(gnus-icalendar-org-setup) not evaluated in .emacs?

(gnus-icalendar-org-setup) not evaluated in .emacs?

[Loris Bennett]

Hi,

I have the following in my .emacs:

  (require 'gnus-icalendar)
  (gnus-icalendar-setup)
  (gnus-icalendar-org-setup)

When I get an invitation to a meeting, Gnus displays the email with the
following buttons:

  [ Accept ]    [ Tentative ]    [ Decline ]    

However, if leave the email, re-evaluate the line

  (gnus-icalendar-org-setup)

in my .emacs and then revisit the email invitation, I get the following
buttons

  [ Accept ]    [ Tentative ]    [ Decline ]    

  [ Show Agenda ]    [ Export to Org ]

Obviously I would like Gnus to display all the buttons first time
around.  Does anyone have any idea what might be going on?

I'm using the following:

- Gnus v5.13
- GNU Emacs 25.1.1 (x86_64-pc-linux-gnu, GTK+ Version 3.22.12) of
  2017-04-23, modified by Debian
- Org mode version 9.1 (9.1-20-ga4f139-elpaplus @
  /home/loris/.emacs.d/elpa/org-plus-contrib-20170911/)

As I'm not sure this is an Org or a Gnus thing, I'm cross-posting.

Cheers,

Loris
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Re: (gnus-icalendar-org-setup) not evaluated in .emacs?

[Eric S Fraga]

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On Thursday, 14 Sep 2017 at 09:56, Loris Bennett wrote:
> Hi,
>
> I have the following in my .emacs:
>
>   (require 'gnus-icalendar)
>   (gnus-icalendar-setup)
>   (gnus-icalendar-org-setup)

I have one setting alongside these:

    (setq gnus-icalendar-org-capture-file "...path to my diary.org")

I wonder whether gnus needs this to be defined for it to show all the
buttons?  Maybe check the value of this before and after?

I always see all the buttons (I think).

-- 
: Eric S Fraga via Emacs 26.0.50, Org release_9.1-57-gc6e563

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Re: (gnus-icalendar-org-setup) not evaluated in .emacs?

[Loris Bennett]

Eric S Fraga <esflists@gmail.com> writes:

> On Thursday, 14 Sep 2017 at 09:56, Loris Bennett wrote:
>> Hi,
>>
>> I have the following in my .emacs:
>>
>>   (require 'gnus-icalendar)
>>   (gnus-icalendar-setup)
>>   (gnus-icalendar-org-setup)
>
> I have one setting alongside these:
>
>     (setq gnus-icalendar-org-capture-file "...path to my diary.org")
>
> I wonder whether gnus needs this to be defined for it to show all the
> buttons?  Maybe check the value of this before and after?

I also have the following:

 '(gnus-icalendar-org-capture-file "~/git/org.git/gtd.org")
 '(gnus-icalendar-org-capture-headline (quote ("Exchange")))

(but this was in the buried in the 'Customize' bit of my .emacs, so I
forgot about it).

> I always see all the buttons (I think).

It obviously does work, in principle, for me too, as the re-eval shows.
However, it seems as if something later in my .emacs undoes some aspect
of whatever it is that the gnus-icalendar-org-setup does.

Cheers,

Loris

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Re: (gnus-icalendar-org-setup) not evaluated in .emacs?

[Eric S Fraga]

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On Thursday, 14 Sep 2017 at 11:11, Loris Bennett wrote:

[...]

> It obviously does work, in principle, for me too, as the re-eval shows.
> However, it seems as if something later in my .emacs undoes some aspect
> of whatever it is that the gnus-icalendar-org-setup does.

Well, may be time to bisect etc...?
-- 
: Eric S Fraga via Emacs 26.0.50, Org release_9.1-57-gc6e563

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Re: (gnus-icalendar-org-setup) not evaluated in .emacs?

[Loris Bennett]

Eric S Fraga <esflists@gmail.com> writes:

> On Thursday, 14 Sep 2017 at 11:11, Loris Bennett wrote:
>
> [...]
>
>> It obviously does work, in principle, for me too, as the re-eval shows.
>> However, it seems as if something later in my .emacs undoes some aspect
>> of whatever it is that the gnus-icalendar-org-setup does.
>
> Well, may be time to bisect etc...?

Yes, you're probably right.  However, the problem is not very serious
(thankfully I don't get invited to many meetings) and my .emacs with its
big Customize block doesn't really lend itself to bisection.  So for the
moment I might just chicken out and set up a keybinding for
gnus-icalendar-org-setup.

Cheers,

Loris

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Re: (gnus-icalendar-org-setup) not evaluated in .emacs?

