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* Suggestion: Stackoverflow for Orgmode
@ 2011-07-20  8:10 Thomas Renkert
  2011-07-20  9:44 ` Jambunathan K
                   ` (2 more replies)
  0 siblings, 3 replies; 18+ messages in thread
From: Thomas Renkert @ 2011-07-20  8:10 UTC (permalink / raw)
  To: emacs-orgmode

Hello,

I have been using Orgmode for the last two years. In fact, I started learning
Emacs only to use orgmode (btw: a huge thank you to Carsten and the other
contributors!).

I noticed that - as more people with a diverse range of background knowledge
start to use orgmode - the mailing list is getting more and more difficult to
navigate: a lot of threads are long and winding and many of the posts are basic
questions from beginners and questions about special use cases or scenarios from
more experienced users. 

Long story short:

Orgmode is in itself so complex and powerful and its use cases and the demands
of its users are so diverse that I think we need a better method of "getting
quickly to the answer". 

To clarify: the manual, worg and the mailing list are superb! I just think we
could speed up things, especially for new users. This could also attract new
users and make the mailing list a bit "leaner" in the end.


An idea:

Many of you may be familiar with the Q&A-Sites www.stackoverflow.com or
www.superuser.com. This is pretty much what I have in mind. The closest to
Orgmode is maybe http://tex.stackexchange.com which is the same concept for a
similarly large and powerful system, LaTeX. 

The biggest advantage, IMO, is the aspect of self-organization: Good questions
get upvoted and attract better answers. "Good" can mean anything here: a
fundamental / innovative / original / detailed / effective question. Questions
and answers can be tagged. Contributors are rewarded with badges.

New users will find basic answers without extended searches and experienced
users can discuss about new and interesting problems basically in realtime. 

And: Good solutions, once they are found, don't get buried in long threads. 

It is hard to explain it this way: just have a look at
http://tex.stackexchange.com and try to find the answers to a simple and to a
more obscure problem in LaTeX: No matter what your level of knowledge is, you
will get to the solution very quickly. 


My proposal: could we have something like this for Orgmode as well?


There are basically 4 viable options, IMO:

1. Hosted by stackexchange: 

Stackexchange is commercial, but they host a dedicated Q&A-Site if it attracts
enough interest in their sandbox:
http://area51.stackexchange.com

We could propose an Orgmode-stackexchange site to them and then vote for it.
This may take some time, if it happens at all.

2. Hosted by shapado.com (commercial)
Looks less polished but seems to work (maybe with ads?). They have a free plan
http://shapado.com/plans (at the bottom of the page)

3. Self-hosted with http://askbot.org/ (FOSS and looks good)

4. Self-hosted with http://www.osqa.net (FOSS)


If there is enough capacity on our server, I would suggest to try askbot (or
osqa) because of the level of autonomy and independence this would give us. If
we don't have the capacity, it might be worth it to set up a test site on
shapado or to propose this to stackexchange. A site hosted by stackexchange
might itself attract new users.


What do you think? 

^ permalink raw reply	[flat|nested] 18+ messages in thread

* Re: Suggestion: Stackoverflow for Orgmode
  2011-07-20  8:10 Suggestion: Stackoverflow for Orgmode Thomas Renkert
@ 2011-07-20  9:44 ` Jambunathan K
  2011-07-20 12:13   ` Thomas Renkert
  2011-07-20 13:45 ` Memnon Anon
  2011-07-21  9:51 ` Bastien
  2 siblings, 1 reply; 18+ messages in thread
From: Jambunathan K @ 2011-07-20  9:44 UTC (permalink / raw)
  To: Thomas Renkert; +Cc: emacs-orgmode


> The biggest advantage, IMO, is the aspect of self-organization:

The biggest diasadvantage would be fragmentation of information. 

All information needs to have authoritative sources and archives. I
believe the info manual, GNU mailing list and the Orgmode.org domain (of
which Worg is but a part) are the right place for such archival
references.

I don't think anyone would object to having a secondary marketplace for
trading of orgmode related tips and tricks.

Jambunathan K.

-- 

^ permalink raw reply	[flat|nested] 18+ messages in thread

* Re: Suggestion: Stackoverflow for Orgmode
  2011-07-20  9:44 ` Jambunathan K
@ 2011-07-20 12:13   ` Thomas Renkert
  2011-07-20 13:53     ` Rainer M Krug
  0 siblings, 1 reply; 18+ messages in thread
From: Thomas Renkert @ 2011-07-20 12:13 UTC (permalink / raw)
  To: emacs-orgmode

Jambunathan K <kjambunathan <at> gmail.com> writes:

> 
> The biggest diasadvantage would be fragmentation of information. 
> 
> All information needs to have authoritative sources and archives. I
> believe the info manual, GNU mailing list and the Orgmode.org domain (of
> which Worg is but a part) are the right place for such archival
> references.

