beamer columns

beamer columns

[Thomas S. Dye]

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Aloha all,

Would it make sense to implement Beamer columns with Org-mode tables?

All the best,
Tom

Thomas S. Dye, Ph.D.
T. S. Dye & Colleagues, Archaeologists, Inc.
Phone: (808) 529-0866 Fax: (808) 529-0884
http://www.tsdye.com



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Re: beamer columns

[Sébastien Vauban]

Hi Thomas,

"Thomas S. Dye" wrote:
> Would it make sense to implement Beamer columns with Org-mode tables?

First of all, as this is the first time I write to you directly, let me thank
you for the resources you've put in this mailing list already around this
subject (Org and beamer) that excites me a lot, for the simple reason it's
just so natural to use Org for simple documents such as slides.

I've been interested a lot already by your past answers and contributions.

That being said, and trying to find counter-reasons on purpose, I would say it
maybe is not such a great idea, for the following reasons:

- different ways to organize contents; not easy to switch from a tree
  structure to a list of lists (of lists...) in a table, just because your
  boss wants to add a picture on the right of the slide;

- impossible (?) to add a table in a column, as we can't put a table in a
  table...

Though, I must admit the idea is still seducing as well: you directly see in
your buffer (more or less) how it will appear on your screen. Not an objective
per se, but better when it's there for free...

Another problem, maybe, is that long lines don't go so good in tables,
moreover the lines would certainly often be larger tan 80 characters (= my
standard) when there are 2 (or more) columns.

Though, I must as well admit I almost never never use columns in my own slides.
The only exception would be for a simple pro/cons comparison, or for putting a
graphic on one half and text on the other.

Best,
  Seb

-- 
Sébastien Vauban



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Re: beamer columns

[Carsten Dominik]

On Nov 29, 2009, at 7:31 PM, Thomas S. Dye wrote:

> Aloha all,
>
> Would it make sense to implement Beamer columns with Org-mode tables?

Hi Thomas,

I cannot see how this would make sense.

Maybe you'd like to elaborate?

- Carsten

>
> All the best,
> Tom
>
> Thomas S. Dye, Ph.D.
> T. S. Dye & Colleagues, Archaeologists, Inc.
> Phone: (808) 529-0866 Fax: (808) 529-0884
> http://www.tsdye.com
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Emacs-orgmode mailing list
> Please use `Reply All' to send replies to the list.
> Emacs-orgmode@gnu.org
> http://lists.gnu.org/mailman/listinfo/emacs-orgmode

- Carsten

Re: beamer columns

[Thomas S. Dye]

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On Nov 29, 2009, at 11:23 AM, Carsten Dominik wrote:

>
> On Nov 29, 2009, at 7:31 PM, Thomas S. Dye wrote:
>
>> Aloha all,
>>
>> Would it make sense to implement Beamer columns with Org-mode tables?
>
> Hi Thomas,
>
> I cannot see how this would make sense.
>
> Maybe you'd like to elaborate?
>
> - Carsten

Hi Carsten and Sebastian,

This idea might be nonsense or technically infeasible.  The advantage,  
if it is one, is that the same org file might export to LaTeX and  
Beamer with roughly similar results.  If headlines are used below the  
level of the Beamer frame, then export to LaTeX becomes problematic,  
or so it seems to me (and perhaps some others, if I've read their  
posts correctly).   A column-like arrangement in a portion of a LaTeX  
file is sometimes faked by using \begin{tabular} \end{tabular}, and  
this naturally brought to mind Org-mode tables.

Apologies if the signal/noise ratio is distressingly low here.

All the best,
Tom

Thomas S. Dye, Ph.D.
T. S. Dye & Colleagues, Archaeologists, Inc.
Phone: (808) 529-0866 Fax: (808) 529-0884
http://www.tsdye.com



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Re: beamer columns

[Carsten Dominik]

On Nov 29, 2009, at 11:17 PM, Thomas S. Dye wrote:

>
> On Nov 29, 2009, at 11:23 AM, Carsten Dominik wrote:
>
>>
>> On Nov 29, 2009, at 7:31 PM, Thomas S. Dye wrote:
>>
>>> Aloha all,
>>>
>>> Would it make sense to implement Beamer columns with Org-mode  
>>> tables?
>>
>> Hi Thomas,
>>
>> I cannot see how this would make sense.
>>
>> Maybe you'd like to elaborate?
>>
>> - Carsten
>
> Hi Carsten and Sebastian,
>
> This idea might be nonsense or technically infeasible.  The  
> advantage, if it is one, is that the same org file might export to  
> LaTeX and Beamer with roughly similar results.  If headlines are  
> used below the level of the Beamer frame, then export to LaTeX  
> becomes problematic, or so it seems to me (and perhaps some others,  
> if I've read their posts correctly).   A column-like arrangement in  
> a portion of a LaTeX file is sometimes faked by using  
> \begin{tabular} \end{tabular}, and this naturally brought to mind  
> Org-mode tables.
>
> Apologies if the signal/noise ratio is distressingly low here.


