From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: from mp0.migadu.com ([2001:41d0:303:5f26::]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 (256/256 bits)) by ms8.migadu.com with LMTPS id YE7dHtzhn2WAmAAAkFu2QA (envelope-from ) for ; Thu, 11 Jan 2024 13:41:00 +0100 Received: from aspmx1.migadu.com ([2001:41d0:403:58f0::]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 (256/256 bits)) by mp0.migadu.com with LMTPS id IAFWGtzhn2VjygAAqHPOHw (envelope-from ) for ; Thu, 11 Jan 2024 13:41:00 +0100 X-Envelope-To: larch@yhetil.org Authentication-Results: aspmx1.migadu.com; dkim=pass header.d=posteo.net header.s=2017 header.b=HocimdmN; spf=pass (aspmx1.migadu.com: domain of "emacs-orgmode-bounces+larch=yhetil.org@gnu.org" designates 209.51.188.17 as permitted sender) smtp.mailfrom="emacs-orgmode-bounces+larch=yhetil.org@gnu.org"; dmarc=pass (policy=none) header.from=posteo.net ARC-Message-Signature: i=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=yhetil.org; s=key1; t=1704976860; h=from:from:sender:sender:reply-to:subject:subject:date:date: message-id:message-id:to:to:cc:cc:mime-version:mime-version: content-type:content-type: content-transfer-encoding:content-transfer-encoding: in-reply-to:in-reply-to:references:references:list-id:list-help: list-unsubscribe:list-subscribe:list-post:dkim-signature; bh=fDNN4DDowZNXpfrVGBayP3lSYiTfU/n759CgtZDdzdg=; b=b8OU03jD8hSuE7nAH/Np5g5B3oWnRYNobcnHwDDvFALyeTJCNGSJaAZSNCN6d7Y5s6RLGa dFRwHMyi8VYQww7Rgjd/dASuORk+iUkQEvL6wfrAe2ZFjsOeueBa5nKxvf/1B/fCD+EN2O Y8d2UbnjKS3vHlmR0fMDywd6MOxlb3iBjo313pVaZtmpU7dKNb/6lp8AGIUC8/BbeZLSoC f+kD4USiil5jwpDMtAmeziZhrMe5+A/BtfRmhINzUnSmb0s7sdKhoGsJpxdYndfUoWxsLv yc0phqU4Fb2P5u7xzWfJyNHwsKHqoEoheGaxfmmLr+uXnggkTOA+/jRkTmRhXQ== ARC-Authentication-Results: i=1; aspmx1.migadu.com; dkim=pass header.d=posteo.net header.s=2017 header.b=HocimdmN; spf=pass (aspmx1.migadu.com: domain of "emacs-orgmode-bounces+larch=yhetil.org@gnu.org" designates 209.51.188.17 as permitted sender) smtp.mailfrom="emacs-orgmode-bounces+larch=yhetil.org@gnu.org"; dmarc=pass (policy=none) header.from=posteo.net ARC-Seal: i=1; s=key1; d=yhetil.org; t=1704976860; a=rsa-sha256; cv=none; b=gJ6pR/2EgHZGJD//9f91r8cYXo4QUFr4n17GyPqcsnkSop2IClMLn5phNPCiIcFtdDyNmL cIjYynMcx4blddFDY1pXZZd9z/OfQt+8YKNwvYgvMC285lxWRBteZZO924rNS7EUdGYcH5 Z9mcyqRLEojeAXyK7LibVoWqJzrtv9tOIRpDk2Y2mqkppqRjFRjkdPM9ieomOUU0jcn4MX 8m7rETgJm7tUrogu+BwpP02wPcxOHD6rfx3+3KhBC3ob4AY1fsuTDEI60zOFX4CeeING28 LKf0zswIATpMblV2Edh5FWoHDGftFFV7u+vZBjY6sTloS1b0PARt9UbTm9bHTg== Received: from lists.gnu.org (lists.gnu.org [209.51.188.17]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by aspmx1.migadu.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 3FD5B39958 for ; Thu, 11 Jan 2024 13:41:00 +0100 (CET) Received: from localhost ([::1] helo=lists1p.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1rNuLW-0002gE-Ik; Thu, 11 Jan 2024 07:39:42 -0500 Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::10]) by lists.