[Loris Bennett]

Eric S Fraga <esflists@gmail.com> writes:

> On Thursday, 14 Sep 2017 at 09:56, Loris Bennett wrote:
>> Hi,
>>
>> I have the following in my .emacs:
>>
>>   (require 'gnus-icalendar)
>>   (gnus-icalendar-setup)
>>   (gnus-icalendar-org-setup)
>
> I have one setting alongside these:
>
>     (setq gnus-icalendar-org-capture-file "...path to my diary.org")
>
> I wonder whether gnus needs this to be defined for it to show all the
> buttons?  Maybe check the value of this before and after?
>
> I always see all the buttons (I think).

Rereading this, I decided to move the settings out from the Customize
block to before call to gnus-icalendar-org-setup:

(require 'gnus-icalendar)
(setq gnus-icalendar-org-capture-file "~/git/org.git/gtd.org")
(setq gnus-icalendar-org-capture-headline (quote ("Exchange")))
(gnus-icalendar-setup)
(gnus-icalendar-org-setup)

Now I get all the buttons first time round and didn't have to resort to
a flaky hack, so thanks, Eric.

But should this kind of ordering dependency happen?  Or should my
Customize block just be at the beginning of my .emacs rather than at the
end?

Cheers,

Loris

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Re: (gnus-icalendar-org-setup) not evaluated in .emacs?

[Matt Lundin]

"Loris Bennett" <loris.bennett@fu-berlin.de> writes:
>
> Rereading this, I decided to move the settings out from the Customize
> block to before call to gnus-icalendar-org-setup:
>
> (require 'gnus-icalendar)
> (setq gnus-icalendar-org-capture-file "~/git/org.git/gtd.org")
> (setq gnus-icalendar-org-capture-headline (quote ("Exchange")))
> (gnus-icalendar-setup)
> (gnus-icalendar-org-setup)
>
> Now I get all the buttons first time round and didn't have to resort to
> a flaky hack, so thanks, Eric.
>
> But should this kind of ordering dependency happen?  Or should my
> Customize block just be at the beginning of my .emacs rather than at the
> end?

I looked at the gnus-icalendar-code and this ordering dependency is
indeed hard-coded into gnus-icalendar-org-setup. From the code comments:

--8<---------------cut here---------------start------------->8---
;; to enable optional iCalendar->Org sync functionality
;; NOTE: both the capture file and the headline(s) inside must already exist
;; (setq gnus-icalendar-org-capture-file "~/org/notes.org")
;; (setq gnus-icalendar-org-capture-headline '("Calendar"))
;; (gnus-icalendar-org-setup)
--8<---------------cut here---------------end--------------->8---

Matt

Re: (gnus-icalendar-org-setup) not evaluated in .emacs?

[Eric S Fraga]

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On Thursday, 14 Sep 2017 at 16:02, Loris Bennett wrote:
> But should this kind of ordering dependency happen?  Or should my
> Customize block just be at the beginning of my .emacs rather than at the
> end?

I make sure my customizations are loaded before anything else.  I have
my customizations in a separate file and "(load custom-file)" as one of
the first things in my Emacs init.  Not the first as such as I set the
load-path to point to the versions of packages I am using that may
conflict with built-in ones in Emacs.

-- 
: Eric S Fraga via Emacs 26.0.50, Org release_9.0.10-729-gb792e2

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Re: (gnus-icalendar-org-setup) not evaluated in .emacs?

[Loris Bennett]

Eric S Fraga <esflists@gmail.com> writes:

> On Thursday, 14 Sep 2017 at 16:02, Loris Bennett wrote:
>> But should this kind of ordering dependency happen?  Or should my
>> Customize block just be at the beginning of my .emacs rather than at the
>> end?
>
> I make sure my customizations are loaded before anything else.  I have
> my customizations in a separate file and "(load custom-file)" as one of
> the first things in my Emacs init.  Not the first as such as I set the
> load-path to point to the versions of packages I am using that may
> conflict with built-in ones in Emacs.

For someone like me, who fails to spot the related variables even
within a single file, I think hiving customisation off into a separate
file might set up a few new tripwires for future me.

Having said that, having let my .emacs grow organically (think "rampant
weeds") for 30 years, maybe I should take the shears to it.  I'm just
worried that, if I started today, I might not be productive again until
the New Year :-(

Cheers,

Loris

-- 
Dr. Loris Bennett (Mr.)
ZEDAT, Freie Universität Berlin         Email loris.bennett@fu-berlin.de

Re: (gnus-icalendar-org-setup) not evaluated in .emacs?