Hi Thomas, thanks for the extra explanations - however, I still don't  
think that this is the way to go.

- Carsten

>
> All the best,
> Tom
>
> Thomas S. Dye, Ph.D.
> T. S. Dye & Colleagues, Archaeologists, Inc.
> Phone: (808) 529-0866 Fax: (808) 529-0884
> http://www.tsdye.com
>
>

- Carsten

Re: beamer columns

[Darlan Cavalcante Moreira]

Hello Carsten and all,

I have sent a suggestion in the beamer thread about using comments for columns,
but I didn't receive my own message from the mailing list (as usual). Therefore
I'm assuming no one else has received it and I'm going to repeat it here (sorry
if this is a duplicate).


The idea is using special comments to represent columns when exporting to beamer
(and maybe other formats). For instance, considering the frames are in the
third-level headings, a presentation could be like

,----
| * This is a Section
| *** This is a Subsection
| ***** This is the frame title
|       Frame content
| 
| ***** This is the frame title of another frame
| #+\{0.4
|       - This is an item
|       - This is an item too
| #+\\0.6
|       - Another item
|       - Another one
|       - One more item
| #+\}
`----

The comment "#+\{" indicates the beginning of a columns environment (maybe only
"#+{" is better) in addition to the first column. The number "0.4" indicates the
width of the first column (0.4\textwidth). The comment "#+\\0.6" creates another
column and the comment "#+\}" closes the columns environment.

I'm not saying this is the best way, but it has the advantage of being similar
to what we do in beamer (but simpler IMHO) and it would export without errors
for other formats. Maybe it is better to also implement it for standard latex
using minipages or something similar and to HTML, but if this is not desired
then the closing comment could be optional (the columns environment would then
end when the current slide ends).

With some org functions to mark, swap, etc., columns it could be easy to
reorganize the columns if desired.

Also, It would be nice if the width could be optional, i.e., if there are
columns whose widths were not specified then org could sum the widths that were
specified and distribute the remaining among the columns whose widths were not
specified. For instance, in a frame with 3 columns one could specify the width
of the first column as 0.4 and leave the others unspecified. Org should then
choose a width of 0.3 for each of the remaining two columns.


At last, thank you for the effort to implement native beamer support in org.
- Darlan Cavalcante
  

At Mon, 30 Nov 2009 13:44:27 +0100,
Carsten Dominik <carsten.dominik@gmail.com> wrote:
> 
> 
> On Nov 29, 2009, at 11:17 PM, Thomas S. Dye wrote:
> 
> >
> > On Nov 29, 2009, at 11:23 AM, Carsten Dominik wrote:
> >
> >>
> >> On Nov 29, 2009, at 7:31 PM, Thomas S. Dye wrote:
> >>
> >>> Aloha all,
> >>>
> >>> Would it make sense to implement Beamer columns with Org-mode  
> >>> tables?
> >>
> >> Hi Thomas,
> >>
> >> I cannot see how this would make sense.
> >>
> >> Maybe you'd like to elaborate?
> >>
> >> - Carsten
> >
> > Hi Carsten and Sebastian,
> >
> > This idea might be nonsense or technically infeasible.  The  
> > advantage, if it is one, is that the same org file might export to  
> > LaTeX and Beamer with roughly similar results.  If headlines are  
> > used below the level of the Beamer frame, then export to LaTeX  
> > becomes problematic, or so it seems to me (and perhaps some others,  
> > if I've read their posts correctly).   A column-like arrangement in  
> > a portion of a LaTeX file is sometimes faked by using  
> > \begin{tabular} \end{tabular}, and this naturally brought to mind  
> > Org-mode tables.
> >
> > Apologies if the signal/noise ratio is distressingly low here.
> 
> 
> Hi Thomas, thanks for the extra explanations - however, I still don't  
> think that this is the way to go.
> 
> - Carsten
> 
> >
> > All the best,
> > Tom
> >
> > Thomas S. Dye, Ph.D.
> > T. S. Dye & Colleagues, Archaeologists, Inc.
> > Phone: (808) 529-0866 Fax: (808) 529-0884
> > http://www.tsdye.com
> >
> >
> 
> - Carsten
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> _______________________________________________
> Emacs-orgmode mailing list
> Please use `Reply All' to send replies to the list.
> Emacs-orgmode@gnu.org
> http://lists.gnu.org/mailman/listinfo/emacs-orgmode

Re: beamer columns

[Carsten Dominik]

Hi Darlan,

I have gone through a number of ideas for how to create columns
during the past few days.  I also already considered and ultimately
rejected the idea to use comments or other special syntax to create
columns.  I think this would be too specialistic.  It will work in
your case, where ou use a plain list on the frame - it will not work
in someone else' case where the items on the frame are also
headline or even headlines that become special environments
like proof or block or theorem.