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1rNuLP-0002dz-Id for emacs-orgmode@gnu.org; Thu, 11 Jan 2024 07:39:36 -0500 Received: from mout02.posteo.de ([185.67.36.66]) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1rNuLM-0000I7-Hy for emacs-orgmode@gnu.org; Thu, 11 Jan 2024 07:39:35 -0500 Received: from submission (posteo.de [185.67.36.169]) by mout02.posteo.de (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 0332E240106 for ; Thu, 11 Jan 2024 13:39:28 +0100 (CET) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/simple; d=posteo.net; s=2017; t=1704976769; bh=LNJZZCXCSBXAUI4lfaXsv1UtAcIYVarRduBQUQ7bxbU=; h=From:To:Cc:Subject:Date:Message-ID:MIME-Version: Content-Transfer-Encoding:From; b=HocimdmN3cbVGjljr/F0kG9CeOYJgjcReUIOfUIpF8q4NHMvp2k/dLFCAlycq7Ve0 WKVyJ5R83R4Z3pdiC27BzWbjfCxGmurj0ITTARUbB1nKnHjPGlZd3uBvcabrt9qi8H W6Gyc1Hdp32N3Z+fFQnMBMJUGSyYaUQZzoK6+74HEBiH48eYQuDQDmlGudKm/ZZzi1 sZ9AdCTA8OlhMSmGzAlj/eZCe7ySnRjUjamwWthVEfeWOhNqasL7mkJ+fQpDzOAKMY iJWfELqXK71RldmMu/pyqAcPAtws/TA2eoLv7/7KdD5m0IKkm9hZwUigdduZ36s7za g2cA37J1wCOAA== Received: from customer (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by submission (posteo.de) with ESMTPSA id 4T9kkl56k6z6tvc; Thu, 11 Jan 2024 13:39:27 +0100 (CET) From: Ihor Radchenko To: Rudolf =?utf-8?Q?Adamkovi=C4=8D?= Cc: emacs-orgmode@gnu.org Subject: Re: Why not enable extra keys by default? In-Reply-To: References: Date: Thu, 11 Jan 2024 12:42:39 +0000 Message-ID: <87jzogjb28.fsf@localhost> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Received-SPF: pass client-ip=185.67.36.66; envelope-from=yantar92@posteo.net; helo=mout02.posteo.de X-Spam_score_int: -43 X-Spam_score: -4.4 X-Spam_bar: ---- X-Spam_report: (-4.4 / 5.0 requ) BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_EF=-0.1, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-2.3, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_H5=0.001, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_WL=0.001, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, T_SCC_BODY_TEXT_LINE=-0.01 autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no X-Spam_action: no action X-BeenThere: emacs-orgmode@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: "General discussions about Org-mode." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: emacs-orgmode-bounces+larch=yhetil.org@gnu.org Sender: emacs-orgmode-bounces+larch=yhetil.org@gnu.org X-Migadu-Flow: FLOW_IN X-Migadu-Country: US X-Migadu-Spam-Score: -6.10 X-Spam-Score: -6.10 X-Migadu-Queue-Id: 3FD5B39958 X-Migadu-Scanner: mx11.migadu.com X-TUID: dHHF+OgwNnNa Rudolf Adamkovi=C4=8D writes: > I have the 'org-use-extra-keys' customization enabled to avoid reaching > for the arrow keys, but the variable needs to be set before loading Org, > which makes literate configuration a bit more complex. > Other Emacs commands have alternative keys bound by default, which makes > me wonder, why does Org need the 'org-use-extra-keys' customization? If > the user rebinds any of the extra keys, their personal key bindings take > precedence, so all should work well for everyone, right? > > If so, then why not (1) enable the extra keys by default and (2) > deprecate the 'org-use-extra-keys' customization? A comment in org-keys.el says: ;; We only set them when really needed because otherwise the ;; menus don't show the simple keys Also, it is not true that re-binding will always work - if user binds keys before Org mode is loaded (for example, globally), Org mode will overwrite them. Finally, C-c / conflict with winner-mode. ESC / are bound to forward/backward-word by default. --=20 Ihor Radchenko // yantar92, Org mode contributor, Learn more about Org mode at . Support Org development at , or support my work at