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[106.69.120.32]) by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id x20sm13573360pjp.12.2021.05.11.02.02.06 (version=TLS1_3 cipher=TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 bits=256/256); Tue, 11 May 2021 02:02:08 -0700 (PDT) References: <87im3qj092.fsf@iki.fi> <87h7jaqvne.fsf@alphaville.usersys.redhat.com> <8735utdgs4.fsf@gmail.com> <875yzpkcal.fsf@web.de> User-agent: mu4e 1.5.13; emacs 28.0.50 From: Tim Cross To: "Dr. Arne Babenhauserheide" Subject: Re: The fate of ditaa.jar (9.4.5.) 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List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Cc: emacs-orgmode@gnu.org Errors-To: emacs-orgmode-bounces+larch=yhetil.org@gnu.org Sender: "Emacs-orgmode" X-Migadu-Flow: FLOW_IN ARC-Message-Signature: i=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=yhetil.org; s=key1; t=1620725494; h=from:from:sender:sender:reply-to:subject:subject:date:date: message-id:message-id:to:to:cc:cc:mime-version:mime-version: content-type:content-type: content-transfer-encoding:content-transfer-encoding: in-reply-to:in-reply-to:references:references:list-id:list-help: list-unsubscribe:list-subscribe:list-post:dkim-signature; bh=1J9MofPU5vqAJ2Zer3Jzy6zfKp6+FwajPWRiFQ45aPI=; b=M1bI0+WXhQFXFrY90DJ4Jf/8/U4MRRrSu4rO3GcFS4qrmdZmtEx3VtaCBfk+7y3A4SCCzt XGv9ODlKcgGbbfA7K2nORTXfIjttffNmWrVmj6EDNSAGrD4+GYWUDQx5Wli6/nmoPNc+TI L2yp8V8fhphsMNow0vOBOHo1GU+o70hAh2te3rTU904FWXoI/MJazPlh1KxyF+feK6tFJb 2ohJDj41OLyBWoOAA2HCVnznThXF/BzaCeOH/UgBQZ1MVz6m+IwC1+0UaajNHXcwMEyWs8 TQeGtDTOwYYsMHbmhrFUsUHiqU8jvmt7gnrhc7xNLN9nVsqbohpMm/7QLRBrXQ== ARC-Seal: i=1; s=key1; d=yhetil.org; t=1620725494; a=rsa-sha256; cv=none; b=bGSvyfOv0Q8h1PEotxAxLhenX2A2/mo4I18rKF4Os18OJT3xW4qqnh2iG56etbaeGm8e7l wV2FxDtwsqQKe0tLhk8riJbfl3gDxYgdWusl8IC3aBRItDOZ2jriPwLw+t1JjtENFogyZ8 IIMklmMWZBkWFGcybdZpYDt6VToawJVUWddw+5PST5YH3+ItjLfd6XpnXl/2xcUGj3D0Bj Cen5Zg6mNhHC8YY17jjK8Kv84VDLMQGK3L3gJR3F6b5bxrNnSGhqe7+LYgI6Ixbxc1040l 02Ap1KjzYBQnRp6xJ+qvpItOuNFFuh7i6nXNAQLDIecsPDRmFmt5ScwpmwoRIQ== ARC-Authentication-Results: i=1; aspmx1.migadu.com; dkim=pass header.d=gmail.com header.s=20161025 header.b=UuOun8HU; dmarc=pass (policy=none) header.from=gmail.com; spf=pass (aspmx1.migadu.com: domain of emacs-orgmode-bounces@gnu.org designates 209.51.188.17 as permitted sender) smtp.mailfrom=emacs-orgmode-bounces@gnu.org X-Migadu-Spam-Score: -3.15 Authentication-Results: aspmx1.migadu.com; dkim=pass header.d=gmail.com header.s=20161025 header.b=UuOun8HU; dmarc=pass (policy=none) header.from=gmail.com; spf=pass (aspmx1.migadu.com: domain of emacs-orgmode-bounces@gnu.org designates 209.51.188.17 as permitted sender) smtp.mailfrom=emacs-orgmode-bounces@gnu.org X-Migadu-Queue-Id: 20AF6219EA X-Spam-Score: -3.15 X-Migadu-Scanner: scn0.migadu.com X-TUID: Y6JbuTd4UooK "Dr. Arne Babenhauserheide" writes: > [[PGP Signed Part:Undecided]] > > Tim Cross writes: >> I agree. As pointed out already, just bundling the jar file is not >> sufficient as you need a java runtime as well. > > Java is available in my distribution, ditaa is not. Removing ditaa from > org means that I have to do manual installation and configuration, while > with ditaa bundled, org-mode can simply note that I need java installed. > I get that. However, this is of course not the case for many users (Mac, Windows). Having to install additional software to realise org functionality is normal for much of org-mode. In fact, I had to install ditta when I first used it because it wasn't bundled. That was not an issue and no surprise given I also had to install textlive, plantuml, graphviz, taskjuggler, ledger, sqlite and many other things. I understand the convenience for users argument. However, I think we also need to consider the maintenance overheads and consistency aspects as well (including dealing with bug reports when it doesn't work).=20 >> If we bundle it, we also need to ensure it is updated if/when new jar >> versions are released. > > We can do that, but we don=E2=80=99t have to. As long as the bundled jar = works, > it is much better than no jar. And users can use newer version as they > like by changing the jar-path. > > Note that this isn=E2=80=99t about security, since even if an old version= of > ditaa should turn out to be vulnerable, this would still be less > dangerous than a shell-block. Therefore old versions of ditaa are > completely fine. > My thoughts were more about bugs and confusing deprecation warnings which can arise when using an older jar file with a more recent jre. Ultimately, it will fall to whoever steps up to maintain ditta support to decide.=20 --=20 Tim Cross