From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 From: Carsten Dominik Subject: Re: Outline cycling does not preserve point's position Date: Tue, 10 Sep 2013 08:03:32 +0200 Message-ID: <5855E8E1-9730-4A29-89FF-E35C64E54EDD@gmail.com> References: <868uz8sufg.fsf@somewhere.org> <86vc2cqvnb.fsf@somewhere.org> <86y57676t1.fsf@somewhere.org> <89E7FDB6-0F5A-4362-959C-C4B9844A235C@gmail.com> <86txhu7696.fsf@somewhere.org> <0A62C6DE-B3AD-458A-9AB4-92B61A6D3D63@gmail.com> <86ppsi75st.fsf@somewhere.org> <87eh8yo0el.fsf@bzg.ath.cx> <87li365ixg.fsf@gmail.com> <87d2oi57fg.fsf@gmail.com> <7CB7B681-DD2E-446C-AE45-DDCA204EE95C@gmail.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 (Mac OS X Mail 6.5 \(1508\)) Content-Type: multipart/signed; boundary="Apple-Mail=_F5D7C2DB-518A-430C-A385-9611677C7C60"; protocol="application/pgp-signature"; micalg=pgp-sha1 Return-path: Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:4830:134:3::10]:45774) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1VJH3T-0007wz-6I for emacs-orgmode@gnu.org; Tue, 10 Sep 2013 02:04:11 -0400 Received: from Debian-exim by eggs.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1VJH3J-0007X0-4U for emacs-orgmode@gnu.org; Tue, 10 Sep 2013 02:04:03 -0400 Received: from plane.gmane.org ([80.91.229.3]:47001) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1VJH3I-0007Ws-PZ for emacs-orgmode@gnu.org; Tue, 10 Sep 2013 02:03:53 -0400 Received: from public by plane.gmane.org with local (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1VJH3H-0008Jj-GJ for emacs-orgmode@gnu.org; Tue, 10 Sep 2013 08:03:51 +0200 In-Reply-To: <7CB7B681-DD2E-446C-AE45-DDCA204EE95C@gmail.com> List-Id: "General discussions about Org-mode." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: emacs-orgmode-bounces+geo-emacs-orgmode=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Sender: emacs-orgmode-bounces+geo-emacs-orgmode=m.gmane.org@gnu.org To: Nicolas Goaziou Cc: Bastien , public-emacs-orgmode-mXXj517/zsQ@plane.gmane.org, Sebastien Vauban --Apple-Mail=_F5D7C2DB-518A-430C-A385-9611677C7C60 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii On 10.9.2013, at 05:47, Carsten Dominik = wrote: >=20 > On 9.9.2013, at 17:41, Nicolas Goaziou wrote: >=20 >> Carsten Dominik writes: >>=20 >>> It is extremely predictable if you know about the structure of an = Org >>> document and if you think in elements. >>=20 >> It's a Sexp motion. >>=20 >>> It is unexpected for a user who is used to C-arrow doing paragraph >>> motion. In Org, org-backward-element climbs out if a hierarchy. This >>> is not what happens in other modes with this command. That is what >>> I mean with unexpected. >>=20 >> OK. Do you want it to return an error if there's no element at the = same >> level above (or below for the forward counterpart)? >=20 > No, I guess not. Lets just leave it the way it is, but implement > alternative behavior in source code blocks. I agree with the = arguments you make below. One more thought: What if the paragraph motion commands did use = elements, but ignored the hierarchy. So they jump to the next headline, paragraph, = table, src block, item? I think this would feel similar to what paragraph motion does in text = mode. - Carsten >=20 > Thank you. >=20 > - Carsten >=20 >>=20 >>> Don't get me wrong. I love the element motion stuff. But I am >>> satisfied for it to be available on M-{ and M-}. >>>=20 >>> I like your proposal to introduce a variable for special src = behavior. >>> I personally would also like a variable that allows me to keep the >>> paragraph commands on C-arrow (because I have almost equally >>> convenient bindings with M-{}) - but maybe that is just me? >>=20 >> But `org-forward-element'/`org-backward-element' are the paragraph >> commands for Org. Unlike to Text mode, contents in Org have a depth. = So >> it's not just about stopping at blank lines. Even stopping at blank >> lines is not satisfying: >>=20 >> XParagraph >> | a | table | >>=20 >> Another paragraph >>=20 >> A decent forward paragraph command should stop at the table here. On = the >> other hand, it doesn't make much sense to stop at the blank line = below: >>=20 >> X#+begin_src emacs-lisp >> ;; line 1 >>=20 >> ;; line 2 >> #+end_src >> Another paragraph >>=20 >> When depth isn't involved, I think that `org-forward-element' is as = good >> as it can get as a paragraph motion command, and far better than >> `forward-paragraph' from "paragraphs.el". >>=20 >>=20 >> Regards, >>=20 >> --=20 >> Nicolas Goaziou >=20 --Apple-Mail=_F5D7C2DB-518A-430C-A385-9611677C7C60 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: attachment; filename=signature.asc Content-Type: application/pgp-signature; name=signature.asc Content-Description: Message signed with OpenPGP using GPGMail -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- iEYEARECAAYFAlIutjQACgkQ9hweYzZiJkwp8ACfcKiRD2FxMxS6QI+WtIGZlALm uVoAn0A2FUCiITylfHcfgMraz+u6LcM2 =6lHz -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- --Apple-Mail=_F5D7C2DB-518A-430C-A385-9611677C7C60--