Sure. But reading the manual from a to z or searching the mailing list for the
right line of elisp is sometimes very slow if you need a quick solution. I am by
no means suggesting that we should give up the established ways of archiving
information or discussion, though. 

I simply think that something like "ask.orgmode.org" with a stackexchange-like
interface could be very helpful for a larger portion of users.

It may happen that redundant information is produced by this idea but I think it
will make orgmode more usable and less intimidating for new users. Something
similar has happened before: the orgguide was Carsten's solution for the complex
200+ pages of the original manual. 

Besides I find that useful information is already pretty much fragmented across
the threads of this mailing list (there is also a lot of bugfixing, regression
reports and feature request going on). 

Sure, the knowledge is there somewhere but it would be nice to see what works
and what is useful without having to try everything for yourself. 



> I don't think anyone would object to having a secondary marketplace for
> trading of orgmode related tips and tricks.


My question is if anyone on this list would actively participate to get it off
the ground. And I think that hosting it on the orgmode.org-server would make a
lot of sense. 

Is somebody here interested in starting this?


 

^ permalink raw reply	[flat|nested] 18+ messages in thread

* Re: Suggestion: Stackoverflow for Orgmode
  2011-07-20  8:10 Suggestion: Stackoverflow for Orgmode Thomas Renkert
  2011-07-20  9:44 ` Jambunathan K
@ 2011-07-20 13:45 ` Memnon Anon
  2011-07-20 16:02   ` Rehan Iftikhar
  2011-07-21  9:51 ` Bastien
  2 siblings, 1 reply; 18+ messages in thread
From: Memnon Anon @ 2011-07-20 13:45 UTC (permalink / raw)
  To: emacs-orgmode

Thomas Renkert <tunnelblick@quantentunnel.de> writes:

> I noticed that - as more people with a diverse range of background knowledge
> start to use orgmode - the mailing list is getting more and more difficult to
> navigate: 

I do agree that the volume of mails did considerably increase.

> a lot of threads are long and winding and many of the posts are basic
> questions from beginners and questions about special use cases or scenarios from
> more experienced users. 

At this point, however, I have a different impression.
Yes, there are some long threads, but those seem to be rarley those
interesting for new users while setting up their orgworld.
Those threads are *imho* usually about new features that need
discussion, clarification etc.: a ping pong of ideas.
When subareas emerge, tags like [BABEL] or now [CALFW] make it easy to
parse them out if you are not interested. 

OTOH, I am used to dealing with mailing lists and I find them very
convenient. Others may very well have a different impression.
Is this worth a poll in a new thread?

> An idea:
> Many of you may be familiar with the Q&A-Sites www.stackoverflow.com or
> www.superuser.com. 

There are already some questions about org on stackoverflow, if people
are interested in this format, they can already go there. Setting this
up seems overkill to me, especially, because we have Worg to collect
the nuggets of all threads. If newcomers find the volume on this list 
overwhelming, I think splitting it into a -dev and a -user list would 
be the next logical step, first.

However, I am not opposed to this idea when others agree it would be
usefull. I can't really see myself using it so far, but that may very
well change. 

Memnon

^ permalink raw reply	[flat|nested] 18+ messages in thread

* Re: Suggestion: Stackoverflow for Orgmode
  2011-07-20 12:13   ` Thomas Renkert
@ 2011-07-20 13:53     ` Rainer M Krug
  2011-07-20 15:32       ` A. Ryan Reynolds
  2011-07-20 15:39       ` John Hendy
  0 siblings, 2 replies; 18+ messages in thread
From: Rainer M Krug @ 2011-07-20 13:53 UTC (permalink / raw)
  To: Thomas Renkert; +Cc: emacs-orgmode

[-- Attachment #1: Type: text/plain, Size: 2771 bytes --]

On Wed, Jul 20, 2011 at 2:13 PM, Thomas Renkert <
tunnelblick@quantentunnel.de> wrote:

