From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: from mp1 ([2001:41d0:8:6d80::]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 (256/256 bits)) by ms0.migadu.com with LMTPS id wCYvEgXvmmAXaQEAgWs5BA (envelope-from ) for ; Tue, 11 May 2021 22:54:29 +0200 Received: from aspmx1.migadu.com ([2001:41d0:8:6d80::]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 (256/256 bits)) by mp1 with LMTPS id MDLMDQXvmmCHKgAAbx9fmQ (envelope-from ) for ; Tue, 11 May 2021 20:54:29 +0000 Received: from lists.gnu.org (lists.gnu.org [209.51.188.17]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by aspmx1.migadu.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id A860B1AF71 for ; Tue, 11 May 2021 22:54:28 +0200 (CEST) Received: from localhost ([::1]:32984 helo=lists1p.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1lgZOd-0002A6-1o for larch@yhetil.org; Tue, 11 May 2021 16:54:27 -0400 Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::10]:44076) by lists.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1lgZNt-000285-C0 for emacs-orgmode@gnu.org; Tue, 11 May 2021 16:53:41 -0400 Received: from mout.web.de ([212.227.15.3]:48227) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1lgZNr-0003vx-3N for emacs-orgmode@gnu.org; Tue, 11 May 2021 16:53:41 -0400 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/simple; d=web.de; s=dbaedf251592; t=1620766414; bh=eQx/tPH2kK2ZS2oSwftikUsu5MK9h4lRbQVqTMuV9jc=; h=X-UI-Sender-Class:References:From:To:Cc:Subject:In-reply-to:Date; b=WW2vYT5SJgATi+JtohawwJRCQKxGGNy9M1MbphPmAdsBtvVNGgurkLJjqYVpa2feV BZITcFRkr03Ak53D3cMPi293wla08bTn2A0EhSsAZTjmUeIZx9zQCB4qzFN+jBFItk gL8CThl+nld0+b9aJRez25a52bPfpZI7vWHffTVY= X-UI-Sender-Class: c548c8c5-30a9-4db5-a2e7-cb6cb037b8f9 Received: from fluss ([84.165.17.25]) by smtp.web.de (mrweb001 [213.165.67.108]) with ESMTPSA (Nemesis) id 0LbIiI-1lDEql41us-00ksuV; Tue, 11 May 2021 22:53:34 +0200 References: <87im3qj092.fsf@iki.fi> <87mtt2jz4h.fsf@web.de> User-agent: mu4e 1.4.15; emacs 28.0.50 From: "Dr. Arne Babenhauserheide" To: Arthur Miller Subject: Re: The fate of ditaa.jar (9.4.5.) In-reply-to: Date: Tue, 11 May 2021 22:53:30 +0200 Message-ID: <87h7j9hu0l.fsf@web.de> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/signed; boundary="=-=-="; micalg=pgp-sha256; protocol="application/pgp-signature" X-Provags-ID: V03:K1:HgY2xOi6P9IqTZbXTyw1zdA6zI3rHAT5CQ+G1kNXNSqFjj18m3M Px5/twef6cC/V1/25nefazskdF0GtZxbycY2bnjvLOlu/9VgwG2Pgwv/JIf0ewSwe/4UtEc VQY34X7qfKkBxnrmuODGBj5yF7xA0ZdNapmHLT8vcLD/vht66KtXtLO5mVujV1CLqssDJIE IJxSF74sVwMXqTn90TWbA== X-UI-Out-Filterresults: notjunk:1;V03:K0:Xl1h0XCYXVc=:6Zi4O6F28sy7gQNfiYhpVZ UJyqqcdd/+68A1R1ZKwenzaferSxpQm+q5M3r0UNOQkPHmQZ9uBi1wAFmR+WqK0xp2ha+TrTW 2jDwuzsBw48heat0vwbMTFIrEZ1TNTt3BDjaKDTzSuEhw2fFoozgXBA31iPWsXR7LO/4rq6I/ PdHgur1bE5tHigSuTti/qs6WGjuyNidCBkGZnTJuEaL2aqKk/mLrCYcv2OZOeo/7YQOL0lHZ8 7LPh99miC4dF9ht4yBZ/T9aDXn5cgjarfxU3l9iutu54Zi7/vD2RibXj81v/aNTYY7xgVgJco YuRYAfCsfbSmeWrYCzxx6TwcbIpAj4j/xGvvVDjGNtPtJw7Kz53sIO6M/OvxdlqhRGgDz0JdF 9xiJ9IU0C5t5OuR6pAJp/Fi6LXDnVNa+5ek9ciZ9RM6tPr8ILk3BOEAZZ7/Q7EkRxPL0L91a3 QQry/CJaCtiCNlh+Nf6ro3wnBCEOczEy35aOb7JAvyCmpLp0uWCnNEwLnWPaCs9STnNcCsAmk