From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: from mp12.migadu.com ([2001:41d0:8:6d80::]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 (256/256 bits)) by ms5.migadu.com with LMTPS id 2EXGJakIxGNIoAAAbAwnHQ (envelope-from ) for ; Sun, 15 Jan 2023 15:07:37 +0100 Received: from aspmx1.migadu.com ([2001:41d0:8:6d80::]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 (256/256 bits)) by mp12.migadu.com with LMTPS id 8DN1JakIxGOjfQEAauVa8A (envelope-from ) for ; Sun, 15 Jan 2023 15:07:37 +0100 Received: from lists.gnu.org (lists.gnu.org [209.51.188.17]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by aspmx1.migadu.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 387B229899 for ; Sun, 15 Jan 2023 15:07:36 +0100 (CET) Received: from localhost ([::1] helo=lists1p.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1pH3ek-0000x5-U1; Sun, 15 Jan 2023 09:06:42 -0500 Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::10]) by lists.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1pH3ej-0000wr-Dg for emacs-orgmode@gnu.org; Sun, 15 Jan 2023 09:06:41 -0500 Received: from mout02.posteo.de ([185.67.36.66]) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1pH3eh-0006v5-68 for emacs-orgmode@gnu.org; Sun, 15 Jan 2023 09:06:41 -0500 Received: from submission (posteo.de [185.67.36.169]) by mout02.posteo.de (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 373C5240169 for ; Sun, 15 Jan 2023 15:06:35 +0100 (CET) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/simple; d=posteo.net; s=2017; t=1673791597; bh=vkZMxY/IgJIStaqQ0CQPzrzvXrVpaMlu7gq59noCXbs=; h=From:To:Cc:Subject:Date:From; b=ewYUbHcAgUODBn6XXNfhfaY8J+gizLofB+vao6+b1pz1YRO05eFx/gKZimia6BQo4 C9inrXKdGt+dod+FZenA2/6cfmwBTnTMC0vKSVwxXZ4uDI9qzxR6iUllvQivONWvmF IXQxoeHDFqEwOkEVo16hDcBT/q0xMKPmIxsghk/XK4PRCplqbwS49QPXFqj40ab7C8 vvfWAkRsr9TNnqnS6s3lncqvtjUfuW/JqzLqzam4ByYlBXq/cEiSITETSyDN3rafi4 KPcc7F2s4EkLwkEQX73Bmdr8ipG0stj0kkRF0jQC/ERXZc+6xhvt7+Bk1g7OTicozN dxp2E/19Sk5LQ== Received: from customer (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by submission (posteo.de) with ESMTPSA id 4Nvxls6VL2z9rxB; Sun, 15 Jan 2023 15:06:33 +0100 (CET) From: Ihor Radchenko To: Tim Cross Cc: Max Nikulin , emacs-orgmode@gnu.org Subject: Re: [FEATURE REQUEST] Timezone support in org-mode datestamps and org-agenda In-Reply-To: <63c30f34.650a0220.498b8.4573@mx.google.com> References: <63c30f34.650a0220.498b8.4573@mx.google.com> Date: Sun, 15 Jan 2023 14:07:04 +0000 Message-ID: <87ilh7evsn.fsf@localhost> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Received-SPF: pass client-ip=185.67.36.66; envelope-from=yantar92@posteo.net; helo=mout02.posteo.de X-Spam_score_int: -43 X-Spam_score: -4.4 X-Spam_bar: ---- X-Spam_report: (-4.4 / 5.0 requ) BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_EF=-0.1, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-2.3, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_H2=-0.001, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001 autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no X-Spam_action: no action X-BeenThere: emacs-orgmode@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: "General discussions about Org-mode." