remember template is slow

remember template is slow

[Buck Brody]

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I'm finding that my remember templates are slow to load.  I've got a lag of
about three to four seconds.  I know that doesn't sound like much, but it's
kind of puts a kink in the workflow.  I use GNU emacs on Windows.  I also
have cygwin installed, and I have noticed that the problem doesn't occur
when using cygwin.  Any ideas?

Thanks

Windows 7
GNU Emacs 23.2.1
Org-mode version 6.36c

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Re: remember template is slow

[Giovanni Ridolfi]

Buck Brody <buckbrody@gmail.com> writes:

Hi, Buck,

> Windows 7 GNU Emacs 23.2.1Org-mode version 6.36c
Emacs  : GNU Emacs 23.2.1 (i386-mingw-nt5.1.2600)
         of 2010-05-08 on G41R2F1
Org-version:  6.36trans, of 0:45 5th Jul 2010

> I'm finding that my remember templates are slow to load. I've
> got a lag of about three to four seconds.
Did you compile the sources?

It seems to me that the compiled version is faster.
However it brings the problem of old .elc files lying around.

cheers,
Giovanni

Re: remember template is slow

[Buck Brody]

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Yes, they are compiled

On Thu, Jul 8, 2010 at 4:01 AM, Giovanni Ridolfi
<giovanni.ridolfi@yahoo.it>wrote:

> Buck Brody <buckbrody@gmail.com> writes:
>
> Hi, Buck,
>
> > Windows 7 GNU Emacs 23.2.1Org-mode version 6.36c
> Emacs  : GNU Emacs 23.2.1 (i386-mingw-nt5.1.2600)
>         of 2010-05-08 on G41R2F1
> Org-version:  6.36trans, of 0:45 5th Jul 2010
>
> > I'm finding that my remember templates are slow to load. I've
> > got a lag of about three to four seconds.
> Did you compile the sources?
>
> It seems to me that the compiled version is faster.
> However it brings the problem of old .elc files lying around.
>
> cheers,
> Giovanni
>

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Re: remember template is slow

[Daniel J. Sinder]

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On Wed, Jul 7, 2010 at 9:30 AM, Buck Brody <buckbrody@gmail.com> wrote:

> I'm finding that my remember templates are slow to load.  I've got a lag of
> about three to four seconds.  I know that doesn't sound like much, but it's
> kind of puts a kink in the workflow.  I use GNU emacs on Windows.  I also
> have cygwin installed, and I have noticed that the problem doesn't occur
> when using cygwin.  Any ideas?
>

For what it's worth, I've also had this problem for a while now.  However, I
*do* use emacs w/ cygwin:
Windows XP (w/ Cygwin)
GNU Emacs 23.2.1
Org-mode version 6.36trans (release_6.36.453.g0cd4)

I suspect (for no particular reason other than disdain for Windows) that it
is related to poor file system (NTFS) access speeds.  For example, maybe org
is trying to open several files to look for TODO keywords and/or tags?

Dan

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Re: remember template is slow

[Richard Riley]

"Daniel J. Sinder" <daniel@sindercity.com> writes:

> On Wed, Jul 7, 2010 at 9:30 AM, Buck Brody <buckbrody@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>     I'm finding that my remember templates are slow to load.  I've got
>     a lag of about three to four seconds.  I know that doesn't sound
>     like much, but it's kind of puts a kink

What does "remember templates are slow to load" mean in this context?
You mean when you want to enter any new remember item or only the first
one? Any delay is normally once only when org is initialised.

Another thing to look at which crucified my erc (irc client for emacs)
performance was flyspell - I had to remove it from my erc setup.

>     in the workflow.  I use GNU emacs on Windows.  I also have cygwin installed, and I have noticed that the problem doesn't occur when using cygwin.  Any ideas?
>
> For what it's worth, I've also had this problem for a while now.  However, I *do* use emacs w/ cygwin:
> Windows XP (w/ Cygwin)
> GNU Emacs 23.2.1
> Org-mode version 6.36trans (release_6.36.453.g0cd4)
>
> I suspect (for no particular reason other than disdain for Windows) that it is related to poor file system (NTFS) access speeds.  For example, maybe org is trying to open
> several files to look for TODO keywords and/or tags?