TXHbaOrz4K+t3KHc5VaKk+KSvJMHpJSYFi985mmPmqd7n74HkyMoc+dcyjSrCVaExlqQUlj/L fxGPyfgGTYKr3V8EdYjQsTKhfPPFzkO88tmimyDlNjZx2/gzlSMY8sfDcS6hiYkwg0K8vvWdj n2n3W2ANY7qcTVB+1M38JWAumUhuQ7M8/buVCXhI4NUYmyumQwVJCH8vySiYZxsktRClCOcqe 6MIx65qpGA6J8aL7pTiEFRgXHQZC+DiaH+dsor8aS2EGs1O8zKX3GpFJJi9Qd12wSZLst5ays wDCpd4QT108gQW1edEeSZunaymPwYJPgO0+kurJuu5sQqoAcBrrxUjQFN/eqaaEMVDa5BT7au 4R03WSqUiRYjeScWEWEyQKPLJqS2wm+JLqUQ6kXXNKXnQx8Lz/F6QiqJul8UICWxV46/+AM8c C7da0XeQkucLK8ndBhMjvN3IfelDysnUw6K/vhubi85+5jst4/m3atYbRuDysYx1vtozDWuG2 +HkFr1Jym602PqVJxswHxIxiXROpR3et9vMCv0ZMTTVnCOkQ8BQhgvRGLSYCWrlDKe98WJTqG bJLu0eV0njBuYy/obk+lFrB+uoAbPuarvfSSCV77SFCeVg8xEFfjLwQNo6Jw7B7FjdVi8KROy qqgzs5LO5eWrS3/a6bvl4TZFsGucS7ZzCU0DPiKSD4qZITp34tt9zLTUpJxvtJJADNSxo= Received-SPF: pass client-ip=212.227.15.3; envelope-from=arne_bab@web.de; helo=mout.web.de X-Spam_score_int: -27 X-Spam_score: -2.8 X-Spam_bar: -- X-Spam_report: (-2.8 / 5.0 requ) BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_EF=-0.1, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_LOW=-0.7, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_H3=0.001, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_WL=0.001, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001 autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no X-Spam_action: no action X-BeenThere: emacs-orgmode@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.23 Precedence: list List-Id: "General discussions about Org-mode." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Cc: Christopher Dimech , emacs-orgmode@gnu.org Errors-To: emacs-orgmode-bounces+larch=yhetil.org@gnu.org Sender: "Emacs-orgmode" X-Migadu-Flow: FLOW_IN ARC-Message-Signature: i=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=yhetil.org; s=key1; t=1620766468; h=from:from:sender:sender:reply-to:subject:subject:date:date: message-id:message-id:to:to:cc:cc:mime-version:mime-version: content-type:content-type:in-reply-to:in-reply-to: references:references:list-id:list-help:list-unsubscribe: list-subscribe:list-post:dkim-signature; bh=YY+9cJaOVhgGExVHlXUEkkNvk9bLldbL6uvg26ur5+g=; b=Tv7CmoCuwUhDIfsbYPyzPWj4mIEeAE/yuCJ3CUVnQB2fioerYi/VMIL10kULRGzzRA03sR QhDAPTuI30y1ZUPrcaGCPWUIjbEcMuTX5mjHpsJMAXjYMrVE0je7A7KwuzZ6/+DuArlj4R dzz/aa+g7tE6K7J1U5Zd/GbGoPfg8VLeiPRqEXdo5XfSsAtThja3zoR+/m3y4RK57750QQ Vve5VlG+M8k0qMTF8EjYZ+qu4NOO+16CzBHV17p9A74NmK3VukI6/ICqohhqXo7UXPTE0/ SutszxZgF/+wZYOyRzwxhjn+MkWYW02KYaD1UepA2UhyJZ1mSw5gV6WF7ayCww== ARC-Seal: i=1; s=key1; d=yhetil.org; t=1620766468; a=rsa-sha256; cv=none; b=Qw2JefabwvNUIOsNKmb+Qa7wDATA4ozuTnG0j5IicWFiV4NUVenwF56LpH011QOVRT/sl8 mjTiVM9dvAistNaiAWwmwQdS90gQdwxG7dXPclHEPbTR0u+ex8HWshewtESSs7pxXZPrXB p0KpxS1VC/Y/m7jwkS2EUjEJfGVS1dcXk5w4ym/7IVzG1jP+qL577n8HvPjWissrfvJMrx aM6jUSdm2usFI0GL4P5VCoIrkIIlVMeXyNSCuoOr7TW13TXgKvej43jo6cAOvRW8JEaqSB ubqOzS6FqCa7qaTzniBfUWhrovfG9hSusHv5UDFmLWGNic8kxTUATQLAFwEaPQ== ARC-Authentication-Results: i=1; aspmx1.migadu.com; dkim=pass header.d=web.de header.s=dbaedf251592 header.b=WW2vYT5S; dmarc=pass (policy=none) header.from=web.de; spf=pass (aspmx1.migadu.com: domain of emacs-orgmode-bounces@gnu.org designates 209.51.188.17 as permitted