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[81.42.219.18]) by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id l10sm12993044wrs.11.2021.06.07.03.36.35 (version=TLS1_3 cipher=TLS_AES_128_GCM_SHA256 bits=128/128); Mon, 07 Jun 2021 03:36:35 -0700 (PDT) Subject: Re: Could a citation act as a link, or a link to be exported as a citation? To: indieterminacy@libre.brussels References: <209ee991-58ec-7378-0df3-a5b9f9208d8a@gmail.com> <5123ca766515124c7aed07135d548efe@libre.brussels> From: Ypo Message-ID: <4303dcb4-39d2-b738-489a-3c9ff02f3451@gmail.com> Date: Mon, 7 Jun 2021 12:37:11 +0200 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows NT 10.0; Win64; x64; rv:78.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/78.10.1 MIME-Version: 1.0 In-Reply-To: <5123ca766515124c7aed07135d548efe@libre.brussels> Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="------------55142DA613BBDDC6FC882A8D" Content-Language: en-GB Received-SPF: pass client-ip=2a00:1450:4864:20::332; envelope-from=ypuntot@gmail.com; helo=mail-wm1-x332.google.com X-Spam_score_int: -20 X-Spam_score: -2.1 X-Spam_bar: -- X-Spam_report: (-2.1 / 5.0 requ) BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_EF=-0.1, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, NICE_REPLY_A=-0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE=-0.0001, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001 autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no X-Spam_action: no action X-BeenThere: emacs-orgmode@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.23 Precedence: list List-Id: "General discussions about Org-mode." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Cc: emacs-orgmode@gnu.org Errors-To: emacs-orgmode-bounces+larch=yhetil.org@gnu.org Sender: "Emacs-orgmode" X-Migadu-Flow: FLOW_IN ARC-Message-Signature: i=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=yhetil.org; s=key1; t=1623062231; h=from:from:sender:sender:reply-to:subject:subject:date:date: message-id:message-id:to:to:cc:cc:mime-version:mime-version: content-type:content-type:in-reply-to:in-reply-to: references:references:list-id:list-help:list-unsubscribe: list-subscribe:list-post:dkim-signature; bh=KOMyVbXt/7sa9dW7sfr45D0czxM5QwGWbPUgW1gfq8U=; b=OoGYz5f7yBI7cSftGbeuLbHa/OktnxugHlY451qx8jjcp8IfwB4B0XuCqxTWWVQKBqp35D cd4arVpS1+Vu4eD9E2aBWSlNiweQ+gUt5/TCIWellomJTJi1u2QIFzxV1JzWxv1kcgtYVV ZJ1ugqbSIYFWOeRZdSf/Yofc6AW9zeYJVmwbb2Hnnbyxj1rbpz53WlewGYcwlkPLzeOUXF 1g+lFlAwwSQbToIDhPUI6Fl6KQduDmIaUku2FiWFIBpNlPFkHPt28JtxgnpkL6SXDiiBNx 0WHtPps3JMUHrxWDWZ7zY9IJX+8Vt8lfBPBE/L7eilsvXY+6PnmNwOEA8t8cnw== ARC-Seal: i=1; s=key1; d=yhetil.org; t=1623062231; a=rsa-sha256; cv=none; b=T7lB1M+XPHLJ3b2MzPqoWsSqd/G859CzjtrlWLIUtSaNbd/pz8RmAq9E7uHo2GwtXYn7JW PEPs/OALBoj8S0UdryE/vArR22FE6fKo0+9eVci391+UIR16fnsSQgNbcyPPurd84VNzeU ais2ROHgq3/4018IxZ9Ke9PqPI7ELA/jSHZfEG43j0L/ADEW+dYINOxWmD37113e9k4tzo cqXXAWgm8+G3TETkWz071G/nWjGoPmgrLeDQcbIZA/K3G2yQZfT8q1NXgvR7l6S8XQmwqw VqE7EWdAuQksT4SKdZA6WfQKZW5B/efTB5Dip2JcjYZRoAXNyUu8XluJiH8r1A== ARC-Authentication-Results: i=1; aspmx1.migadu.com; dkim=pass header.d=gmail.com header.s=20161025 header.b=qc6Y9DVg; dmarc=pass (policy=none) header.from=gmail.com; spf=pass (aspmx1.migadu.com: domain of emacs-orgmode-bounces@gnu.org designates 209.51.188.17 as permitted sender) smtp.mailfrom=emacs-orgmode-bounces@gnu.org X-Migadu-Spam-Score: -2.12 Authentication-Results: aspmx1.migadu.com; dkim=pass header.d=gmail.com header.s=20161025 header.b=qc6Y9DVg; dmarc=pass (policy=none) header.from=gmail.com; spf=pass (aspmx1.migadu.com: domain of emacs-orgmode-bounces@gnu.org designates 209.51.188.17 as permitted sender) smtp.mailfrom=emacs-orgmode-bounces@gnu.org X-Migadu-Queue-Id: 579401E796 X-Spam-Score: -2.12 X-Migadu-Scanner: scn0.migadu.com X-TUID: hpaKCZnzb+FU This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --------------55142DA613BBDDC6FC882A8D Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Thanks, Jonathan I don't know much about Hyperbole, but it looked kind of aside from orgmode. Not sure if I want to add that possible difficulty to orgmode parsers. BTW, in the William's example I added before, it could work org-ref, because there are not subtrees, just by citing to the reference