> Jambunathan K <kjambunathan <at> gmail.com> writes:
>
> >
> > The biggest diasadvantage would be fragmentation of information.
> >
> > All information needs to have authoritative sources and archives. I
> > believe the info manual, GNU mailing list and the Orgmode.org domain (of
> > which Worg is but a part) are the right place for such archival
> > references.
>
> Sure. But reading the manual from a to z or searching the mailing list for
> the
> right line of elisp is sometimes very slow if you need a quick solution. I
> am by
> no means suggesting that we should give up the established ways of
> archiving
> information or discussion, though.
>
> I simply think that something like "ask.orgmode.org" with a
> stackexchange-like
> interface could be very helpful for a larger portion of users.
>
> It may happen that redundant information is produced by this idea but I
> think it
> will make orgmode more usable and less intimidating for new users.
> Something
> similar has happened before: the orgguide was Carsten's solution for the
> complex
> 200+ pages of the original manual.
>
> Besides I find that useful information is already pretty much fragmented
> across
> the threads of this mailing list (there is also a lot of bugfixing,
> regression
> reports and feature request going on).
>
> Sure, the knowledge is there somewhere but it would be nice to see what
> works
> and what is useful without having to try everything for yourself.
>
>
>
> > I don't think anyone would object to having a secondary marketplace for
> > trading of orgmode related tips and tricks.
>
>
> My question is if anyone on this list would actively participate to get it
> off
> the ground. And I think that hosting it on the orgmode.org-server would
> make a
> lot of sense.
>
> Is somebody here interested in starting this?
>
>
>
Not starting - but I think it is a really good idea.
Nothing against worg (an absolutely fantastic resource) - but I consider the
way that worg is edited as more static then a dynamic FAQ page, which this
would result in if I understand correctly.

I would definitely add to it. I agree that this should not replace any of
the great resources of org, but it could supplement as a more dynamic format
then worg, but more structured then a mailing list.

Cheers,

Rainer

-- 
Rainer M. Krug, PhD (Conservation Ecology, SUN), MSc (Conservation Biology,
UCT), Dipl. Phys. (Germany)

Centre of Excellence for Invasion Biology
Stellenbosch University
South Africa

Tel :       +33 - (0)9 53 10 27 44
Cell:       +33 - (0)6 85 62 59 98
Fax (F):       +33 - (0)9 58 10 27 44

Fax (D):    +49 - (0)3 21 21 25 22 44

email:      Rainer@krugs.de

Skype:      RMkrug

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^ permalink raw reply	[flat|nested] 18+ messages in thread

* Re: Suggestion: Stackoverflow for Orgmode
  2011-07-20 13:53     ` Rainer M Krug
@ 2011-07-20 15:32       ` A. Ryan Reynolds
  2011-07-20 15:39       ` John Hendy
  1 sibling, 0 replies; 18+ messages in thread
From: A. Ryan Reynolds @ 2011-07-20 15:32 UTC (permalink / raw)
  Cc: emacs-orgmode

I think on the whole that this is a good idea; I do wonder if it might harmfully divide the effort on the documentation rather than provide a complement to the manual and guide, but I think the best way to find out is just to try it and see what people use.

If the existing FOSS designed to fill this niche are unacceptable to our purposes we can always make our own. Such a site would not be complicated to build, and I would be very willing to put in effort toward this goal. I do not know Elisp very well, which prevents me from contributing much to this project even though I depend heavily on Org-mode, but web programming I can contribute.
--
A. Ryan Reynolds

^ permalink raw reply	[flat|nested] 18+ messages in thread

* Re: Suggestion: Stackoverflow for Orgmode
  2011-07-20 13:53     ` Rainer M Krug
  2011-07-20 15:32       ` A. Ryan Reynolds
@ 2011-07-20 15:39       ` John Hendy
  1 sibling, 0 replies; 18+ messages in thread
From: John Hendy @ 2011-07-20 15:39 UTC (permalink / raw)
  To: Rainer M Krug; +Cc: emacs-orgmode, Thomas Renkert

