From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: from mp0 ([2001:41d0:2:bcc0::]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) by ms0.migadu.com with LMTPS id CJcbBDjUaGBf1AAAgWs5BA (envelope-from ) for ; Sat, 03 Apr 2021 22:46:48 +0200 Received: from aspmx1.migadu.com ([2001:41d0:2:bcc0::]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 (256/256 bits)) by mp0 with LMTPS id aPqpOTfUaGCXCgAA1q6Kng (envelope-from ) for ; Sat, 03 Apr 2021 20:46:47 +0000 Received: from lists.gnu.org (lists.gnu.org [209.51.188.17]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by aspmx1.migadu.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 3CF8089F5 for ; Sat, 3 Apr 2021 22:46:47 +0200 (CEST) Received: from localhost ([::1]:51492 helo=lists1p.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1lSnAL-0006P1-8K for larch@yhetil.org; Sat, 03 Apr 2021 16:46:45 -0400 Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::10]:51422) by lists.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1lSn9r-0006Oj-Q2 for emacs-orgmode@gnu.org; Sat, 03 Apr 2021 16:46:16 -0400 Received: from mout01.posteo.de ([185.67.36.65]:37626) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1lSn9o-00054u-B1 for emacs-orgmode@gnu.org; Sat, 03 Apr 2021 16:46:15 -0400 Received: from submission (posteo.de [89.146.220.130]) by mout01.posteo.de (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 2734B16005C for ; Sat, 3 Apr 2021 22:46:06 +0200 (CEST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/simple; d=posteo.net; s=2017; t=1617482767; bh=h4nAgeHh0bOKF7YT++jGz4FdV09MO7DEeXU+7sHgip4=; h=From:To:Cc:Subject:Date:From; b=b9Bd6M1Krj3h5SxaJowGoi4iRdTSrwPSEXDhksiFJIgOBDsz9gcJnaaJXhgI8t/26 QhwJ5QhBkKT8t9ZwtycEGLoxrK7n+GRNZBsHnINIZh4tBv3J5Liiq/0xd55d7V7z1t GgzLQk9fIF4Zxd11/zPoCP1twsN6BC3WyW4RitnJKU92HrkPJj35F2kDuTPUdhY8TT NaH1ODCvcJ6WhJ633enrQJyvhA1VthJiFtdAdhhasNWk6IOyJTBIGrzalXRoFeiAW+ AavaHCGHq5OmkORH6ujk71uEnD86At2hM8qna3XAddKLF79ZkdEzReH3fymwlfRG4P Rm0GSDLNAU9/Q== Received: from customer (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by submission (posteo.de) with ESMTPSA id 4FCTTp39f4z6tm9; Sat, 3 Apr 2021 22:46:06 +0200 (CEST) From: =?utf-8?Q?Juan_Manuel_Mac=C3=ADas?= To: Jean Louis Subject: Re: First steps exporting to tex References: <871rbr7ag1.fsf@gmail.com> <87r1jrdzrg.fsf@posteo.net> Date: Sat, 03 Apr 2021 22:46:02 +0200 In-Reply-To: (Jean Louis's message of "Sat, 3 Apr 2021 21:36:24 +0300") Message-ID: <87sg47cd11.fsf@posteo.net> User-Agent: Gnus/5.13 (Gnus v5.13) Emacs/27.2 (gnu/linux) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Received-SPF: pass client-ip=185.67.36.65; envelope-from=maciaschain@posteo.net; helo=mout01.posteo.de X-Spam_score_int: -43 X-Spam_score: -4.4 X-Spam_bar: ---- X-Spam_report: (-4.4 / 5.0 requ) BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_EF=-0.1, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-2.3, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_H4=0.001, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_WL=0.001, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001 autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no X-Spam_action: no action X-BeenThere: emacs-orgmode@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.23 Precedence: list List-Id: "General discussions about Org-mode." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Cc: orgmode Errors-To: emacs-orgmode-bounces+larch=yhetil.org@gnu.org Sender: "Emacs-orgmode" X-Migadu-Flow: FLOW_IN ARC-Message-Signature: i=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=yhetil.org; s=key1; t=1617482807; h=from:from:sender:sender:reply-to:subject:subject:date:date: message-id:message-id:to:to:cc:cc:mime-version:mime-version: content-type:content-type:in-reply-to:in-reply-to: references:references:list-id:list-help:list-unsubscribe: list-subscribe:list-post:dkim-signature; bh=00Kz8yyfP/FjPwnCddTJvd8mFRYT7UIZMkaNEzimsQg=; b=WF9WJ+NmKfcefUxd9oxLjcJQg0Qcejcb8QVqMWzK6dgH+xIXA+EWPtFt7uejprEn6AZrUT 3xuGi/Os1mVBAsd34x6fFcVbytKRV03R8pZT9vnUmjvqRG+ckdIb30KJG37iW2XHPykzBj QYrd65v/ILNvebNA8ZQTAweW5bKPxvBa+Yoxax/5Xc7R1onJZJlRjr+hEORWh12EWJXqDD tOAnB3bEFNUDDT/mDKDUK8ZwyG9JllP4lz4vZN+hskWhpLPqREGRlPNRZtFIuix4hMsV1y