From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: from mp2 ([2001:41d0:2:4a6f::]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 (256/256 bits)) by ms11 with LMTPS id aMU+NCRExF9vSAAA0tVLHw (envelope-from ) for ; Mon, 30 Nov 2020 01:00:20 +0000 Received: from aspmx1.migadu.com ([2001:41d0:2:4a6f::]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 (256/256 bits)) by mp2 with LMTPS id oDYSMCRExF9aSQAAB5/wlQ (envelope-from ) for ; Mon, 30 Nov 2020 01:00:20 +0000 Received: from lists.gnu.org (lists.gnu.org [209.51.188.17]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by aspmx1.migadu.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 37F629402A7 for ; Mon, 30 Nov 2020 01:00:20 +0000 (UTC) Received: from localhost ([::1]:40946 helo=lists1p.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1kjXYA-0005tT-6X for larch@yhetil.org; Sun, 29 Nov 2020 20:00:18 -0500 Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::10]:44166) by lists.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1kjXXK-0005tH-ID for emacs-orgmode@gnu.org; Sun, 29 Nov 2020 19:59:26 -0500 Received: from mail-pg1-x529.google.com ([2607:f8b0:4864:20::529]:37026) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_128_GCM_SHA256:128) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1kjXXI-00051i-RU for emacs-orgmode@gnu.org; Sun, 29 Nov 2020 19:59:26 -0500 Received: by mail-pg1-x529.google.com with SMTP id m9so9071819pgb.4 for ; Sun, 29 Nov 2020 16:59:24 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20161025; h=references:user-agent:from:to:cc:subject:in-reply-to:message-id :date:mime-version; bh=iERPRfaQyra6bGgx/BWp3VM45VcQHbJKKMJNqTE+AaU=; b=ZcL/LqB6UdwymNA/0yrzLHucjGJQ32w8IGFzv33B0GOR2tqaBoCsR3oQJq3lNHBnAk YUl7QyTZxlV52o6LotLaO2n21ZaTSsAOQbGg177MMnzR6K3bTZjczdEXMHUgWgyQdOiI rdF7jlZQKi1+Fgn6XGhyx8G5OIK3tpMWGeNH3IVdty6gYbd1rR1eIkQuwE6LEVWnJJ+g 1tNiIBVvOT038mhs7tJC3sEkoQ0z5xCH08piE50HW+TiExbxPsgoNTdJH0N/VQx+t0fb dw38Zf3ud/qAfeOi3k3e8W/Ha0uBB6KnmXc4ihkCs7C5XVdBRFsWQ/3BEcp3UujEQ02N lMoQ== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:references:user-agent:from:to:cc:subject :in-reply-to:message-id:date:mime-version; bh=iERPRfaQyra6bGgx/BWp3VM45VcQHbJKKMJNqTE+AaU=; b=jkO9zW1GXYaKc0q9ClobI0Z2JaW4Vb3ucbuRDF6G9BAVCzAMa9p1IgWd77V2fT33y+ /iA5POtnkH6f7clysNmwuLtFjfVfw373pbx0qCrxwMWnfqbrMwuuxVBPeKqYNWyW8SCY /0Mgn7p/WXpFnfaAXyX/eALHhbJgNrKOff6pp6XT2412ueU1MqflRcDCoodxYJVW6C0q ciWzWCstgh9BawwWVq1MutsVTyF2Psaai5r24n9BRidiBi99Zqk7/o/szp6t24VWKA0Y HH/JoR0kqqPEf73Dh9dASCj/SDLBL1mPeMvZqoTzpX2iMsWBJTHJSWukRNEG3sOfdsxP V5dg== X-Gm-Message-State: AOAM533x4Vn6rLWXZtLHb4RKzX9Tr9ah9nRFuEvXGoia0w0PjGYzur2i X2XEt/qqxmWOkUwZMvyqouSjhCKKFbGyUg== X-Google-Smtp-Source: ABdhPJyj/UGS9Cb7xuZ1pxSneDsKogLpw1PviPSl2tNEdbdGpGOFFToWtkJS2HANK+e8xvnMz0ts2A== X-Received: by 2002:a65:63d5:: with SMTP id n21mr15605206pgv.346.1606697963275; Sun, 29 Nov 2020 16:59:23 -0800 (PST) Received: from tim-desktop (106-69-115-131.dyn.iinet.net.au. [106.69.115.131]) by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id y69sm14355555pfb.12.2020.11.29.16.59.21 (version=TLS1_3 cipher=TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 bits=256/256); Sun, 29 Nov 2020 16:59:22 -0800 (PST) References: <837dq4mcb1.fsf@gnu.org> <87ft4rrhad.fsf@kyleam.com> <87r1obyabn.fsf@gmail.com> User-agent: mu4e 1.5.7; emacs 27.1.50 From: Tim Cross To: Christopher Dimech Subject: Re: bug#44935: Emacs inserts hardwired org-agenda-files variable, overwriting user options In-reply-to: Message-ID: <87lfejy80o.fsf@gmail.com> Date: Mon, 30 Nov 2020 11:59:19 +1100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Received-SPF: pass client-ip=2607:f8b0:4864:20::529; envelope-from=theophilusx@gmail.com; helo=mail-pg1-x529.google.com X-Spam_score_int: -10 X-Spam_score: -1.1 X-Spam_bar: - X-Spam_report: (-1.1 / 5.0 requ) BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_EF=-0.1, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, FREEMAIL_REPLY=1, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE=-0.0001, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001 autolearn=no autolearn_force=no X-Spam_action: no action X-BeenThere: emacs-orgmode@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.23 Precedence: list List-Id: "General discussions about Org-mode." