO9SF+3PB71mhc/UXr3evCibaPe7oVazh0hjSVM0EQ6sK NY0qklSi2yUm+ZoyAT1BC7hQsjxXwdwHejJLW6VFvVKRZST+K6j2LNjRG/1rhNzv839VwT Y4ki5ooyKxFtmge+deUoZ7xmdmgSFqHWImhmmJwkhfKiuiPI3zjUrPJSvJnF3Q== X-Spam-Score: -2.36 X-Migadu-Queue-Id: 10AD72477A Authentication-Results: aspmx1.migadu.com; dkim=none; spf=pass (aspmx1.migadu.com: domain of "emacs-orgmode-bounces+larch=yhetil.org@gnu.org" designates 209.51.188.17 as permitted sender) smtp.mailfrom="emacs-orgmode-bounces+larch=yhetil.org@gnu.org"; dmarc=none X-Migadu-Scanner: scn1.migadu.com X-Migadu-Spam-Score: -2.36 X-TUID: J9MxWaV42Dl1 * Max Nikulin [2023-01-03 15:18]: > Eduardo, I am sorry, but from my opinion it is too much. Perhaps you are > just not realizing that resources of developers are rather limited. Getting > rid of `read-char-exclusive' in Org menus requires significant amount of > work. Yeah, right, I have spent few hours to make GNU Emacs package: rcd-org-export.el -- use Org to export Org: 2022-12-25 18:16:06.397296+03 https://gnu.support/gnu-emacs/packages/GNU-Emacs-package-rcd-org-export-el-use-Org-to-export-Org-76272.html And from there I developed RCD Dashboard on 2022-12-25 17:44:11.336142+03 GNU Emacs package: rcd-dashboard.el -- Tool to build Emacs dashboards: https://gnu.support/gnu-emacs/packages/GNU-Emacs-package-rcd-dashboard-el-Tool-to-build-Emacs-dashboards-76668.html And now I have full set of dashboards with people being assigned to tasks, plans, programs, projects, agenda, etc. Because I can't agree to your statements, that is why I use the user friendly Org mode based RCD Org Export Dashboard instead of standard Org blocking, user-unfriendly one. > Nobody argues that it would be a great improvement, but it is > necessary to make changes that are not obvious at first glance. It > would lead to confusing behavior otherwise. Nothing is obvious when it is not obvious. I got it. > Jean might be happy with the posted mock-up. The posted mock-up is not any more mock-up but daily used dashboard to export Org. > Unfortunately that code is too far from been ready to be used for > all users. So how far? Like few hours? > E.g. it does not use `org-export-registered-backends', not to > mention that all menus in the package should be consistent. I am aware of it, thanks. Feel free to make it. Do you really need it? Though, we speak here of non-blicking Org Export, and there are many ways to do it, we speak of decisions that are not user friendly, made before more than 10 years. There was enough time to use whatever one wish. I can't wait for somebody in mainstream Org to make it user friendly, mouse clickable, and so there is enough of it for you to adapt it to your own needs as in main stream. If you people wish. If you look at the RCD Dashboard, then how "menus" should look like may be left to user to decide. So far nobody uses my package that I know, and in that case, I will not keep improving what is not so far found as interesting for users. It works for me so well. That is why I use it. Feel free to bend your fingers with C-c C-e C-a C-f C-s, and I will keep using the mouse device to export Org. > It is OK to have a bunch of repetitive code for a demo, but it can > not be taken as is. You have not say that you like the functionality. Underlying repetitive stuff is not important. And I rather like that repetitive style than the Gordian knot of the Org code. > I am lost what is your actual needs after your request to rewrite > the export dispatcher for you. It can be rewritten in simple text, actually in Org mode alone it can work. That is up to those who are interested. Why develop something when there is no interest? I guess it must be 5-6 years that I was talking about sharing headings by e-mail, XMPP, SMS, etc. and since then I have received bunch of dollars because of those features. None of it was implemented in Org, because sharing is not part of it, or decisions, or developers burdens, etc. That is example of "why develop features when there is no interest for it". Good that Emacs is extensible by every user, otherwise it would be one way road with Org. -- Jean Take action in Free Software Foundation campaigns: https://www.fsf.org/campaigns In support of Richard M. Stallman https://stallmansupport.org/