oOJX3sE5qlJrd3HNJqb3H9GHgERChCjcWWqTd7NRd4KH955pNAseDB4yC3DGZQ== ARC-Seal: i=1; s=key1; d=yhetil.org; t=1617482807; a=rsa-sha256; cv=none; b=XYrBr1NY/UTkhJqPiXMc6b54FCuNMTLch9W2YUr03uMOuXiLdzA6mAngHpIfCKiS8ZK5mA FiSQ3O0KB7l527CeZWK2oiicIWf5I4ZoJzcJ+c+4lgJSuTVPPdZ6YpDtdjbNQPR7COTlyU Rr98K0e/0fvlWM/wL7qCbV+JKlKmLs23ETOatTdvviPvcMhtdTAVSDURrvm2b6dXqn2zPC xXFEBfyvKs//+c9723hEaNAI3ST2UHo11dvTcy0/oXcQAZAlOPQa2c83TRBYQ0bmfy8rl/ XrKpAdZbg7Nn6gUBXDGaMKConpjRl7DIb3yXxTna4zY3iicAwGQi/QLkzfG2jA== ARC-Authentication-Results: i=1; aspmx1.migadu.com; dkim=pass header.d=posteo.net header.s=2017 header.b=b9Bd6M1K; spf=pass (aspmx1.migadu.com: domain of emacs-orgmode-bounces@gnu.org designates 209.51.188.17 as permitted sender) smtp.mailfrom=emacs-orgmode-bounces@gnu.org X-Migadu-Spam-Score: -3.13 Authentication-Results: aspmx1.migadu.com; dkim=pass header.d=posteo.net header.s=2017 header.b=b9Bd6M1K; dmarc=pass (policy=none) header.from=posteo.net; spf=pass (aspmx1.migadu.com: domain of emacs-orgmode-bounces@gnu.org designates 209.51.188.17 as permitted sender) smtp.mailfrom=emacs-orgmode-bounces@gnu.org X-Migadu-Queue-Id: 3CF8089F5 X-Spam-Score: -3.13 X-Migadu-Scanner: scn0.migadu.com X-TUID: bFSM72Xpu75H Hi Jean Louis, Jean Louis writes: > Do you have a specific remark on what would be major wrong with the > default LaTeX export from your viewpoint? > > For me, I like larger letters and more space on paper. I find it > narrow and not enough legible. But that is not typographically > technical comment. It would be too long to comment here... The flaws of a typical LaTeX ouput could be divided into formal defects and orthotypographic defects. It's not LaTeX's fault (actually TeX and LaTeX represent the greatest advance in typography since Gutenberg); the problem is that a book needs a lot of fixes before reaching the printing press. And everything also depends on each type of book and each book in particular: typography is the science of exceptions. Luckily, TeX offers a lot of resources and packages for fine tuning, and LuaTeX even more. I invite you to read the documentation of these two packages: impnattypo (https://www.ctan.org/pkg/impnattypo) and lua-typo (https://www.ctan.org/pkg/lua-typo) where a part of these issues is discussed. Anyway, I am not saying that all average users should become experts in typesetting. I just wanted emphasize that LaTeX is /just/ the tool (like linotypes and monotypes were in his time) but LaTeX does not do everything, although his standard output is of very good quality compared to other systems. But that is so because TeX works very well, it justifies very well the paragraphs, etc. > [...] > Org user may not need nothing about LaTeX. Even if exporting is often, > Org user need not know nothing about LaTeX. Other converter like > `pandoc' also offer conversion to LaTeX and user need not know nothing > about it. An average Org user does not need to know almost anything about LaTeX if what he wants is just to produce /simple/ PDF documents. I agree. But when he wants to do more complex things, he will need to know how to do them in LaTeX and how to do them also from Org (in case he wants to continue working in Org: even I work in Org when I do professional typesetting, because for me Org is, among other things, the /almost/ perfect interface for LaTeX). If Org users get covered eyes with LaTeX and LaTeX processes, then they will end up filling the Org forums with questions that should rather be asked in the LaTeX forums (I am not saying that it should not be asked here, but if no one knows anything about LaTeX, no one could give answers to problems that are related to LaTeX and not to Org). Let's imagine this hypothetical case: User X enters the Org forum Z and asks: "How can I export to PDF with a two colums layout?" The correct answer is on the LaTeX side: "you have to use the multicol package (and read the package documentation, if fine-tuning is required)", Once the LaTeX oracle has given its answer, the Org oracle will declare that a multicols environment can be created in Org with a special block: #+begin_src org ,#+ATTR_LaTeX: :options {2} ,#+begin_multicols ............. ,#+end_multicols #+end_src Best regards, Juan Manuel