What makes you think ntfs would be a bottle neck? Bringing religious
wars into help discussions is rarely productive and better kept to the
advocacy groups ;) People use org on pretty much all mainstream OSen.

>
> Dan

Re: Re: remember template is slow

[Daniel J. Sinder]

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On Fri, Jul 9, 2010 at 2:44 PM, Richard Riley <rileyrg@gmail.com> wrote:

> "Daniel J. Sinder" <daniel@sindercity.com> writes:
>
> > On Wed, Jul 7, 2010 at 9:30 AM, Buck Brody <buckbrody@gmail.com> wrote:
> >
> >     I'm finding that my remember templates are slow to load.  I've got
> >     a lag of about three to four seconds.  I know that doesn't sound
> >     like much, but it's kind of puts a kink
>
> What does "remember templates are slow to load" mean in this context?
> You mean when you want to enter any new remember item or only the first
> one? Any delay is normally once only when org is initialised.
>
> Another thing to look at which crucified my erc (irc client for emacs)
> performance was flyspell - I had to remove it from my erc setup.
>
> >     in the workflow.  I use GNU emacs on Windows.  I also have cygwin
> installed, and I have noticed that the problem doesn't occur when using
> cygwin.  Any ideas?
> >
> > For what it's worth, I've also had this problem for a while now.
> However, I *do* use emacs w/ cygwin:
> > Windows XP (w/ Cygwin)
> > GNU Emacs 23.2.1
> > Org-mode version 6.36trans (release_6.36.453.g0cd4)
> >
> > I suspect (for no particular reason other than disdain for Windows) that
> it is related to poor file system (NTFS) access speeds.  For example, maybe
> org is trying to open
> > several files to look for TODO keywords and/or tags?
>
> What makes you think ntfs would be a bottle neck? Bringing religious
> wars into help discussions is rarely productive and better kept to the
> advocacy groups ;) People use org on pretty much all mainstream OSen.
>
> >
> > Dan
>
>
Actually, I should have been more explicit -- I use emacs and org
*exclusively* on Windows (via cygwin).  In fact, for years now, I
exclusively use Windows as far as operating systems go.  However, not being
an OS expert, but just a user, I am frequently frustrated by file access
speeds.  I have heard (just water-cooler talk) that as the registry gets
bloated over time, NTFS file access slows, having something to do with
frequent checks of the registry prior to file access.  Originally, I didn't
feel I understood the issue well enough to claim this as a legitimate reason
in this forum.  But, seeing your (over)reaction, perhaps I should have
explained myself better.

Did I bring a religious war into the discussion?  No, I most certainly did
not.  I didn't mention any other OS's, nor make comparisons between OS's.
Rather, I suggested a possible cause (slow NTFS file access) for the problem
that others and myself are seeing with org on Windows.  I followed that with
a question about whether org is trying to open several files when calling
remember, to see if that would lead to a proper diagnosis of the problem.

How did you contribute to the conversation?  I didn't bring up OS
comparisons -- you did!  Now I know org is used on all OSen.  Thanks!  If
you have nothing to contribute to this topic, and can't help solve my
problem, then I suggest you reserve your accusations for an appropriate
forum.

Dan

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Re: remember template is slow

[Richard Riley]

"Daniel J. Sinder" <daniel@sindercity.com> writes:

> On Fri, Jul 9, 2010 at 2:44 PM, Richard Riley <rileyrg@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>     "Daniel J. Sinder" <daniel@sindercity.com> writes:
>    
>     > On Wed, Jul 7, 2010 at 9:30 AM, Buck Brody <buckbrody@gmail.com> wrote:
>     >
>     >     I'm finding that my remember templates are slow to load.  I've got
>     >     a lag of about three to four seconds.  I know that doesn't sound
>     >     like much, but it's kind of puts a kink
>    
>     What does "remember templates are slow to load" mean in this context?
>     You mean when you want to enter any new remember item or only the first
>     one? Any delay is normally once only when org is initialised.
>    
>     Another thing to look at which crucified my erc (irc client for emacs)
>     performance was flyspell - I had to remove it from my erc setup.
>    
>     >     in the workflow.  I use GNU emacs on Windows.  I also have cygwin installed, and I have noticed that the problem doesn't occur when using cygwin.  Any ideas?
>     >
>     > For what it's worth, I've also had this problem for a while now.  However, I *do* use emacs w/ cygwin:
>     > Windows XP (w/ Cygwin)
>     > GNU Emacs 23.2.1
>     > Org-mode version 6.36trans (release_6.36.453.g0cd4)
>     >
>     > I suspect (for no particular reason other than disdain for Windows) that it is related to poor file system (NTFS) access speeds.  For example, maybe org is trying to open
>     > several files to look for TODO keywords and/or tags?
>    
>     What makes you think ntfs would be a bottle neck? Bringing religious
>     wars into help discussions is rarely productive and better kept to the
>     advocacy groups ;) People use org on pretty much all mainstream OSen.
>    
>     >
>     > Dan
>
> Actually, I should have been more explicit -- I use emacs and org *exclusively* on Windows (via cygwin).  In fact, for years now, I exclusively use Windows as far as operating
> systems go.  However, not being an OS expert, but just a user, I am frequently frustrated by file access speeds.  I have heard (just water-cooler talk) that as the registry gets
> bloated over time, NTFS file access slows, having something to do with frequent checks of the registry prior to file access.  Originally, I didn't feel I understood the issue
> well enough to claim this as a legitimate reason in this forum.  But, seeing your (over)reaction, perhaps I should have explained myself better.
>
> Did I bring a religious war into the discussion?  No, I most certainly did not.  I didn't mention any other OS's, nor make comparisons between OS's.  Rather, I suggested a
> possible cause (slow NTFS file access) for the problem that others and myself are seeing with org on Windows.  I followed that with a question about whether org is trying to
> open several files when calling remember, to see if that would lead to a proper diagnosis of the problem.
>
> How did you contribute to the conversation?  I didn't bring up OS
> comparisons -- you did!  Now I know org is used on all OSen.  Thanks! 
> If you have nothing to contribute tobago

Without wanting to get into a silly tit for tat match here I would point
out two things :-

1) You said "I suspect (for no particular reason other than disdain for
Windows) that it is related to poor file system (NTFS) access speeds"
... If that is not bringing OS comparisons into it then I apologise. It
seem fairly clear to me that that is exactly what you did.

2) When you asked "what did I contribute", I asked you to be more
specific about "slow loading times" e.g only first time or each and
every time and also mentioned that flyspell can often create large
pauses in buffer creation. Apologies if you feel that request for more
info and suggestion about one potential were not contributing.


> this topic, and can't help solve my problem, then I suggest you reserve your accusations for an appropriate forum.
>
> Dan

Best of luck with your issues....

Re: remember template is slow

[Bernt Hansen]

"Daniel J. Sinder" <daniel@sindercity.com> writes:

> On Wed, Jul 7, 2010 at 9:30 AM, Buck Brody <buckbrody@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>     I'm finding that my remember templates are slow to load.  I've got a lag of about three to four
>     seconds.  I know that doesn't sound like much, but it's kind of puts a kink in the workflow.  I
>     use GNU emacs on Windows.  I also have cygwin installed, and I have noticed that the problem
>     doesn't occur when using cygwin.  Any ideas?
>
> For what it's worth, I've also had this problem for a while now.  However, I *do* use emacs w/
> cygwin:
> Windows XP (w/ Cygwin)
> GNU Emacs 23.2.1
> Org-mode version 6.36trans (release_6.36.453.g0cd4)
>
> I suspect (for no particular reason other than disdain for Windows) that it is related to poor file
> system (NTFS) access speeds.  For example, maybe org is trying to open several files to look for
> TODO keywords and/or tags?

You may want to try profiling the code as described by Carsten in the
following post:

http://thread.gmane.org/gmane.emacs.orgmode/13182

That may provide additional information to show exactly where the
slowdown is taking place.

