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Fri, 9 Dec 2022 19:51:33 +0000 Received: from SJ0PR03MB5455.namprd03.prod.outlook.com ([fe80::e016:84f7:daad:916e]) by SJ0PR03MB5455.namprd03.prod.outlook.com ([fe80::e016:84f7:daad:916e%3]) with mapi id 15.20.5880.018; Fri, 9 Dec 2022 19:51:33 +0000 From: David Masterson To: "Cook, Malcolm" Cc: Eli Zaretskii , "michel@schi.nz" , "emacs-orgmode@gnu.org" , "59882@debbugs.gnu.org" <59882@debbugs.gnu.org> Subject: Re: bug#59882: Multiple versions of Org in load-path problem References: <87tu27jq7h.fsf@localhost> <87k032nyok.fsf@localhost> <39a5810d-75bc-4ddb-8722-703f762ed4de@app.fastmail.com> <835yel11x8.fsf@gnu.org> Date: Fri, 09 Dec 2022 11:51:29 -0800 In-Reply-To: (Malcolm Cook's message of "Fri, 9 Dec 2022 19:40:17 +0000") Message-ID: User-Agent: Gnus/5.13 (Gnus v5.13) Emacs/27.1 (gnu/linux) Content-Type: text/plain X-TMN: [BkItmtRSOj3h7nZT3hlSvMYHnCyj09RjD8yQ+JGuTN/mtwSh7BNRDxHoOgNDKtYQ] X-ClientProxiedBy: BYAPR11CA0071.namprd11.prod.outlook.com (2603:10b6:a03:80::48) To SJ0PR03MB5455.namprd03.prod.outlook.com (2603:10b6:a03:27b::11) X-Microsoft-Original-Message-ID: <87mt7wz77i.fsf@penguin> MIME-Version: 1.0 X-MS-Exchange-MessageSentRepresentingType: 2 X-MS-PublicTrafficType: Email X-MS-TrafficTypeDiagnostic: SJ0PR03MB5455:EE_|MN2PR03MB5344:EE_ X-MS-Office365-Filtering-Correlation-Id: bbe1a85c-ff5e-4875-d91b-08dada1ec5d3 X-Microsoft-Antispam: BCL:0; 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List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: emacs-orgmode-bounces+larch=yhetil.org@gnu.org Sender: emacs-orgmode-bounces+larch=yhetil.org@gnu.org X-Migadu-Country: US X-Migadu-Flow: FLOW_IN ARC-Message-Signature: i=2; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=yhetil.org; s=key1; t=1670615518; h=from:from:sender:sender:reply-to:subject:subject:date:date: message-id:message-id:to:to:cc:cc:mime-version:mime-version: content-type:content-type:in-reply-to:in-reply-to: references:references:list-id:list-help:list-unsubscribe: list-subscribe:list-post:dkim-signature; bh=f2gNQPs6P8nS0anTxgLwmCme79jDGk10ha8PKz0ibHg=; b=i62j8uT06c1IlQOCpL6X2nx3kmCeGBe9yVJyuILdydpfagyNK5AWPp9m4mxnLqhtndlSb7 NArsN9f/HVy9lb5Gv7XfPfIwDGPhwtOw1gneZmaOWTF/+RYwAXVVVwijnCk8I09vcJj4ya mPPXQB6J2vcZuZOsMhdsTN+FlwnZdXqQ/FCFrEfk+MDkpXkEp6AMmzr9yw/WifKIjASvXr LqrbPRtJ2cVjWm+Gnb1GF8FqAIoTVpssPQTnSnIilJ9z7d/lM7B1C+apfiVj5Oj2jEXu/M BUEoQCoh/jDBb7MNV98NLbLQtF6WQoKApCTofvQYBeoa+LD0EWxElmjPq5rf2Q== ARC-Authentication-Results: i=2; aspmx1.migadu.com; dkim=pass header.d=outlook.com header.s=selector1 header.b=Xjv1h5on; spf=pass (aspmx1.migadu.com: domain of "emacs-orgmode-bounces+larch=yhetil.org@gnu.org" designates 209.51.188.17 as permitted sender) smtp.mailfrom="emacs-orgmode-bounces+larch=yhetil.org@gnu.org"; arc=pass ("microsoft.com:s=arcselector9901:i=1"); dmarc=fail reason="SPF not aligned (relaxed), DKIM not aligned (relaxed)" header.from=gmail.com (policy=none) ARC-Seal: i=2; s=key1; d=yhetil.org; t=1670615518; a=rsa-sha256; cv=pass; b=kjqk1YwJReDZNl2s+H8WQlV4dim7uhNmvkW9M940po/bIG+pK1VEXNM0nHv5qL9IalBjDv yPkgVHsEBsibRyhjuv8Yz/q0wRvOmDaeLn5l6HhGcVARrFPaERRZt9676b1dHIscd6S0wg LXcjuZxJi3qnlNgPZC8cMacz+n8Mr5PZ142XbYZ4T7x48xZVyXacsv9hjpERWWctdjDTD9 PtvdCZkSugZdQv9Wb+zXhdLWVqzunKD6lze4ce9FNM8INMMKBZrT3a67nB/qHqET8jnIqE djLx9+WA3CwPBsy1e0VnXpZ57e558wwE3kHLTTGSw1k6PuMkJ9k+FS3pkJJeJg== X-Migadu-Spam-Score: -3.28 X-Spam-Score: -3.28 X-Migadu-Queue-Id: 4D28D31F3E X-Migadu-Scanner: scn0.migadu.com Authentication-Results: aspmx1.migadu.com; dkim=pass header.d=outlook.com header.s=selector1 header.b=Xjv1h5on; spf=pass (aspmx1.migadu.com: domain of "emacs-orgmode-bounces+larch=yhetil.org@gnu.org" designates 209.51.188.17 as permitted sender) smtp.mailfrom="emacs-orgmode-bounces+larch=yhetil.org@gnu.org"; arc=pass ("microsoft.com:s=arcselector9901:i=1"); dmarc=fail reason="SPF not aligned (relaxed), DKIM not aligned (relaxed)" header.from=gmail.com (policy=none) X-TUID: VahcxwbSnm8N "Cook, Malcolm" writes: >> Eli Zaretskii writes: >> >> >> Cc: emacs-orgmode@gnu.org, 59882@debbugs.gnu.org >> >> From: David Masterson >> >> Date: Thu, 08 Dec 2022 13:56:03 -0800 >> >> >> >> In my testing, I found a strange case where, in *scratch*, I get: >> >> >> >> (message "%s" org-version) >> >> ;; Error undefined >> >> ;; Do 'C-h v org-version' >> >> (message "%s" org-version) >> >> 9.3 >> >> >> >> So, 'describe-variable' on org-version causes Org to be loaded?!? >> > >> > Why is it so surprising? Is this the first time you see that a Help >> > command loads something to do its job? >> >> Yes, it is surprising. How did Emacs know to load Org to find org-version? > > This is provided for via emacs' autoload by prefix mechanism. > > See: > > https://www.gnu.org/software/emacs/manual/html_node/elisp/Autoload-by-Prefix.html > > What you observed will NOT happen if you first run: > > (clrhash definition-prefixes) Ah! Thank you. In many ways, I still think of Emacs from what I learned about it in the early 80s (yes, pre-Elisp). I didn't expect this and, so, didn't investigate the possibility that it's planned (the Info documentation has gotten huge). Apologies to Eli. -- David Masterson