[Tim Cross]

Management of an emacs init file is a challenge for anyone who has been
using Emacs for a long time. I did this after being a user for over 20
years and like you, was a little daunted by the task. However, I now
realise it was the single best thing I ever did to improve my emacs. I
also had let my config grow organically and what I found out when I
decided to clean it up was that a lot of what I had in there was
unnecessary, was slowing down my Emacs (both startup and runtime) and
that many of my long-term emacs 'annoyances' were actually due to
incorrect or outdated settings in my init file.

A few things I learned which may be of help

1. Put your init in git (or your favourite source control system ) and
do your changes incrementally. You will need to revert to previous
versions, so be methodical with checking in changes and do it
incrementally.

2. Have a look at the use-package macro. This really cleaned up my init
file, helped me make it more modular and really improved both the
structure and maintenance as well as startup times etc.

3. I now use org to manage my init file. In fact, I have a few init
files. I have a bare bones minimal init file which I use when I need to
debug a specific feature/package or generate bug reports, I have an
experimental one where I play with new things and I have my stable
one. Using org, I can just 'tangle' a new init based on one of those
files whenever I need it. I started by just putting all my existing
setup into a block in an org file and exporting that as elisp. As time
permitted, I broke bits off into their own blocks with explanatory
comments/text so that I can remember why/what of the block.

4. Finally, there are some really good 'canned' configurations out
there. I personally quite like purcell's setup (on github). While I
don't use any of these per se, I did 'borrow' some of the ideas.

My setup is now healthier and more stable than it ever has been. The
effort is definitely worth it.

Tim

Loris Bennett writes:

> Eric S Fraga <esflists@gmail.com> writes:
>
>> On Thursday, 14 Sep 2017 at 16:02, Loris Bennett wrote:
>>> But should this kind of ordering dependency happen?  Or should my
>>> Customize block just be at the beginning of my .emacs rather than at the
>>> end?
>>
>> I make sure my customizations are loaded before anything else.  I have
>> my customizations in a separate file and "(load custom-file)" as one of
>> the first things in my Emacs init.  Not the first as such as I set the
>> load-path to point to the versions of packages I am using that may
>> conflict with built-in ones in Emacs.
>
> For someone like me, who fails to spot the related variables even
> within a single file, I think hiving customisation off into a separate
> file might set up a few new tripwires for future me.
>
> Having said that, having let my .emacs grow organically (think "rampant
> weeds") for 30 years, maybe I should take the shears to it.  I'm just
> worried that, if I started today, I might not be productive again until
> the New Year :-(
>
> Cheers,
>
> Loris


-- 
Tim Cross

Re: (gnus-icalendar-org-setup) not evaluated in .emacs?

[Loris Bennett]

Hi Tim,

Tim Cross <theophilusx@gmail.com> writes:

> Management of an emacs init file is a challenge for anyone who has been
> using Emacs for a long time. I did this after being a user for over 20
> years and like you, was a little daunted by the task. However, I now
> realise it was the single best thing I ever did to improve my emacs. I
> also had let my config grow organically and what I found out when I
> decided to clean it up was that a lot of what I had in there was
> unnecessary, was slowing down my Emacs (both startup and runtime) and
> that many of my long-term emacs 'annoyances' were actually due to
> incorrect or outdated settings in my init file.
>
> A few things I learned which may be of help
>
> 1. Put your init in git (or your favourite source control system ) and
> do your changes incrementally. You will need to revert to previous
> versions, so be methodical with checking in changes and do it
> incrementally.
>
> 2. Have a look at the use-package macro. This really cleaned up my init
> file, helped me make it more modular and really improved both the
> structure and maintenance as well as startup times etc.
>
> 3. I now use org to manage my init file. In fact, I have a few init
> files. I have a bare bones minimal init file which I use when I need to
> debug a specific feature/package or generate bug reports, I have an
> experimental one where I play with new things and I have my stable
> one. Using org, I can just 'tangle' a new init based on one of those
> files whenever I need it. I started by just putting all my existing
> setup into a block in an org file and exporting that as elisp. As time
> permitted, I broke bits off into their own blocks with explanatory
> comments/text so that I can remember why/what of the block.
>
> 4. Finally, there are some really good 'canned' configurations out
> there. I personally quite like purcell's setup (on github). While I
> don't use any of these per se, I did 'borrow' some of the ideas.
>
> My setup is now healthier and more stable than it ever has been. The
> effort is definitely worth it.
>
> Tim

[snip (28 lines)]

OK, you've convinced me - I'm sure you are right about potential
incorrect and outdated stuff.  I already have my .emacs in Git, so
that's a start and  I'll definitely have a look at 'use-package'.  I
might even go wild and move to init.el ;-)

Cheers,

Loris

--
Dr. Loris Bennett (Mr.)
ZEDAT, Freie Universität Berlin         Email loris.bennett@fu-berlin.de

Re: (gnus-icalendar-org-setup) not evaluated in .emacs?