Regards,
Bernt

Re: remember template is slow

[Buck Brody]

Bernt,

Here are the results:

org-remember                                                  1
   2.497         2.497
org-do-remember                                               1
   2.496         2.496
org-remember-apply-template                                   1
   2.4939999999  2.4939999999
org-mode                                                      1
   2.259         2.259
org-install-agenda-files-menu                                 1
   2.258         2.258
org-agenda-files                                              1
   2.257         2.257
org-select-remember-template                                  1
   0.229         0.229
org-remember-handler                                          1
   0.001         0.001
org-set-regexps-and-options                                   1
   0.001         0.001
org-remember-finalize                                         1
   0.001         0.001
org-fix-tags-on-the-fly                                       2
   0.001         0.0005
org-delete-backward-char                                      1
   0.001         0.001
org-remember-kill                                             1
   0.001         0.001
org-set-font-lock-defaults                                    1
   0.001         0.001
org-hide-wide-columns                                         2
   0.001         0.0005
org-align-tags-here                                           2
   0.001         0.0005
On Sat, Jul 10, 2010 at 5:49 AM, Bernt Hansen <bernt@norang.ca> wrote:
>
> "Daniel J. Sinder" <daniel@sindercity.com> writes:
>
> > On Wed, Jul 7, 2010 at 9:30 AM, Buck Brody <buckbrody@gmail.com> wrote:
> >
> >     I'm finding that my remember templates are slow to load.  I've got a lag of about three to four
> >     seconds.  I know that doesn't sound like much, but it's kind of puts a kink in the workflow.  I
> >     use GNU emacs on Windows.  I also have cygwin installed, and I have noticed that the problem
> >     doesn't occur when using cygwin.  Any ideas?
> >
> > For what it's worth, I've also had this problem for a while now.  However, I *do* use emacs w/
> > cygwin:
> > Windows XP (w/ Cygwin)
> > GNU Emacs 23.2.1
> > Org-mode version 6.36trans (release_6.36.453.g0cd4)
> >
> > I suspect (for no particular reason other than disdain for Windows) that it is related to poor file
> > system (NTFS) access speeds.  For example, maybe org is trying to open several files to look for
> > TODO keywords and/or tags?
>
> You may want to try profiling the code as described by Carsten in the
> following post:
>
> http://thread.gmane.org/gmane.emacs.orgmode/13182
>
> That may provide additional information to show exactly where the
> slowdown is taking place.
>
> Regards,
> Bernt

Re: Re: remember template is slow

[Carsten Dominik]

Hi Buck,

what is the value of the variable org-agenda-files in your setup?

Thanks.

- Carsten

On Jul 12, 2010, at 6:18 PM, Buck Brody wrote:

> Bernt,
>
> Here are the results:
>
> org-remember                                                  1
>   2.497         2.497
> org-do-remember                                               1
>   2.496         2.496
> org-remember-apply-template                                   1
>   2.4939999999  2.4939999999
> org-mode                                                      1
>   2.259         2.259
> org-install-agenda-files-menu                                 1
>   2.258         2.258
> org-agenda-files                                              1
>   2.257         2.257
> org-select-remember-template                                  1
>   0.229         0.229
> org-remember-handler                                          1
>   0.001         0.001
> org-set-regexps-and-options                                   1
>   0.001         0.001
> org-remember-finalize                                         1
>   0.001         0.001
> org-fix-tags-on-the-fly                                       2
>   0.001         0.0005
> org-delete-backward-char                                      1
>   0.001         0.001
> org-remember-kill                                             1
>   0.001         0.001
> org-set-font-lock-defaults                                    1
>   0.001         0.001
> org-hide-wide-columns                                         2
>   0.001         0.0005
> org-align-tags-here                                           2
>   0.001         0.0005
> On Sat, Jul 10, 2010 at 5:49 AM, Bernt Hansen <bernt@norang.ca> wrote:
>>
>> "Daniel J. Sinder" <daniel@sindercity.com> writes:
>>
>>> On Wed, Jul 7, 2010 at 9:30 AM, Buck Brody <buckbrody@gmail.com>  
>>> wrote:
>>>
>>>     I'm finding that my remember templates are slow to load.  I've  
>>> got a lag of about three to four
>>>     seconds.  I know that doesn't sound like much, but it's kind  
>>> of puts a kink in the workflow.  I
>>>     use GNU emacs on Windows.  I also have cygwin installed, and I  
>>> have noticed that the problem
>>>     doesn't occur when using cygwin.  Any ideas?
>>>
>>> For what it's worth, I've also had this problem for a while now.   
>>> However, I *do* use emacs w/
>>> cygwin:
>>> Windows XP (w/ Cygwin)
>>> GNU Emacs 23.2.1
>>> Org-mode version 6.36trans (release_6.36.453.g0cd4)
>>>
>>> I suspect (for no particular reason other than disdain for  
>>> Windows) that it is related to poor file
>>> system (NTFS) access speeds.  For example, maybe org is trying to  
>>> open several files to look for
>>> TODO keywords and/or tags?
>>
>> You may want to try profiling the code as described by Carsten in the
>> following post:
>>
>> http://thread.gmane.org/gmane.emacs.orgmode/13182
>>
>> That may provide additional information to show exactly where the
>> slowdown is taking place.
>>
>> Regards,
>> Bernt
>
> _______________________________________________
> Emacs-orgmode mailing list
> Please use `Reply All' to send replies to the list.
> Emacs-orgmode@gnu.org
> http://lists.gnu.org/mailman/listinfo/emacs-orgmode