in a .bib file. But this wouldn't work with subtrees, where each subtree is a chapter of the referenced book. *Reference:* ** > *** Suárez Falcón, J. C., Recio Saboya, P., San Luis Costas, M. C., y > Pozo Cabanillas, M. P. (2019). /Introducción al análisis de datos: > Aplicaciones en psicología y ciencias de la salud./ Sanz y Torres > > *** Suárez Falcón et al. (2019) "1 Conceptos básicos y Organización de > Datos - 1.3. Concepto y Funciones de la Estadística: Descripción e > Inferencia" > :PROPERTIES: > :ID:       20210607T122433.664964 > :END: > * > ** * * *Note:* > * Here you can see *duplicate linking* is needed: one for the Chapter > in the Reference file (above) and another one for citations to work to > the bibtex file, below. > :PROPERTIES: > :ID:       20210607T122524.032860 > :END: > :LINKS: > /*- [[id:20210607T122433.664964]]*//* > *//*- cite:SuarezFalcon.2019.IntroduccionAnalisisDatos*/ > :END: > *Bibtex entry:* ** > *@book{SuarezFalcon.2019.IntroduccionAnalisisDatos, >   title = {Introducción al análisis de datos: aplicaciones en > psicología y ciencias de la salud}, >   shorttitle = {Introducción al análisis de datos}, >   author = {Suárez Falcón, Juan Carlos and RECIO SABOYA, PATRICIA and > SAN LUIS COSTAS, MARÍA CONCEPCIÓN and POZO CABANILLAS, MARÍA DEL PILAR}, >   year = {2019}, >   publisher = {Sanz y Torres}, >   address = {Alcorcón}, >   annotation = {OCLC: 1140871590}, >   file = {Z\:\\SuarezFalcon.2019.IntroduccionAnalisisDatos.pdf}, >   isbn = {978-84-17765-42-2}, >   language = {Spanish} > }* * * Just a thought, maybe superficial and un-needed feature, just in case. Best regards El 07/06/2021 a las 10:30, indieterminacy@libre.brussels escribió: > Hi Bill, > > Perhaps its worth looking into Hyperbole? > > It has contexts and actions which could work when the cursor is on the > link reference. Given it operates well with Orgmode now and has > transitioned into globa minor mode some of its deficiencies have been > ironed out. > > > Jonathan > > > > June 7, 2021 9:03 AM, "Ypo" >> wrote: > > I've been reading you about cites. Conversation is above my head, > but just in case it could be helpful, I would like to address a > frequent problem in the workflow of taking notes, that advanced > users suffer too. > > When taking notes, it's usual to make some bibliographical > references in one file and some related notes in a different file. > I link both using internal links, but it can't be exported > directly as a bibliography, which would be cool indeed. > > Could a citation act as a link, or a link to be exported as a > citation? > > An example, could the link "[[id:20210607T083216.726761][...]]" be > substituted by a cite, that takes you to the reference? > > *Reference (from a .org file, as it is, but if it needed to had > /.bib structure/ to kind of "unify" internal links and cites, > would be fine too):* > > **** William Denton [wtd@pobox.com ]. (29 > Mar 2021 16:15:18 -0400 (EDT)). /About exporting [Respuesta en > emacs-orgmode]./ Lista de correo. > :PROPERTIES: > :ID: 20210607T083216.726761 > :END: > :LINKS: > - [[id:20210607T083216.765049][Memoir could be flexible,]] > :END: > https://lists.gnu.org/archive/html/emacs-orgmode/2021-03/msg00443.html > > To get better at it, I'd recommend reading the manual for the > Memoir class [1] > (the first few chapters that talk about page design, at least, > then refer to the > rest as needed) and Robert Bringhurst's THE ELEMENTS OF > TYPOGRAPHIC STYLE [2] > (which will give you ideas you can implement and right away your > documents will > look great). > > Bill > > [1] https://www.ctan.org/pkg/memoir > [2] > https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Elements_of_Typographic_Style > > > *Note (it could be a task, or a study note, or a note to write a > book in the future...):* > > **** Memoir could be flexible, take a look at it. > :PROPERTIES: > :ID: 20210607T083216.765049 > :END: > :LINKS: > - [[id:20210607T083216.726761][William Denton [wtd@pobox.com > ]. (29 Mar 2021 16:15:18 -0400 (EDT)). > /About exporting [Respuesta en emacs-orgmode]./ Lista de correo.]] > :END: > > > --------------55142DA613BBDDC6FC882A8D Content-Type: text/html; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit

Thanks, Jonathan

I don't know much about Hyperbole, but it looked kind of aside from orgmode. Not sure if I want to add that possible difficulty to orgmode parsers.

BTW, in the William's example I added before, it could work org-ref, because there are not subtrees, just by citing to the reference in a .bib file. But this wouldn't work with subtrees, where each subtree is a chapter of the referenced book.

Reference:

** Suárez Falcón, J. C., Recio Saboya, P., San Luis Costas, M. C., y Pozo Cabanillas, M. P. (2019). /Introducción al análisis de datos: Aplicaciones en psicología y ciencias de la salud./ Sanz y Torres

*** Suárez Falcón et al. (2019) "1 Conceptos básicos y Organización de Datos - 1.3. Concepto y Funciones de la Estadística: Descripción e Inferencia"
:PROPERTIES:
:ID:       20210607T122433.664964
:END:


Note:

* Here you can see duplicate linking is needed: one for the Chapter in the Reference file (above) and another one for citations to work to the bibtex file, below.
:PROPERTIES:
:ID:       20210607T122524.032860
:END:
:LINKS:
- [[id:20210607T122433.664964]]
- cite:SuarezFalcon.2019.IntroduccionAnalisisDatos
:END:

Bibtex entry:

@book{SuarezFalcon.2019.IntroduccionAnalisisDatos,
  title = {Introducción al análisis de datos: aplicaciones en psicología y ciencias de la salud},
  shorttitle = {Introducción al análisis de datos},
  author = {Suárez Falcón, Juan Carlos and RECIO SABOYA, PATRICIA and SAN LUIS COSTAS, MARÍA CONCEPCIÓN and POZO CABANILLAS, MARÍA DEL PILAR},
  year = {2019},
  publisher = {Sanz y Torres},
  address = {Alcorcón},
  annotation = {OCLC: 1140871590},
  file = {Z\:\\SuarezFalcon.2019.IntroduccionAnalisisDatos.pdf},
  isbn = {978-84-17765-42-2},
  language = {Spanish}
}

Just a thought, maybe superficial and un-needed feature, just in case.

Best regards


El 07/06/2021 a las 10:30, indieterminacy@libre.brussels escribió:
Hi Bill,

Perhaps its worth looking into Hyperbole?

It has contexts and actions which could work when the cursor is on the link reference. Given it operates well with Orgmode now and has transitioned into globa minor mode some of its deficiencies have been ironed out.


Jonathan



June 7, 2021 9:03 AM, "Ypo" <ypuntot@gmail.com> wrote:
I've been reading you about cites. Conversation is above my head, but just in case it could be helpful, I would like to address a frequent problem in the workflow of taking notes, that advanced users suffer too.

When taking notes, it's usual to make some bibliographical references in one file and some related notes in a different file. I link both using internal links, but it can't be exported directly as a bibliography, which would be cool indeed.

Could a citation act as a link, or a link to be exported as a citation?

An example, could the link "[[id:20210607T083216.726761][...]]" be substituted by a cite, that takes you to the reference?

Reference (from a .org file, as it is, but if it needed to had .bib structure to kind of "unify" internal links and cites, would be fine too):

**** William Denton [wtd@pobox.com]. (29 Mar 2021 16:15:18 -0400 (EDT)). /About exporting [Respuesta en emacs-orgmode]./ Lista de correo.
:PROPERTIES:
:ID: 20210607T083216.726761
:END:
:LINKS:
- [[id:20210607T083216.765049][Memoir could be flexible,]]
:END:
https://lists.gnu.org/archive/html/emacs-orgmode/2021-03/msg00443.html
To get better at it, I'd recommend reading the manual for the Memoir class [1]
(the first few chapters that talk about page design, at least, then refer to the
rest as needed) and Robert Bringhurst's THE ELEMENTS OF TYPOGRAPHIC STYLE [2]
(which will give you ideas you can implement and right away your documents will
look great).

Bill

[1] https://www.ctan.org/pkg/memoir
[2] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Elements_of_Typographic_Style

Note (it could be a task, or a study note, or a note to write a book in the future...):

**** Memoir could be flexible, take a look at it.
:PROPERTIES:
:ID: 20210607T083216.765049
:END:
:LINKS:
- [[id:20210607T083216.726761][William Denton [wtd@pobox.com]. (29 Mar 2021 16:15:18 -0400 (EDT)). /About exporting [Respuesta en emacs-orgmode]./ Lista de correo.]]
:END:



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