[Nick Dokos]

"Loris Bennett" <loris.bennett@fu-berlin.de> writes:

> I might even go wild and move to init.el ;-)
>

I moved to init.el a long time ago and now things are worse than they
ever were with .emacs: there is all the .emacs crud that I copied over
*plus* all the new init.el crud that I've added since I switched.
I can't wait for bigger-better-init.el to be the new fad, so I can
rename^H^H^H^H^H^Hclean up init.el...

-- 
Nick

Re: (gnus-icalendar-org-setup) not evaluated in .emacs?

[Lars-Johan Liman]

Loris Bennett writes:
>> Having said that, having let my .emacs grow organically (think "rampant
>> weeds") for 30 years, maybe I should take the shears to it.

:-) :-) Hahaa! LOL! I was thinking exactly those words earlier this
morning, while trying to debug a complicated "cond" statement that tries
to figure out on which computer the Emacs is being starting, and which
windowing system is being used on it.

But I've stopped trying to maintain my PS:<LIMAN>EMACS.INIT. (Is anyone
else that old? :-) My TECO is getting rusty ... ;-)

theophilusx@gmail.com:
> Management of an emacs init file is a challenge for anyone who has been
> using Emacs for a long time.

I have some files in CVS (yes, I'm that old ;-), but yes, Git is on my
mind too. Every new thing I archive I put in Git.

But, this looked interesting ...

> 3. I now use org to manage my init file. In fact, I have a few init
> files. I have a bare bones minimal init file which I use when I need to
> debug a specific feature/package or generate bug reports, I have an
> experimental one where I play with new things and I have my stable
> one. Using org, I can just 'tangle' a new init based on one of those
> files whenever I need it. I started by just putting all my existing
> setup into a block in an org file and exporting that as elisp. As time
> permitted, I broke bits off into their own blocks with explanatory
> comments/text so that I can remember why/what of the block.

Can you expand on how using Org for this is done? Examples?
Documentation?

				Cheers,
				  /Liman
#-------------------------------------------------------------------------
# Lars-Johan Liman, M.Sc.		 ! E-mail: liman@cafax.se
# Cafax AB				 ! HTTP  : //www.cafax.se/
# Computer Consultants, Sweden		 ! Voice : +46 8 - 564 702 30
#-------------------------------------------------------------------------

Re: (gnus-icalendar-org-setup) not evaluated in .emacs?

[Eric S Fraga]

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On Wednesday, 20 Sep 2017 at 15:49, Lars-Johan Liman wrote:

[...]

> I have some files in CVS (yes, I'm that old ;-), but yes, Git is on my
> mind too. Every new thing I archive I put in Git.

Hey, I still use RCS... :-)

But, okay, I do use git and mercurial as well.  Have to go with the flow
sometimes.

And parts of my .emacs date back to the mid-80s.  Probably due a clean up
sometime soon but why tinker with something that works...

-- 
: Eric S Fraga via Emacs 26.0.50, Org release_9.0.9-573-g09e612

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Re: (gnus-icalendar-org-setup) not evaluated in .emacs?

[Thomas S. Dye]

Aloha,

Lars-Johan Liman writes:

>> 3. I now use org to manage my init file. In fact, I have a few init
>> files. I have a bare bones minimal init file which I use when I need to
>> debug a specific feature/package or generate bug reports, I have an
>> experimental one where I play with new things and I have my stable
>> one. Using org, I can just 'tangle' a new init based on one of those
>> files whenever I need it. I started by just putting all my existing
>> setup into a block in an org file and exporting that as elisp. As time
>> permitted, I broke bits off into their own blocks with explanatory
>> comments/text so that I can remember why/what of the block.
>
> Can you expand on how using Org for this is done? Examples?
> Documentation?
>
> 				Cheers,
> 				  /Liman
> #-------------------------------------------------------------------------
> # Lars-Johan Liman, M.Sc.		 ! E-mail: liman@cafax.se
> # Cafax AB				 ! HTTP  : //www.cafax.se/
> # Computer Consultants, Sweden		 ! Voice : +46 8 - 564 702 30
> #-------------------------------------------------------------------------

An example from a few years ago is here:
https://github.com/eschulte/emacs24-starter-kit

hth,
Tom

--
Thomas S. Dye
http://www.tsdye.com