On Wed, Jul 20, 2011 at 8:53 AM, Rainer M Krug <r.m.krug@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>
> On Wed, Jul 20, 2011 at 2:13 PM, Thomas Renkert
> <tunnelblick@quantentunnel.de> wrote:
>>
>> Jambunathan K <kjambunathan <at> gmail.com> writes:
>>
>> >
>> > The biggest diasadvantage would be fragmentation of information.
>> >
>> > All information needs to have authoritative sources and archives. I
>> > believe the info manual, GNU mailing list and the Orgmode.org domain (of
>> > which Worg is but a part) are the right place for such archival
>> > references.
>>
>> Sure. But reading the manual from a to z or searching the mailing list for
>> the
>> right line of elisp is sometimes very slow if you need a quick solution. I
>> am by
>> no means suggesting that we should give up the established ways of
>> archiving
>> information or discussion, though.
>>
>> I simply think that something like "ask.orgmode.org" with a
>> stackexchange-like
>> interface could be very helpful for a larger portion of users.
>>
>> It may happen that redundant information is produced by this idea but I
>> think it
>> will make orgmode more usable and less intimidating for new users.
>> Something
>> similar has happened before: the orgguide was Carsten's solution for the
>> complex
>> 200+ pages of the original manual.
>>
>> Besides I find that useful information is already pretty much fragmented
>> across
>> the threads of this mailing list (there is also a lot of bugfixing,
>> regression
>> reports and feature request going on).
>>
>> Sure, the knowledge is there somewhere but it would be nice to see what
>> works
>> and what is useful without having to try everything for yourself.
>>
>>
>>
>> > I don't think anyone would object to having a secondary marketplace for
>> > trading of orgmode related tips and tricks.
>>
>>
>> My question is if anyone on this list would actively participate to get it
>> off
>> the ground. And I think that hosting it on the orgmode.org-server would
>> make a
>> lot of sense.
>>
>> Is somebody here interested in starting this?
>>
>>
>
> Not starting - but I think it is a really good idea.
> Nothing against worg (an absolutely fantastic resource) - but I consider the
> way that worg is edited as more static then a dynamic FAQ page, which this
> would result in if I understand correctly.
> I would definitely add to it. I agree that this should not replace any of
> the great resources of org, but it could supplement as a more dynamic format
> then worg, but more structured then a mailing list.


I'd definitely participate. I keep an "emacs" label in gmail with the
mailing list items where I've specifically had a question resolved. I
have to refer to them often. Sometimes my searches for the mailing
list exchange I *know* happened result in diddly because I just can't
remember the title of the email dialog. I think something like SE
would be fantastic, and in my opinion is a much more robust than
mailing lists *once the answer is determined.*

Mailing lists are great for hashing out discussions and getting
input... but I think a more concrete (but still modify-able)
repository would be better once a tangible outcome from the mailing
list has resulted.

Honestly, I don't see much difference than doing the same thing with a
wiki... but SE is infinitely more fun to contribute to. I could see
the benefit of SE's multiple answers format as well, since my
observation on the mailing list has often been that many users do
things differently.

I'd be open to starting this in Area51 if there is significant
interest. I don't think it's all that difficult and it's fairly
self-fulfilling; if users commit/participate... it launches. If not,
it won't.


John

> Cheers,
> Rainer
>
> --
> Rainer M. Krug, PhD (Conservation Ecology, SUN), MSc (Conservation Biology,
> UCT), Dipl. Phys. (Germany)
>
> Centre of Excellence for Invasion Biology
> Stellenbosch University
> South Africa
>
> Tel :       +33 - (0)9 53 10 27 44
> Cell:       +33 - (0)6 85 62 59 98
> Fax (F):       +33 - (0)9 58 10 27 44
>
> Fax (D):    +49 - (0)3 21 21 25 22 44
>
> email:      Rainer@krugs.de
>
> Skype:      RMkrug
>
>

^ permalink raw reply	[flat|nested] 18+ messages in thread

* Re: Suggestion: Stackoverflow for Orgmode
  2011-07-20 13:45 ` Memnon Anon
@ 2011-07-20 16:02   ` Rehan Iftikhar
  2011-07-20 21:37     ` Wes Hardaker
  0 siblings, 1 reply; 18+ messages in thread
From: Rehan Iftikhar @ 2011-07-20 16:02 UTC (permalink / raw)
  To: Memnon Anon; +Cc: emacs-orgmode

Personally I feel that the StackExchange interface is more accessible
to newcomers than mailing lists or Worg. Its a great way to ask a
questions and get an answer.

The mailing list is better at having conversations about a topic. Worg
is a great resource for hand-curated advice, which will always be
useful.

I would definitely use a StackExchange-like application for Org if it existed.

On Wed, Jul 20, 2011 at 6:45 AM, Memnon Anon
<gegendosenfleisch@googlemail.com> wrote:
> Thomas Renkert <tunnelblick@quantentunnel.de> writes:
>
>> I noticed that - as more people with a diverse range of background knowledge
>> start to use orgmode - the mailing list is getting more and more difficult to
>> navigate:
>
> I do agree that the volume of mails did considerably increase.
>
>> a lot of threads are long and winding and many of the posts are basic
>> questions from beginners and questions about special use cases or scenarios from
>> more experienced users.
>
> At this point, however, I have a different impression.
> Yes, there are some long threads, but those seem to be rarley those
> interesting for new users while setting up their orgworld.
> Those threads are *imho* usually about new features that need
> discussion, clarification etc.: a ping pong of ideas.
> When subareas emerge, tags like [BABEL] or now [CALFW] make it easy to
> parse them out if you are not interested.
>
> OTOH, I am used to dealing with mailing lists and I find them very
> convenient. Others may very well have a different impression.
> Is this worth a poll in a new thread?
>
>> An idea:
>> Many of you may be familiar with the Q&A-Sites www.stackoverflow.com or
>> www.superuser.com.
>
> There are already some questions about org on stackoverflow, if people
> are interested in this format, they can already go there. Setting this
> up seems overkill to me, especially, because we have Worg to collect
> the nuggets of all threads. If newcomers find the volume on this list
> overwhelming, I think splitting it into a -dev and a -user list would
> be the next logical step, first.
>
> However, I am not opposed to this idea when others agree it would be
> usefull. I can't really see myself using it so far, but that may very
> well change.
>
> Memnon
>
>
>
>