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: emacs-orgmode-bounces+larch=yhetil.org@gnu.org Sender: emacs-orgmode-bounces+larch=yhetil.org@gnu.org X-Migadu-Country: US X-Migadu-Flow: FLOW_IN ARC-Authentication-Results: i=1; aspmx1.migadu.com; dkim=pass header.d=posteo.net header.s=2017 header.b=ewYUbHcA; spf=pass (aspmx1.migadu.com: domain of "emacs-orgmode-bounces+larch=yhetil.org@gnu.org" designates 209.51.188.17 as permitted sender) smtp.mailfrom="emacs-orgmode-bounces+larch=yhetil.org@gnu.org"; dmarc=pass (policy=none) header.from=posteo.net ARC-Seal: i=1; s=key1; d=yhetil.org; t=1673791656; a=rsa-sha256; cv=none; b=VopLhhdEuk9AOgDLY+k4SGgxnfkcP9w6CtEicpxFf16+XYIGizgrJSCrYPyfk3MkcbNtRU zeKeAlHt3dqXqfv+gCMEaNmesJmAwohbJbTvNwhu2l12/NN34ocgJwGQHfQCeCVRIo+3ed ipbN7KVCNcenVAXJRkQ6OkxRsJ/d/v2gfpML9ya4JrgtWooaBEudq8WbEGilFkY6YCbrWw Y+XJfDMxKUhemtV7pT38ypHRRNkgfSwoeaAMJrjysTq81Zg55RZgYbSh+TAXuvfGo+HTcH phukACUF5w/+AE9Y9c558XXnHfNW34bmIPlQFWGFlWpQ1bsWLriJ+LdZ1ipcRQ== ARC-Message-Signature: i=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=yhetil.org; s=key1; t=1673791656; h=from:from:sender:sender:reply-to:subject:subject:date:date: message-id:message-id:to:to:cc:cc:mime-version:mime-version: content-type:content-type:in-reply-to:in-reply-to: references:references:list-id:list-help:list-unsubscribe: list-subscribe:list-post:dkim-signature; bh=hOLPpUOdyR2Bl1hdbUpFpi//+keC5YQi1INqzv5FZJ0=; b=lzm5fQKVaKUSY06RMH97ozJ8wgBf1LDEMJcvCVDJfcaHH41V85sdXxJuqCwIfTFFOVU7w+ YqgwjVqQ9oMQAczvg31pbuB86sMbqFrD4I54U0TBJo1GhBd2bp3Fhq6LPpX2eliOKTmSPJ zVFj5xIbIpORZmzwsUU00kC333mumYNm1jWS1e0XQuYM/HHIwXqiqLNsMaP5SSX5JI7b/b ubIrDxWFBTTp8muyEkvFyjOuktitv0UfhTTmyVLMjAOGXQmMcufu6yOqGcqd1akyy/mazf dKmYgYyp9cJYwrlBx8UQS4WosL6NhLzuN8lDilNBlPvqff2WTi1egJ6/sJUpwg== X-Migadu-Queue-Id: 387B229899 X-Migadu-Scanner: scn0.migadu.com Authentication-Results: aspmx1.migadu.com; dkim=pass header.d=posteo.net header.s=2017 header.b=ewYUbHcA; spf=pass (aspmx1.migadu.com: domain of "emacs-orgmode-bounces+larch=yhetil.org@gnu.org" designates 209.51.188.17 as permitted sender) smtp.mailfrom="emacs-orgmode-bounces+larch=yhetil.org@gnu.org"; dmarc=pass (policy=none) header.from=posteo.net X-Migadu-Spam-Score: -9.86 X-Spam-Score: -9.86 X-TUID: cClUZ1gNtJC2 Tim Cross writes: > Unfortunately, the common abbreviated forms like EST, AEST etc are > inconsistent here. Some places will have a standard and a daylight > savings type i.e. AEST and AEDT, while others will have just AEST. TO > make it worse, two locations with the same time zone offset my use > different versions i.e. Australia/Melbourn is AEST (+10/+11) and > Australia/Sydney is AEST (+10) and AEDT (+11) and Australia/Brisbane is > just AEST (+10). If everywhere which has daylight savings ensured they > used a different abbreviation for daylight saving and non-daylight > saving times, life would be easier, but they don't). Then of course > there are many countries which don't have a symbolic letter abbreviation > i.e. just have e.g -05 as their abbreviated TZ name. > > It is this and other related reasons why just relying on Emacs' internal > API for times and dates is not sufficient. The abbreviated times have > ambiguity and the full timezone specification is cumbersome and > ugly. Even worse is that issue won't be shown up as failures - you will > just silently get wrong results. So, basically we may need a way to (1) identify ambiguous TZ specifications; (2) signal to user about potential issues. Note that these are also optional features we may implement any time once we have basic timezone support. For (2) we may use something similar to `world-clock' - display user timestamp at point for different time zones. Maybe via eldoc. -- Ihor Radchenko // yantar92, Org mode contributor, Learn more about Org mode at . Support Org development at , or support my work at