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Fri, 01 Sep 2023 05:17:45 -0400 Received: from submission (posteo.de [185.67.36.169]) by mout02.posteo.de (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 9B985240104 for ; Fri, 1 Sep 2023 11:17:40 +0200 (CEST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/simple; d=posteo.net; s=2017; t=1693559860; bh=9INz6BZrREFLLfAvMnPZjdvgSDNzUjtwI4ZCO3jEHTQ=; h=From:To:Cc:Subject:Date:Message-ID:MIME-Version: Content-Transfer-Encoding:From; b=R+pEOpcJUgINNf8V6dvb1RMY2CHuWtm7ExF7sCpgPH6/OkLK1nDxYquwopXkxkjge g8BA3IvD7L5kCvYe9iXANoONonB2hwAfMPtqffy8/Jlw4CEq1U8uGadApbYJWBvx7G 0iddNCgnZ8nL6aDx2sowtwR7CCjERXhcZSKAhiQuBx8rJNej4CRZaOLfq9EOLJyfKH GWV1DoqIULXYjhtyveIatmJMCVF2GAgCM24myX184Wx117IjPiYvc9b0nFuBVuVA+S 4ViJSv1wbVq8guWFWkPlkoWjPxeCtkjM46aeT/r+EnLN4M1nUkYMVoL/Wqkyd0EjZU w05Bejq8IRGqw== Received: from customer (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by submission (posteo.de) with ESMTPSA id 4RcXVq5SZsz9rxY; Fri, 1 Sep 2023 11:17:39 +0200 (CEST) From: Ihor Radchenko To: Juan Manuel =?utf-8?Q?Mac=C3=ADas?= Cc: Timothy , orgmode Subject: Re: Fallback fonts in LaTeX export for non latin scripts In-Reply-To: <877cpb8mkd.fsf@posteo.net> References: <878r9t7x7y.fsf@posteo.net> <87wmxbvd60.fsf@localhost> <877cpb8mkd.fsf@posteo.net> Date: Fri, 01 Sep 2023 09:18:18 +0000 Message-ID: <877cpatfol.fsf@localhost> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Received-SPF: pass client-ip=185.67.36.66; envelope-from=yantar92@posteo.net; helo=mout02.posteo.de X-Spam_score_int: -43 X-Spam_score: -4.4 X-Spam_bar: ---- X-Spam_report: (-4.4 / 5.0 requ) BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_EF=-0.1, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-2.3, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_H5=0.001, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_WL=0.001, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001 autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no X-Spam_action: no action X-BeenThere: emacs-orgmode@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: "General discussions about Org-mode." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: emacs-orgmode-bounces+larch=yhetil.org@gnu.org Sender: emacs-orgmode-bounces+larch=yhetil.org@gnu.org X-Migadu-Country: US X-Migadu-Flow: FLOW_IN X-Spam-Score: -9.43 X-Migadu-Queue-Id: E7D0237641 X-Migadu-Scanner: mx0.migadu.com X-Migadu-Spam-Score: -9.43 X-TUID: I9oTNc001pjN Juan Manuel Mac=C3=ADas writes: > ...In any > case, the fonts issue is the most delicate part. What default fonts to > add to the list? Here the user's taste or preferences would influence. Commonly available libre fonts look like a good candidate. > It must also be taken into account that if one has typographical > scruples, not all fonts match each other. For design purposes, I mean. > The Computer Modern, which is a modern style font (similar to the Didot > or Bodoni), does not usually pair well with (for example) a Garamond, > which is in the Renaissance style. That's why I think the best solution > would be to offer a basic defcustom, based on the purely utilitarian, > and let the user modify or extend it according to their taste, > preferences or convenience. +1. > Another thing to keep in mind is the following. Offering basic > readability based on the unicode scripts means that we rely on scripts > and not languages. For example, the Cyrillic script covers several > languages, as you well know: Russian, Bulgarian, etc. The Latin script > is used for languages as diverse as English or Vietnamese. The choice of > font based on the script is a low-level LuaTeX functionality, that is, > it does not add features specific to each language, such as hyphenation > patterns. This means that long texts in (for example) Cyrillic or Greek > are not justified well because LaTeX does not know how hyphenate them: > ... > There is another possibility that I am working on in parallel: relying > on languages instead of scripts. This would add both readability and > support for each particular language. There could be two options for the > user: a basic one (the low level one, based on scripts: ensures > readability but the document may not look pretty) and an advanced one, > based on language support. Something like this occurred to me: > > #+LaTeX_Header: % !enable-fonts-for ancientgreek russian:Old Standard > arabic We already have #+language keyword and `org-latex-guess-babel-language'/`org-latex-guess-polyglossia-language'. May as well have default fonts for a given language. As for multiple languages, do we actually support this? >> What will happen if LuaTeX is not installed on the system? > > Yes, there should be some kind of warning. Also it's not just LuaTeX, > but certain packages for fonts and multilingual support. The problem is > that the different versions of TeX live cooked in the distros=20 > usually name these packages differently. This is another added problem... > Arch or Gentoo offer a more vanilla TeX live. We might use `org-latex-known-warnings'. >> Also, just to double check, is LuaTeX fully compatible to LaTeX? That >> is, if we have an existing org file using LaTeX-specific commands and >> packages, will it work with LuaTeX? > > Yes, it is fully compatible, except that LuaLaTeX does not need to load > the fontenc or inputenc packages. LuaTeX is intended to be the natural > replacement for pdfTeX. The latest edition of The LaTeX Companion is > already very focused on LuaTeX. And 90% of the new LaTeX packages that > are uploaded to CTAN only work in LuaLaTeX. One of the essential > advantages of LuaTeX is that TeX now (finally!) has a simple scripting > language. With a little Lua you can achieve very low level things in TeX > that were horribly complicated in 'pure TeX'. Then, we might even consider LuaTeX as the new default for `org-latex-compiler'. --=20 Ihor Radchenko // yantar92, Org mode contributor, Learn more about Org mode at . Support Org development at , or support my work at