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[220.235.22.74]) by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id n50sm4084682pfv.69.2021.04.27.23.14.41 for (version=TLS1_3 cipher=TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 bits=256/256); Tue, 27 Apr 2021 23:14:42 -0700 (PDT) References: <87eehuerb2.fsf@gmail.com> <871rav11s3.fsf@gnu.org> <87v9873sy3.fsf@gmail.com> <87a6pjath2.fsf@gnu.org> <87sg3b3r84.fsf@gmail.com> <87mttj7y74.fsf@bzg.fr> User-agent: mu4e 1.5.12; emacs 28.0.50 From: Tim Cross To: emacs-orgmode@gnu.org Subject: Re: [WDYT, mini] key h in agenda for quick help Date: Wed, 28 Apr 2021 16:08:54 +1000 In-reply-to: <87mttj7y74.fsf@bzg.fr> Message-ID: <87eeevkka8.fsf@gmail.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Received-SPF: pass client-ip=2607:f8b0:4864:20::102c; envelope-from=theophilusx@gmail.com; helo=mail-pj1-x102c.google.com X-Spam_score_int: -20 X-Spam_score: -2.1 X-Spam_bar: -- X-Spam_report: (-2.1 / 5.0 requ) BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_EF=-0.1, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE=-0.0001, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001 autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no X-Spam_action: no action X-BeenThere: emacs-orgmode@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.23 Precedence: list List-Id: "General discussions about Org-mode." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: emacs-orgmode-bounces+larch=yhetil.org@gnu.org Sender: "Emacs-orgmode" X-Migadu-Flow: FLOW_IN ARC-Message-Signature: i=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=yhetil.org; s=key1; t=1619590515; h=from:from:sender:sender:reply-to:subject:subject:date:date: message-id:message-id:to:to:cc:mime-version:mime-version: content-type:content-type:in-reply-to:in-reply-to: references:references:list-id:list-help:list-unsubscribe: list-subscribe:list-post:dkim-signature; bh=oAfJe7aFJOvUHKSgSnlSgZrhemLAwskQUjfOyCNQDpw=; b=U0iCWagZWf033qYa1FDoqjmN22HTrGxIeW33+C6tfhf1ChqGoApHNmBlc+0DNb1J6RwEtM CXUBQo55iuPKSESQ1KpfAVTU634lfz/yqHWsLfM5IK52alGANONxkTsJARCzyjmvwfwhfs 98SWAukN50hpFaa7AFRuxCyTCgNhB5pZ+yWb9nNJzSOlFKL+SnNgjBKDR7jw5ZhXQg3go8 b50G0fDDhhxYIS3duaslUKhUvm28OmpaE1OqW+SKnqF0Z0/FCFceiMvmf6f6C/ctWFuGmj fUqaRXHHFOoo5GJCHP8nv6uoWz9QKN9DEV2HB8PlalisCUtgwmo39are0zRbiQ== ARC-Seal: i=1; s=key1; d=yhetil.org; t=1619590515; a=rsa-sha256; cv=none; b=d+L1Q7YomXjrS3Lrqf3axK3sxk278FJqbugI29XP89QLz9TSfnSVJb37cDLnahKcrsN01M n8Drg0yAA69BzG6IgEUXgMVtpuaStzpCks1TxUbwmTtdbvSrD6u5sX+xxWuOpCtndXFxCI K6/z5d7EJW477TM++Zb+207BRXiSz7vfLAxdmK4cAIA9gGZyhkYh8BoQx6m0mtY2Bf3llE NTzRhy9fQqnxoEZiBjFCvCtPW+GjzgBtDWuoQvrtHWo9XeYP7HPsKv96b4Tab3PnUNOClr RizAHvvwmRwiq4nfw6dsTA5AseEVv6H89WbJHHb9+4qrWULF14QU2YhuSDUoYg== ARC-Authentication-Results: i=1; aspmx1.migadu.com; dkim=pass header.d=gmail.com header.s=20161025 header.b=KkOLrW2K; dmarc=pass (policy=none) header.from=gmail.com; spf=pass (aspmx1.migadu.com: domain of emacs-orgmode-bounces@gnu.org designates 209.51.188.17 as permitted sender) smtp.mailfrom=emacs-orgmode-bounces@gnu.org X-Migadu-Spam-Score: -3.15 Authentication-Results: aspmx1.migadu.com; dkim=pass header.d=gmail.com header.s=20161025 header.b=KkOLrW2K; dmarc=pass (policy=none) header.from=gmail.com; spf=pass (aspmx1.migadu.com: domain of emacs-orgmode-bounces@gnu.org designates 209.51.188.17 as permitted sender) smtp.mailfrom=emacs-orgmode-bounces@gnu.org X-Migadu-Queue-Id: 798BA1C095 X-Spam-Score: -3.15 X-Migadu-Scanner: scn0.migadu.com X-TUID: RCETcq342cnR Bastien writes: > Timothy writes: > >> Great to hear! I think this would probably be developed as a branch like >> wip-cite-new > > Yes. > >> , and it would need transient to be installed (via ELPA?) on >> Emacs <28, but I think it has the potential to both: >> - Improve the user experience, and >> - Remove Org's own home-cooked transient-ish interfaces, >> so leave us with less code to watch over > > Yes, exactly. Also there is plan to include Transient in Emacs core, > so this makes this move even more appealing: > > https://lists.gnu.org/archive/html/emacs-devel/2021-04/msg00944.html I would also suggest that if we were going to have a 'help' key, rather than describe mode, it might be better to link to the info manual (you could just link to the agenda section of the manual). I've rarely found describe mode to be terribly useful (there are exceptions). However, I have used modes which have bound a help key to a section in the info manual and I've found that much more useful. The depth of information is usually better (what people looking for help probably want) and once your in the info pages, moving to cross references and other possibly relevant sections is very easy. I also think adding transient mode would be beneficial in a number of areas of org. In addition to reducing code maintenance, it would increase consistency with other Emacs modes etc. -- Tim Cross