sender) smtp.mailfrom=emacs-orgmode-bounces@gnu.org X-Migadu-Spam-Score: -4.25 Authentication-Results: aspmx1.migadu.com; dkim=pass header.d=web.de header.s=dbaedf251592 header.b=WW2vYT5S; dmarc=pass (policy=none) header.from=web.de; spf=pass (aspmx1.migadu.com: domain of emacs-orgmode-bounces@gnu.org designates 209.51.188.17 as permitted sender) smtp.mailfrom=emacs-orgmode-bounces@gnu.org X-Migadu-Queue-Id: A860B1AF71 X-Spam-Score: -4.25 X-Migadu-Scanner: scn0.migadu.com X-TUID: aKRWxFw/zFkz --=-=-= Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Arthur Miller writes: > Christopher Dimech writes: > >> If org-mode wants to support ditaa, it is a requirement to inform the us= er how to >> get the software and install it. Moving into into a separate repository= without >> appropriately telling the user introduces the problem that users will mi= ss out >> on free software that they would otherwise have used. Using org should = not be made=20 >> more difficult than it already is.=20 >>=20=20=20 > Another problem I didn't mention in previous replay, is that user can > have wrong (outdated) version of Java installed on his/her machine which > might not be compatible with ditaa version org mode ships, which may > introduce further questions and problems. IMO I think it is better to > leave out 3rd party applications and let users install those on their > own.=20 The old version should just keep working. It requires a Java older than Java 8, and Java 8 is available everywhere. For the new releases that is less clear, since ditaa is adding Clojure. I would bundle the old version to keep old documents working (I do not want org-mode to be volatile software[1] that breaks existing documents with an update), but notify the user that a new version exists. [1]: https://stevelosh.com/blog/2012/04/volatile-software/ Best wishes, Arne =2D-=20 Unpolitisch sein hei=C3=9Ft politisch sein ohne es zu merken --=-=-= Content-Type: application/pgp-signature; name="signature.asc" -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- iQJEBAEBCAAuFiEE801qEjXQSQPNItXAE++NRSQDw+sFAmCa7s0QHGFybmVfYmFi QHdlYi5kZQAKCRAT741FJAPD61riEACT0Pw1VlDyvtZyXrhz6HxPdxEHNWehIust F+eZbDk5PeucVZH2JoECXSFcu1ZKUcQCJHbcYBrs1KfxodqbiIWlERHt9Zbh9hwd Qh3rEAerYJKdRr4fga4ThdrWSjrrMYpS47ckSa7vKGDIMM6ivoWvRyOe1+1c6ams w9A0FXya9UXIh1MVrZ8PEm1MzOPXdmZjGEmF/CX2NoOBV4XAaa1b3ZRQwVEX738y pQpXf7sl9o0ELY/+JpX0gmaDe4kTASI+ZSV+oWY0yPuE128I4uRe9+LeNCNrnxzk jUPnMIw+Awsw2PznJE67owHBvgD800wesyTJhLgyA6CwyAAvLrdyONlmp9rxJiIg iRBnG6M4e8s02qOBV4oW1280kJHUh2MrkQDttYwxA2W66kpVXDHS1sVmXpGwIiKV BD3cF5n9DJPpw+6DKszpPmYbDn+DYPdL8HLE7OxaHwLBbRKO+/W/Bqhb5Irr++up yPhf/fdKy2XnXc75DisK/AabetEMMnMvz/8sDErZVD25USrL+Fl5GHCFZJVkM/nS zLYpX0k/TGj/mV6zo0ifwaaX0to1BxiJXADmg9SAdo+DEB5mlnyQ5VQTak6ZUGqi U/TfUoGdRpifHL87tuZ+RSacO3qkTu2PchnyC8Lxb37rmI51vLp/3jPwSO4IfzsC b+RO3lSErYjEBAEBCAAuFiEE3Si95tmHXKvOSosd3M8NswvBBUgFAmCa7s0QHGFy bmVfYmFiQHdlYi5kZQAKCRDczw2zC8EFSLjPBACMqTEAXuD1qVaUz42xlv5RqXXp tszVNp5A/OLVTHsXNVNQW+Osi3WgWuK/YISTgvqywbnZUZapaYPASSg8PzGXd8CF Pk92yxdD15womohjDQ2/AUCbXbO8uPN9VHJLMNnxQn7+uaLIHNoXKoqvJvpBgW+D zxPsPH4CwjQXhYdWfQ== =d+zk -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- --=-=-=--