-- 
-Rehan

^ permalink raw reply	[flat|nested] 18+ messages in thread

* Re: Suggestion: Stackoverflow for Orgmode
  2011-07-20 16:02   ` Rehan Iftikhar
@ 2011-07-20 21:37     ` Wes Hardaker
  0 siblings, 0 replies; 18+ messages in thread
From: Wes Hardaker @ 2011-07-20 21:37 UTC (permalink / raw)
  To: Rehan Iftikhar; +Cc: Memnon Anon, emacs-orgmode

>>>>> On Wed, 20 Jul 2011 09:02:03 -0700, Rehan Iftikhar <rehan.iftikhar@gmail.com> said:

RI> Personally I feel that the StackExchange interface is more accessible
RI> to newcomers than mailing lists or Worg. Its a great way to ask a
RI> questions and get an answer.

(and it's worth noting that org-mode questions already get asked on the
existing Stack Overflow: http://stackoverflow.com/search?q=org )

RI> The mailing list is better at having conversations about a topic. Worg
RI> is a great resource for hand-curated advice, which will always be
RI> useful.

RI> I would definitely use a StackExchange-like application for Org if it existed.

RI> On Wed, Jul 20, 2011 at 6:45 AM, Memnon Anon
RI> <gegendosenfleisch@googlemail.com> wrote:
>> Thomas Renkert <tunnelblick@quantentunnel.de> writes:
>> 
>>> I noticed that - as more people with a diverse range of background knowledge
>>> start to use orgmode - the mailing list is getting more and more difficult to
>>> navigate:
>> 
>> I do agree that the volume of mails did considerably increase.
>> 
>>> a lot of threads are long and winding and many of the posts are basic
>>> questions from beginners and questions about special use cases or
>>> scenarios from
>>> more experienced users.
>> 
>> At this point, however, I have a different impression.
>> Yes, there are some long threads, but those seem to be rarley those
>> interesting for new users while setting up their orgworld.
>> Those threads are *imho* usually about new features that need
>> discussion, clarification etc.: a ping pong of ideas.
>> When subareas emerge, tags like [BABEL] or now [CALFW] make it easy to
>> parse them out if you are not interested.
>> 
>> OTOH, I am used to dealing with mailing lists and I find them very
>> convenient. Others may very well have a different impression.
>> Is this worth a poll in a new thread?
>> 
>>> An idea:
>>> Many of you may be familiar with the Q&A-Sites www.stackoverflow.com or
>>> www.superuser.com.
>> 
>> There are already some questions about org on stackoverflow, if people
>> are interested in this format, they can already go there. Setting this
>> up seems overkill to me, especially, because we have Worg to collect
>> the nuggets of all threads. If newcomers find the volume on this list
>> overwhelming, I think splitting it into a -dev and a -user list would
>> be the next logical step, first.
>> 
>> However, I am not opposed to this idea when others agree it would be
>> usefull. I can't really see myself using it so far, but that may very
>> well change.
>> 
>> Memnon
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 



RI> -- 
RI> -Rehan


-- 
Wes Hardaker                                     
My Pictures:  http://capturedonearth.com/
My Thoughts:  http://pontifications.hardakers.net/

^ permalink raw reply	[flat|nested] 18+ messages in thread

* Re: Suggestion: Stackoverflow for Orgmode
  2011-07-20  8:10 Suggestion: Stackoverflow for Orgmode Thomas Renkert
  2011-07-20  9:44 ` Jambunathan K
  2011-07-20 13:45 ` Memnon Anon
@ 2011-07-21  9:51 ` Bastien
  2011-07-21 10:59   ` Thomas Renkert
  2011-07-21 13:58   ` Jason Dunsmore
  2 siblings, 2 replies; 18+ messages in thread
From: Bastien @ 2011-07-21  9:51 UTC (permalink / raw)
  To: Thomas Renkert; +Cc: Jason Dunsmore, emacs-orgmode

Hi Thomas,

thanks for sharing this idea.

