Re: Org-mode versus Taskpaper - now for real

[Rainer Stengele <rainer.stengele@diplan.de>]

Dear Carsten,

I was terribly shocked for about 18 seconds - my brain storming through thoughts about protesting and forking the project and what else...
But as I am too convinced of the useful features of Org it became clear in a moment

Next year same day will be a very interesting date to look again over a year of Org news.

Keep up the good work!

Rainer


Carsten Dominik schrieb:
> 
> Dear all,
> 
> I hope that you will all forgive me my little joke.  It worked so
> well because there is a certain amount of truth in the matter, of
> course, and I would like to address this in a more serious
> manner.
> 
> Org-mode has indeed become very feature-rich in the run of the
> years.  However, while adding features, more often than not
> triggered but lots of truly excellent suggestions on this forum,
> I have been using one principle as the overruling requirement for
> Org-mode: That the simple stuff should remain simple, that no
> part of the complexity is forced on the user.  If you think I
> have failed to live up to this, I definitely would like to know
> about it.
> 
> The important point I would like to make here is that for all
> intents and purposes, Org-mode *is* taskpaper!  It is a
> zero-setup, totally simple TODO manager that works with plain
> files, files that can be edited on pretty much any system out
> there, either as plain text in *any* editor, or using Emacs which
> runs everywhere.  To follow the taskpaper webpage, open a file
> tasks.org and type
> 
>     * Project 1
>     ** TODO task1
>     ** DONE task2
> 
>     * Project 2
>     ** TODO task 3
>     ** TODO task 5
> 
> You can add tags by hand, get lists for certain tags as sparse
> trees, it really is totally as simple as taskpaper in every way!
> 
> Of course, Org-mode allows you to do more, but I would hope in a
> non-imposing way!  It has lots of features under the hood that
> you can pull in when you are ready, when you find out that there
> is something more you'd like to do.
> 
> My ideal picture would be that newcomers indeed use Org-mode as a
> simple outliner and list manager.  And then, that they find
> themselves often in a situation where they think "Gee, I wish I
> could to this", they open the manual and, voila, yes, I can!
> 
> So the complexity of Org-mode is, as I see it, mostly a problem
> of perception rather than a real issue.  How can this be
> addressed?  As the author of the manual I see it as my task to
> document Org-mode compactly and as completely as possible.  So
> the full set of features will hit you when reading the manual.
> This is why I have asked, so often, for people to write more
> tutorials, describe a simple setup they use on the web, to
> re-enforce the notion that Org-mode really the most simple system
> out there.  Initially.
> 
> It seems to me that Merlin Mann in his review of Taskpaper has
> hit the nail on the head (he always does).  What is so great
> about taskpaper that it is (so far?) almost fiddle-proof.  It is
> a list, and there is no way to fiddle with it.  People who use
> fiddling with the TODO system as a way to procrastinate can
> clearly benefit from such a system.  I am for sure the biggest
> example of a person who uses fiddling in that way.  But: Hey, we
> use Emacs *because* it allows us to fiddle, to get things right,
> the way *we* want it.
> 
> The problem with a program like taskpaper is that you will
> eventually be hit by its limitations.  The day comes when you
> need to clock the working time on a task, when you wish you
> could record a link to that email that triggered the task, when
> you would like to put the task list on an internal webpage, and
> make it look pretty too.  And then you cannot, you need to get an
> external program to do the timing, you need to copy your list
> into a web editor to make it look nice, and you need to find that
> email back by hand.
> 
> What people miss when they are new to Org-mode is this:
> 
> Don't try to set up the "final" task managing system from the
> start.  Because you have no idea yet what your system should look
> like.  Don't set up many TODO states and logging initially,
> before you actually have a feeling for what you working flow is.
> Don't define a context tag "@computer" just because David Allen
> has one, even though you are sitting at a computer all the time
> anyway!  Start by creating and managing a small TODO list and
> then develop your own system as the needs arises.  I wrote
> Org-mode to enable this development process.
> 
> 
> Happy April fools day!
> 
> - Car
> 
> 
> _______________________________________________
> Emacs-orgmode mailing list
> Remember: use `Reply All' to send replies to the list.
> Emacs-orgmode@gnu.org
> http://lists.gnu.org/mailman/listinfo/emacs-orgmode
>