- Carsten

Re: Re: remember template is slow

[Buck Brody]

("~/Documents/org/outline.org")

On Tue, Jul 13, 2010 at 4:06 AM, Carsten Dominik
<carsten.dominik@gmail.com> wrote:
> Hi Buck,
>
> what is the value of the variable org-agenda-files in your setup?
>
> Thanks.
>
> - Carsten
>
> On Jul 12, 2010, at 6:18 PM, Buck Brody wrote:
>
>> Bernt,
>>
>> Here are the results:
>>
>> org-remember                                                  1
>>  2.497         2.497
>> org-do-remember                                               1
>>  2.496         2.496
>> org-remember-apply-template                                   1
>>  2.4939999999  2.4939999999
>> org-mode                                                      1
>>  2.259         2.259
>> org-install-agenda-files-menu                                 1
>>  2.258         2.258
>> org-agenda-files                                              1
>>  2.257         2.257
>> org-select-remember-template                                  1
>>  0.229         0.229
>> org-remember-handler                                          1
>>  0.001         0.001
>> org-set-regexps-and-options                                   1
>>  0.001         0.001
>> org-remember-finalize                                         1
>>  0.001         0.001
>> org-fix-tags-on-the-fly                                       2
>>  0.001         0.0005
>> org-delete-backward-char                                      1
>>  0.001         0.001
>> org-remember-kill                                             1
>>  0.001         0.001
>> org-set-font-lock-defaults                                    1
>>  0.001         0.001
>> org-hide-wide-columns                                         2
>>  0.001         0.0005
>> org-align-tags-here                                           2
>>  0.001         0.0005
>> On Sat, Jul 10, 2010 at 5:49 AM, Bernt Hansen <bernt@norang.ca> wrote:
>>>
>>> "Daniel J. Sinder" <daniel@sindercity.com> writes:
>>>
>>>> On Wed, Jul 7, 2010 at 9:30 AM, Buck Brody <buckbrody@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>    I'm finding that my remember templates are slow to load.  I've got a
>>>> lag of about three to four
>>>>    seconds.  I know that doesn't sound like much, but it's kind of puts
>>>> a kink in the workflow.  I
>>>>    use GNU emacs on Windows.  I also have cygwin installed, and I have
>>>> noticed that the problem
>>>>    doesn't occur when using cygwin.  Any ideas?
>>>>
>>>> For what it's worth, I've also had this problem for a while now.
>>>>  However, I *do* use emacs w/
>>>> cygwin:
>>>> Windows XP (w/ Cygwin)
>>>> GNU Emacs 23.2.1
>>>> Org-mode version 6.36trans (release_6.36.453.g0cd4)
>>>>
>>>> I suspect (for no particular reason other than disdain for Windows) that
>>>> it is related to poor file
>>>> system (NTFS) access speeds.  For example, maybe org is trying to open
>>>> several files to look for
>>>> TODO keywords and/or tags?
>>>
>>> You may want to try profiling the code as described by Carsten in the
>>> following post:
>>>
>>> http://thread.gmane.org/gmane.emacs.orgmode/13182
>>>
>>> That may provide additional information to show exactly where the
>>> slowdown is taking place.
>>>
>>> Regards,
>>> Bernt
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> Emacs-orgmode mailing list
>> Please use `Reply All' to send replies to the list.
>> Emacs-orgmode@gnu.org
>> http://lists.gnu.org/mailman/listinfo/emacs-orgmode
>
> - Carsten
>
>
>
>

Re: Re: remember template is slow

[Carsten Dominik]

On Jul 13, 2010, at 5:21 PM, Buck Brody wrote:

> ("~/Documents/org/outline.org")

Well, then I have no ideas what might make this so slow - it seems that
this call takes up all of the time.