Something like ask.orgmode.org with a StackOverflow interface would be
very nice.  I am copying Jason, http://orgmode.org webmaster, to make
sure this would not add too much work for him.

I am not afraid of fragmentation of information: as long as this new
interface links to relevant primary sources of information (the manual, 
Worg, the mailing list), these source will be used.

I'm more afraid of fragmentation of the _energy_ that people put in 
maintaining those primary sources.  But at the end, I guess things will 
auto-regulate and the overall UI for finding information will improve.

At least there is nothing wrong in trying.

What is the next step?

-- 
 Bastien

^ permalink raw reply	[flat|nested] 18+ messages in thread

* Re: Suggestion: Stackoverflow for Orgmode
  2011-07-21  9:51 ` Bastien
@ 2011-07-21 10:59   ` Thomas Renkert
  2011-07-21 13:58   ` Jason Dunsmore
  1 sibling, 0 replies; 18+ messages in thread
From: Thomas Renkert @ 2011-07-21 10:59 UTC (permalink / raw)
  To: Bastien; +Cc: Jason Dunsmore, emacs-orgmode

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@ Bastien, Jason

thank you for your response!

I made a proposal to stackexchange.com for a dedicated Org-mode site but
they rejected it as a duplicate of stackoverflow. So this option is out.

Nevertheless, I still think it would be nice to have something like this for
Org-mode only.

We could install our own SE-like site using askbot.org or osqa.net.

As far as I see, the installation of askbot is not completely trivial but
doable: http://askbot.org/doc/index.html

The webserver (if it is Apache) would need mod_fcgi or mod_wsgi since askbot
is based on Django and python.

(see also: http://askbot.org/en/question/72/is-askbot-easy-to-install
http://askbot.org/en/question/263/what-servers-and-configs-is-askbot-known-to-work
http://askbot.org/en/question/33/is-my-shared-host-good-enough-for-django)

It is still quite some work, I am aware of this. If it drains too much
energy, it isn't worth it.
But if we could get it off the ground, I think it would be a great addition
to the Org community.

>At least there is nothing wrong in trying.

Exactly.

So this would be the next steps:

1. Download askbot, install askbot, configure askbot
2. configure the webserver
3. deploy askbot on the webserver


Regards,
Thomas


2011/7/21 Bastien <bzg@altern.org>

> Hi Thomas,
>
> thanks for sharing this idea.
>
> Something like ask.orgmode.org with a StackOverflow interface would be
> very nice.  I am copying Jason, http://orgmode.org webmaster, to make
> sure this would not add too much work for him.
>
> I am not afraid of fragmentation of information: as long as this new
> interface links to relevant primary sources of information (the manual,
> Worg, the mailing list), these source will be used.
>
> I'm more afraid of fragmentation of the _energy_ that people put in
> maintaining those primary sources.  But at the end, I guess things will
> auto-regulate and the overall UI for finding information will improve.
>
> At least there is nothing wrong in trying.
>
> What is the next step?
>
> --
>  Bastien
>

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^ permalink raw reply	[flat|nested] 18+ messages in thread

* Re: Suggestion: Stackoverflow for Orgmode
  2011-07-21  9:51 ` Bastien
  2011-07-21 10:59   ` Thomas Renkert
@ 2011-07-21 13:58   ` Jason Dunsmore
  2011-07-21 14:15     ` suvayu ali
  1 sibling, 1 reply; 18+ messages in thread
From: Jason Dunsmore @ 2011-07-21 13:58 UTC (permalink / raw)
  To: Bastien; +Cc: emacs-orgmode, Thomas Renkert

Bastien <bzg@altern.org> writes:

> Something like ask.orgmode.org with a StackOverflow interface would be
> very nice.

I think this would be a great way to start a community-driven FAQ.

Why don't we use the "org-mode" tag on stackoverflow.com:
http://stackoverflow.com/questions/tagged/org-mode

It's a fully-featured site with an already-established Org community
(http://stackoverflow.com/tags/org-mode/topusers).  We wouldn't have to
upgrade the server's memory to support a new site, nor would we have to
constantly update a web app due to security issues.

Here's an Atom feed for new org-mode questions:
http://stackoverflow.com/feeds/tag?tagnames=org-mode&sort=newest

I created a redirect for ask.orgmode.org: http://ask.orgmode.org

What do you think?  Should we link to ask.orgmode.org from orgmode.org?