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Cc: emacs-orgmode@gnu.org Errors-To: emacs-orgmode-bounces+larch=yhetil.org@gnu.org Sender: "Emacs-orgmode" X-Migadu-Flow: FLOW_IN X-Migadu-Spam-Score: -2.98 X-Scanner: ns3122888.ip-94-23-21.eu Authentication-Results: aspmx1.migadu.com; dkim=pass header.d=gmail.com header.s=20161025 header.b=ZcL/LqB6; dmarc=pass (policy=none) header.from=gmail.com; spf=pass (aspmx1.migadu.com: domain of emacs-orgmode-bounces@gnu.org designates 209.51.188.17 as permitted sender) smtp.mailfrom=emacs-orgmode-bounces@gnu.org X-TUID: uMKHxWVETD0w Christopher Dimech writes: >> Sent: Monday, November 30, 2020 at 1:09 AM >> From: "Tim Cross" >> To: emacs-orgmode@gnu.org >> Subject: Re: bug#44935: Emacs inserts hardwired org-agenda-files variable, overwriting user options >> >> >> daniela-spit@gmx.it writes: >> >> >> Sent: Sunday, November 29, 2020 at 10:51 PM >> >> From: "Gyro Funch" >> >> To: daniela-spit@gmx.it, "Kyle Meyer" >> >> Cc: emacs-orgmode@gnu.org >> >> Subject: Re[2]: bug#44935: Emacs inserts hardwired org-agenda-files variable, overwriting user options >> >> >> >> > >> >> >> Sent: Sunday, November 29, 2020 at 10:20 PM >> >> >> From: "Kyle Meyer" >> >> >> To: daniela-spit@gmx.it >> >> >> Cc: "gyro funch" , emacs-orgmode@gnu.org >> >> >> Subject: Re: bug#44935: Emacs inserts hardwired org-agenda-files variable, overwriting user options >> >> >> >> >> >>daniela-spit@gmx.it writes: >> >> >> >> >> >> >> From: "gyro funch" >> >> >> [...] >> >> >> >> If I'm not mistaken, all of the development is done by volunteers. >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> Perhaps you could help resolve your issue instead of asking other >> >> >> >> people, who are likely already overworked, to shoulder the burden. >> >> >> > >> >> >> > Is there a mailing list for abuse? If I want abuse I shall ask for it. >> >> >> > Loser! >> >> > >> >> >> I don't see anything that gyro said as abuse. Name calling, on the >> >> >> other hand, has no place on this list. >> >> > >> >> >One asks for help, and people tell you to go fix it yourself. If there >> >> >is any disrespect, you bring it upon yourselves. And now you start. >> >> >Another Gnu Goon. >> >> >> >> I have found that people on this list are extremely friendly, courteous, >> >> and helpful. >> >> I suggest that you look back at the way you asked for/demanded help and >> >> the various responses you gave in this thread. >> >> Taking on an attitude of entitlement and showing a lack of respect for >> >> others, their perspectives, and efforts may not be the best way to get >> >> help. >> > >> > Nonsense. >> >> Not nonsense at all. You responses have become rude and unhelpful. I can >> understand how you may be frustrated by the bug reporting situation, but >> your response to that frustration has been to complain and be critical in >> a very non-constructive manner. You have now descended into name calling >> and personal abuse. You are beginning to exhibit behaviour >> which is not welcome here and which will result in people ignoring your >> posts. Multiple people have now pointed this out, which should make you >> stop and think rather than become emotional and respond defensively. >> >> the ball is now in your court. How you respond will influence how others >> respond to your requests and suggestions going forward. > > Please be aware that it was pointed out that one can configure > org-agenda-skip-unavailable-files to a non-nil value if she wants > non-existing/unreadable files to be skipped. > > But that option isn't mentioned in the manual or the docstring of the > org-agenda-files option. The problem is known and has been a source of great > frustration, that's why it was introduced. > > Daniela is quite right. If multiple people don't want to help her, that's > fine, many others will. > The issue at this point wasn't about whether there is a problem with how org manages org-agenda-files or even the acknowledged weakness in the documentation which needs a patch. The issue here is about attitude and being respectful. We can disagree on things. Opposing views are a good thing provided the expression of these opposing views is done with respect. This means no personal attacks, no calling names, no personal abuse. We all have different levels of sensitivity and some have thicker skin than others. However, once multiple people express the opinion that an attitude is not appropriate for the list, the responsibility is with the originator to consider that feedback and either adjust to meet community expectations, leave the community or continue without change and accept whatever consequences (if any) the list decides is appropriate. -- Tim Cross