But thanks for chiming in, and if there are more ideas I'd like
to hear them.

- Carsten


On Nov 30, 2009, at 11:00 PM, Darlan Cavalcante Moreira wrote:

>
>
> Hello Carsten and all,
>
> I have sent a suggestion in the beamer thread about using comments  
> for columns,
> but I didn't receive my own message from the mailing list (as  
> usual). Therefore
> I'm assuming no one else has received it and I'm going to repeat it  
> here (sorry
> if this is a duplicate).
>
>
> The idea is using special comments to represent columns when  
> exporting to beamer
> (and maybe other formats). For instance, considering the frames are  
> in the
> third-level headings, a presentation could be like
>
> ,----
> | * This is a Section
> | *** This is a Subsection
> | ***** This is the frame title
> |       Frame content
> |
> | ***** This is the frame title of another frame
> | #+\{0.4
> |       - This is an item
> |       - This is an item too
> | #+\\0.6
> |       - Another item
> |       - Another one
> |       - One more item
> | #+\}
> `----
>
> The comment "#+\{" indicates the beginning of a columns environment  
> (maybe only
> "#+{" is better) in addition to the first column. The number "0.4"  
> indicates the
> width of the first column (0.4\textwidth). The comment "#+\\0.6"  
> creates another
> column and the comment "#+\}" closes the columns environment.
>
> I'm not saying this is the best way, but it has the advantage of  
> being similar
> to what we do in beamer (but simpler IMHO) and it would export  
> without errors
> for other formats. Maybe it is better to also implement it for  
> standard latex
> using minipages or something similar and to HTML, but if this is not  
> desired
> then the closing comment could be optional (the columns environment  
> would then
> end when the current slide ends).
>
> With some org functions to mark, swap, etc., columns it could be  
> easy to
> reorganize the columns if desired.
>
> Also, It would be nice if the width could be optional, i.e., if  
> there are
> columns whose widths were not specified then org could sum the  
> widths that were
> specified and distribute the remaining among the columns whose  
> widths were not
> specified. For instance, in a frame with 3 columns one could specify  
> the width
> of the first column as 0.4 and leave the others unspecified. Org  
> should then
> choose a width of 0.3 for each of the remaining two columns.
>
>
> At last, thank you for the effort to implement native beamer support  
> in org.
> - Darlan Cavalcante
>
>
> At Mon, 30 Nov 2009 13:44:27 +0100,
> Carsten Dominik <carsten.dominik@gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>>
>> On Nov 29, 2009, at 11:17 PM, Thomas S. Dye wrote:
>>
>>>
>>> On Nov 29, 2009, at 11:23 AM, Carsten Dominik wrote:
>>>
>>>>
>>>> On Nov 29, 2009, at 7:31 PM, Thomas S. Dye wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> Aloha all,
>>>>>
>>>>> Would it make sense to implement Beamer columns with Org-mode
>>>>> tables?
>>>>
>>>> Hi Thomas,
>>>>
>>>> I cannot see how this would make sense.
>>>>
>>>> Maybe you'd like to elaborate?
>>>>
>>>> - Carsten
>>>
>>> Hi Carsten and Sebastian,
>>>
>>> This idea might be nonsense or technically infeasible.  The
>>> advantage, if it is one, is that the same org file might export to
>>> LaTeX and Beamer with roughly similar results.  If headlines are
>>> used below the level of the Beamer frame, then export to LaTeX
>>> becomes problematic, or so it seems to me (and perhaps some others,
>>> if I've read their posts correctly).   A column-like arrangement in
>>> a portion of a LaTeX file is sometimes faked by using
>>> \begin{tabular} \end{tabular}, and this naturally brought to mind
>>> Org-mode tables.
>>>
>>> Apologies if the signal/noise ratio is distressingly low here.
>>
>>
>> Hi Thomas, thanks for the extra explanations - however, I still don't
>> think that this is the way to go.
>>
>> - Carsten
>>
>>>
>>> All the best,
>>> Tom
>>>
>>> Thomas S. Dye, Ph.D.
>>> T. S. Dye & Colleagues, Archaeologists, Inc.
>>> Phone: (808) 529-0866 Fax: (808) 529-0884
>>> http://www.tsdye.com
>>>
>>>
>>
>> - Carsten
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> Emacs-orgmode mailing list
>> Please use `Reply All' to send replies to the list.
>> Emacs-orgmode@gnu.org
>> http://lists.gnu.org/mailman/listinfo/emacs-orgmode

- Carsten