^ permalink raw reply	[flat|nested] 18+ messages in thread

* Re: Suggestion: Stackoverflow for Orgmode
  2011-07-21 13:58   ` Jason Dunsmore
@ 2011-07-21 14:15     ` suvayu ali
  2011-07-21 14:27       ` John Hendy
  2011-07-22  9:38       ` Bastien
  0 siblings, 2 replies; 18+ messages in thread
From: suvayu ali @ 2011-07-21 14:15 UTC (permalink / raw)
  To: Jason Dunsmore; +Cc: Bastien, emacs-orgmode, Thomas Renkert

On Thu, Jul 21, 2011 at 3:58 PM, Jason Dunsmore
<emacs-orgmode@dunsmor.com> wrote:
> Bastien <bzg@altern.org> writes:
>
>> Something like ask.orgmode.org with a StackOverflow interface would be
>> very nice.
>
> I think this would be a great way to start a community-driven FAQ.
>
> Why don't we use the "org-mode" tag on stackoverflow.com:
> http://stackoverflow.com/questions/tagged/org-mode
>

This looks like the perfect solution without all the headaches. :)

-- 
Suvayu

Open source is the future. It sets us free.

^ permalink raw reply	[flat|nested] 18+ messages in thread

* Re: Suggestion: Stackoverflow for Orgmode
  2011-07-21 14:15     ` suvayu ali
@ 2011-07-21 14:27       ` John Hendy
  2011-07-22  9:38       ` Bastien
  1 sibling, 0 replies; 18+ messages in thread
From: John Hendy @ 2011-07-21 14:27 UTC (permalink / raw)
  To: suvayu ali; +Cc: Bastien, Jason Dunsmore, emacs-orgmode, Thomas Renkert

On Thu, Jul 21, 2011 at 9:15 AM, suvayu ali <fatkasuvayu+linux@gmail.com> wrote:
> On Thu, Jul 21, 2011 at 3:58 PM, Jason Dunsmore
> <emacs-orgmode@dunsmor.com> wrote:
>> Bastien <bzg@altern.org> writes:
>>
>>> Something like ask.orgmode.org with a StackOverflow interface would be
>>> very nice.
>>
>> I think this would be a great way to start a community-driven FAQ.
>>
>> Why don't we use the "org-mode" tag on stackoverflow.com:
>> http://stackoverflow.com/questions/tagged/org-mode
>>
>
> This looks like the perfect solution without all the headaches. :)

That, and not sure anyone else noticed, but the org-mode area51
proposal was closed as a duplicate of Stack Overflow... so looks like
this is the only remaining option :)

The moderator suggested taking a look at this,
http://blog.stackoverflow.com/2011/06/se-podcast-07/, which looks like
it's proposing to do what has come up here -- follow things on S.O.
via tags.


John

>
> --
> Suvayu
>
> Open source is the future. It sets us free.
>
>

^ permalink raw reply	[flat|nested] 18+ messages in thread

* Re: Suggestion: Stackoverflow for Orgmode
  2011-07-21 14:15     ` suvayu ali
  2011-07-21 14:27       ` John Hendy
@ 2011-07-22  9:38       ` Bastien
  2011-07-22 12:23         ` Bastien
  1 sibling, 1 reply; 18+ messages in thread
From: Bastien @ 2011-07-22  9:38 UTC (permalink / raw)
  To: suvayu ali; +Cc: Thomas Renkert, Jason Dunsmore, emacs-orgmode

Hi all,

suvayu ali <fatkasuvayu+linux@gmail.com> writes:

>> Why don't we use the "org-mode" tag on stackoverflow.com:
>> http://stackoverflow.com/questions/tagged/org-mode
>
> This looks like the perfect solution without all the headaches. :)

Indeed!  Thanks Jason for setting http://ask.orgmode.org up. 

I updated the FAQ section in http://orgmode.org and advertized
the http://ask.orgmode.org link.

-- 
 Bastien

^ permalink raw reply	[flat|nested] 18+ messages in thread

* Re: Suggestion: Stackoverflow for Orgmode
  2011-07-22  9:38       ` Bastien
@ 2011-07-22 12:23         ` Bastien
  2011-07-22 12:31           ` Rainer M Krug
  0 siblings, 1 reply; 18+ messages in thread
From: Bastien @ 2011-07-22 12:23 UTC (permalink / raw)
  To: suvayu ali; +Cc: Thomas Renkert, Jason Dunsmore, emacs-orgmode

Hi all,

Bastien <bzg@gnu.org> writes:

> I updated the FAQ section in http://orgmode.org and advertized
> the http://ask.orgmode.org link.

I've also added a section to the Org FAQ listing the last five 
questions from StackOverflow:

  http://orgmode.org/worg/org-faq.html#sec-1

I think this might be a good way to encourage people to contribute 
to answers on StackOverflow and to keep both area quite in sync.

Let me know if you think it's relevant.

