[WISH] ELPA repo for org-mode?

[WISH] ELPA repo for org-mode?

[Jambunathan K]

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I think ELPA repository for orgmode-only packages (hosted where else but
on worg) could be quite useful. The idea came up in emacs-devel [1].

There has been a lot of enthusiasm surrounding org+google-weather. It
only shows how useful certain packages could be. My concern is they
shouldn't be lost in mailing list or blog posts or get hidden deep in a
emacswiki page ...

I wonder whether elpa packages are permitted to contain data files
(non-elisp files). Let's say, one is interested in exploring R or
haskell through babel or just interested in basic babel recipes, then it
would be more faster and importantly very effective if one could simply
connect to org's elpa and download the language-specific startupkits
[2].

I have found very good emacs packages through elpa which I would have
never found through emacswiki ... and I have been an emacs-user since
before emacswiki became quite prominent. 

An enthusiastic emacs/orgmode user,
Jambunathan K.

[1] http://thread.gmane.org/gmane.emacs.devel/129833

[2] Startupkits need not be just limited to literate programming
examples. It could even be sample agenda files that an entry-level user
could download, walk through and play with.


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From: Ted Zlatanov <tzz@lifelogs.com>
Subject: Re: Google modules integration
Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.devel
To: emacs-devel@gnu.org
Date: Thu, 09 Sep 2010 18:36:30 -0500
Organization: Теодор Златанов @ Cienfuegos
Message-ID: <87r5h24hhd.fsf@lifelogs.com>
Archived-At: <http://permalink.gmane.org/gmane.emacs.devel/129846>

On Fri, 10 Sep 2010 00:56:09 +0200 Lennart Borgman <lennart.borgman@gmail.com> wrote: 

LB> On Fri, Sep 10, 2010 at 12:25 AM, Stefan Monnier
LB> <monnier@iro.umontreal.ca> wrote:
>>> But to do the things correctly, that would mean the merge of the
>>> `google-maps.el' and `google-weather.el' modules into Emacs core
>> [...]
>>> The question is, therefore, is there a chance that we could merge these
>>> two extension into Emacs?
>> 
>> Without having thought much about it, my reaction is rather negative,
>> since we do not want to install packages dedicated to supporting
>> proprietary software.

LB> What about elpa? Could this perhaps be more relaxed regarding
LB> supporting proprietary software? Or should there be a special elpa
LB> repository for it? (Is that possible with the current elpa version?)

You can set up your own ELPA repo, sure.

I think it's better for org-mode to support a generic maps and weather
plugin so users can write Google-specific ones (and put them on their
own ELPA repos) but don't have to.

I was in a similar situation with Google Reader and planned to write an
interface to it until the much better gwene.org came along (thanks to
Lars) to let me read RSS feeds in a sensible way.

Ted




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Re: [WISH] ELPA repo for org-mode?

[Bastien]

Jambunathan K <kjambunathan@gmail.com> writes:

> I think ELPA repository for orgmode-only packages (hosted where else but
> on worg) could be quite useful. The idea came up in emacs-devel [1].

AFAIU there are now three possible locations for Org extensions:

- the org-mode/contrib/lisp directory of Org's git repo
  http://repo.or.cz/w/org-mode.git/tree/HEAD:/contrib/lisp

  Those files are not included in Emacs, but are potential
  candidates for org-mode/lisp and later inclusion.

- ELPA itself -- nothing prevents orgers to submit their 
  code there, if they follow the rules:
  http://tromey.com/elpa/upload.html

- the World Wide Web.

The www isn't a bad solution provided things are correctly 
listed somewhere - e.g. http://orgmode.org/worg/org-contrib/

But clearly the ELPA and the org-mode/contrib/lisp are better
place for people who want to explore systematically and keep up
with the latest versions of those extensions.

I can see four scenarios:

1) more goes to org-mode/contrib/lisp: this is okay, but requires
   more people to have write access to Org

2) have a separate Org contribs repo: then we can be more liberal 
   with write access and let users have all extensions in one pull.

3) migrate as much Org extensions as possible to ELPA: I'm still 
   trying to figure out what would be the consequences of this.

4) adopt OLGA (Org Lisp Gadget Archive) on orgmode.org: we would 
   need to adapt package.el for a custom ELPA-like on orgmode.org      
   but this is feasible.  The advantage of having OLGA separately 
   from ELPA is that we might be more liberal about what extension
   is allowed there.

Of course, we can combine (2) and (4): have a git repos containing 
Org extensions (those who are not officially part of Emacs/Org) and 
this repo can feed our OLGA, so that users can *also* navigate and 
update Org extensions thru OLGA.

What people think?

-- 
 Bastien

Re: [WISH] ELPA repo for org-mode?

[Scot Becker]

> 1) more goes to org-mode/contrib/lisp: this is okay, but requires
>   more people to have write access to Org

I can't comment on whether that is undesirable, but I assume that if
the number of contributions grows, it might be best to take one of the
other routes.

> 2) have a separate Org contribs repo: then we can be more liberal
>   with write access and let users have all extensions in one pull.

This would be find with me.  Git is easy and quick.

> 3) migrate as much Org extensions as possible to ELPA: I'm still
>   trying to figure out what would be the consequences of this.

Well, for one thing, at the moment contributions to ELPA seem to be
reviewed /en masse/, at an interval of about every two weeks:

http://tromey.com/elpa/news.html

It might be better for org to have a method where extension developers
can say, "There.  Fixed it." and users can get updates immediately.
People seem to do that kind of thing a lot, 'round here.  And many of
run the freshest code out there for extensions and main packages
alike.

>
> 4) adopt OLGA (Org Lisp Gadget Archive) on orgmode.org: we would
>   need to adapt package.el for a custom ELPA-like on orgmode.org
>   but this is feasible.  The advantage of having OLGA separately
>   from ELPA is that we might be more liberal about what extension
>   is allowed there.

This might work.  I like the idea of distributed repositories for ELPA
anyway, and such a move might prompt the addition of an explicit way
to include multiple package repos (debian-like) if such a way does not
exist.  I believe in a well-designed, well-used package manager for
Emacs, and whatever aids that seems to me to be a Good Thing.

> Of course, we can combine (2) and (4): have a git repos containing
> Org extensions (those who are not officially part of Emacs/Org) and
> this repo can feed our OLGA, so that users can *also* navigate and
> update Org extensions thru OLGA.

Yep.  This might be nice both for the git-crowd and those who are
inclined towards a package manager.