The only further recommendation I would have is to do use uncompiled  
code
with

C-u M-x org-reload RET

and then do

M-x debug-on-entry RET org-agenda-files RET

If you then call a remember command, Emacs will stop in the debugger
in that function.  The you could step through using "d" and just watch
if you see which particular form inside that function eats up the time.

- Carsten

>
> On Tue, Jul 13, 2010 at 4:06 AM, Carsten Dominik
> <carsten.dominik@gmail.com> wrote:
>> Hi Buck,
>>
>> what is the value of the variable org-agenda-files in your setup?
>>
>> Thanks.
>>
>> - Carsten
>>
>> On Jul 12, 2010, at 6:18 PM, Buck Brody wrote:
>>
>>> Bernt,
>>>
>>> Here are the results:
>>>
>>> org-remember                                                  1
>>>  2.497         2.497
>>> org-do-remember                                               1
>>>  2.496         2.496
>>> org-remember-apply-template                                   1
>>>  2.4939999999  2.4939999999
>>> org-mode                                                      1
>>>  2.259         2.259
>>> org-install-agenda-files-menu                                 1
>>>  2.258         2.258
>>> org-agenda-files                                              1
>>>  2.257         2.257
>>> org-select-remember-template                                  1
>>>  0.229         0.229
>>> org-remember-handler                                          1
>>>  0.001         0.001
>>> org-set-regexps-and-options                                   1
>>>  0.001         0.001
>>> org-remember-finalize                                         1
>>>  0.001         0.001
>>> org-fix-tags-on-the-fly                                       2
>>>  0.001         0.0005
>>> org-delete-backward-char                                      1
>>>  0.001         0.001
>>> org-remember-kill                                             1
>>>  0.001         0.001
>>> org-set-font-lock-defaults                                    1
>>>  0.001         0.001
>>> org-hide-wide-columns                                         2
>>>  0.001         0.0005
>>> org-align-tags-here                                           2
>>>  0.001         0.0005
>>> On Sat, Jul 10, 2010 at 5:49 AM, Bernt Hansen <bernt@norang.ca>  
>>> wrote:
>>>>
>>>> "Daniel J. Sinder" <daniel@sindercity.com> writes:
>>>>
>>>>> On Wed, Jul 7, 2010 at 9:30 AM, Buck Brody <buckbrody@gmail.com>  
>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>    I'm finding that my remember templates are slow to load.   
>>>>> I've got a
>>>>> lag of about three to four
>>>>>    seconds.  I know that doesn't sound like much, but it's kind  
>>>>> of puts
>>>>> a kink in the workflow.  I
>>>>>    use GNU emacs on Windows.  I also have cygwin installed, and  
>>>>> I have
>>>>> noticed that the problem
>>>>>    doesn't occur when using cygwin.  Any ideas?
>>>>>
>>>>> For what it's worth, I've also had this problem for a while now.
>>>>>  However, I *do* use emacs w/
>>>>> cygwin:
>>>>> Windows XP (w/ Cygwin)
>>>>> GNU Emacs 23.2.1
>>>>> Org-mode version 6.36trans (release_6.36.453.g0cd4)
>>>>>
>>>>> I suspect (for no particular reason other than disdain for  
>>>>> Windows) that
>>>>> it is related to poor file
>>>>> system (NTFS) access speeds.  For example, maybe org is trying  
>>>>> to open
>>>>> several files to look for
>>>>> TODO keywords and/or tags?
>>>>
>>>> You may want to try profiling the code as described by Carsten in  
>>>> the
>>>> following post:
>>>>
>>>> http://thread.gmane.org/gmane.emacs.orgmode/13182
>>>>
>>>> That may provide additional information to show exactly where the
>>>> slowdown is taking place.
>>>>
>>>> Regards,
>>>> Bernt
>>>
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> Emacs-orgmode mailing list
>>> Please use `Reply All' to send replies to the list.
>>> Emacs-orgmode@gnu.org
>>> http://lists.gnu.org/mailman/listinfo/emacs-orgmode
>>
>> - Carsten
>>
>>
>>
>>

- Carsten