Thanks,

-- 
 Bastien

^ permalink raw reply	[flat|nested] 18+ messages in thread

* Re: Suggestion: Stackoverflow for Orgmode
  2011-07-22 12:23         ` Bastien
@ 2011-07-22 12:31           ` Rainer M Krug
  2011-07-22 13:27             ` Bastien
  0 siblings, 1 reply; 18+ messages in thread
From: Rainer M Krug @ 2011-07-22 12:31 UTC (permalink / raw)
  To: Bastien; +Cc: Jason Dunsmore, emacs-orgmode, Thomas Renkert

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On Fri, Jul 22, 2011 at 2:23 PM, Bastien <bzg@altern.org> wrote:

> Hi all,
>
> Bastien <bzg@gnu.org> writes:
>
> > I updated the FAQ section in http://orgmode.org and advertized
> > the http://ask.orgmode.org link.
>
> I've also added a section to the Org FAQ listing the last five
> questions from StackOverflow:
>
>  http://orgmode.org/worg/org-faq.html#sec-1
>
> I think this might be a good way to encourage people to contribute
> to answers on StackOverflow and to keep both area quite in sync.
>
> Let me know if you think it's relevant.
>

Absolutely. But what about sending once a week an automated email to the
mailing list with the last not answered questions? That would keep the two
even more in sync.

I do not think that one can submit questions to stackoverflow via email?

Rainer


>
> Thanks,
>
> --
>  Bastien
>
>


-- 
Rainer M. Krug, PhD (Conservation Ecology, SUN), MSc (Conservation Biology,
UCT), Dipl. Phys. (Germany)

Centre of Excellence for Invasion Biology
Stellenbosch University
South Africa

Tel :       +33 - (0)9 53 10 27 44
Cell:       +33 - (0)6 85 62 59 98
Fax (F):       +33 - (0)9 58 10 27 44

Fax (D):    +49 - (0)3 21 21 25 22 44

email:      Rainer@krugs.de

Skype:      RMkrug

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^ permalink raw reply	[flat|nested] 18+ messages in thread

* Re: Suggestion: Stackoverflow for Orgmode
  2011-07-22 12:31           ` Rainer M Krug
@ 2011-07-22 13:27             ` Bastien
  0 siblings, 0 replies; 18+ messages in thread
From: Bastien @ 2011-07-22 13:27 UTC (permalink / raw)
  To: Rainer M Krug; +Cc: Jason Dunsmore, emacs-orgmode, Thomas Renkert

Hi Rainer,

Rainer M Krug <r.m.krug@gmail.com> writes:

> Absolutely. But what about sending once a week an automated email to
> the mailing list with the last not answered questions? 

I'm not sure about this: in this case, will people answer on the 
mailing list or on SO?   I'd rather have people answer on the ml,
and point to those answers (or to Worg's  sections) on SO.

I see SO as a place for newcomers -- the more newcomers joining
reading information on the mailing list / Worg, the better.

> That would keep the two even more in sync.

I doubt this is realistic.  

Paying attention to questions on SO is fine, but IMHO keeping 
things as centralized as possible is a higher priority, let's try 
to avoid duplicate work!

Is there someone here regularily trying to answer questions on
SO?  If so, that'd ideal: this person could make sure interesting
questions/answers reach the right place any time.

> I do not think that one can submit questions to stackoverflow via
> email?

I don't know...  would be cool.

Best,

-- 
 Bastien

^ permalink raw reply	[flat|nested] 18+ messages in thread

end of thread, other threads:[~2011-07-22 13:27 UTC | newest]

Thread overview: 18+ messages (download: mbox.gz / follow: Atom feed)
-- links below jump to the message on this page --
2011-07-20  8:10 Suggestion: Stackoverflow for Orgmode Thomas Renkert
2011-07-20  9:44 ` Jambunathan K
2011-07-20 12:13   ` Thomas Renkert
2011-07-20 13:53     ` Rainer M Krug
2011-07-20 15:32       ` A. Ryan Reynolds
2011-07-20 15:39       ` John Hendy
2011-07-20 13:45 ` Memnon Anon
2011-07-20 16:02   ` Rehan Iftikhar
2011-07-20 21:37     ` Wes Hardaker
2011-07-21  9:51 ` Bastien
2011-07-21 10:59   ` Thomas Renkert
2011-07-21 13:58   ` Jason Dunsmore
2011-07-21 14:15     ` suvayu ali
2011-07-21 14:27       ` John Hendy
2011-07-22  9:38       ` Bastien
2011-07-22 12:23         ` Bastien
2011-07-22 12:31           ` Rainer M Krug
2011-07-22 13:27             ` Bastien

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