From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 From: Carsten Dominik Subject: Re: Re: keys and command name info Date: Mon, 9 Aug 2010 12:31:51 +0200 Message-ID: <3781A4D8-2A56-4755-A5B2-DEF018E13AA7@gmail.com> References: <4C5086C1.9060000@easy-emacs.de> <20100808222636.GF20223@shi.workgroup> <770A61DC-4063-4A72-95F2-21F4E7DE6E77@gmail.com> <87fwyom8iv.fsf@gmx.net> <20100809101957.GC14007@shi.workgroup> Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v936) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed; delsp=yes Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Return-path: Received: from [140.186.70.92] (port=51598 helo=eggs.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1OiPeL-0004Pa-Ra for emacs-orgmode@gnu.org; Mon, 09 Aug 2010 06:32:20 -0400 Received: from Debian-exim by eggs.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1OiPeE-0003CW-NU for emacs-orgmode@gnu.org; Mon, 09 Aug 2010 06:32:09 -0400 Received: from mail-ew0-f41.google.com ([209.85.215.41]:64831) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1OiPeE-0003CF-Fd for emacs-orgmode@gnu.org; Mon, 09 Aug 2010 06:32:02 -0400 Received: by ewy28 with SMTP id 28so3709721ewy.0 for ; Mon, 09 Aug 2010 03:32:01 -0700 (PDT) In-Reply-To: <20100809101957.GC14007@shi.workgroup> List-Id: "General discussions about Org-mode." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: emacs-orgmode-bounces+geo-emacs-orgmode=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Errors-To: emacs-orgmode-bounces+geo-emacs-orgmode=m.gmane.org@gnu.org To: Gregor Zattler Cc: emacs-orgmode On Aug 9, 2010, at 12:19 PM, Gregor Zattler wrote: > Hi Andreas, org-mode developers, > * Andreas Burtzlaff [09. Aug. 2010]: >> Carsten Dominik writes: >>> I have put a version of the manual as modified by Andreas here: >>> >>> http://orgmode.org/org-manual-with-command-names.pdf >>> >>> Not all the command names are in there, but quite a few are. >>> I'd like to hear from more people >>> >>> - if they would like to have the names there (i.e. if it would >>> help them finding a command) >>> - if the position (first thing in the command description) >>> is right, or if it would be better to have it >>> - last thing in the description >>> - or after the first sentence, this is how the GNUS manual >>> does it. >> >> Having the function names in the manual at all makes it look a bit >> overloaded and might lose us a couple of newbies, I think. =20 >> Personally, I >> would not have use for it. >> >> If the names are included in the manual I strongly object to them =20 >> being >> at the beginning of the first sentence. The fixed starting column =20 >> of the >> sentences becomes variable and that makes it hard to skim through for >> those who don't want to read the function names. > > +1 for the same reasons. > > This is especially true for paragraphs like those: > > C-c C-n (outline-next-visible-heading) Next heading. > C-c C-p (outline-previous-visible-heading) Previous heading. > C-c C-f (org-forward-same-level) Next heading same level. > C-c C-b (org-backward-same-level) Previous heading same level. > C-c C-u (outline-up-heading) Backward to higher level heading. > C-c C-j (org-goto) Jump to a different place without changing the =20 > current outline > visibility. Shows the document structure in a temporary =20 > buffer, where you can > use the following keys to find your destination: > > >> What about having them in the same line as the keybinding but =20 >> aligned to >> the right? >> >> `C-c [' org-agenda-file-to-=20= >> front >> Add current file to the list of agenda files. The file is =20 >> added to >> the front of the list. If it was already in the list, it is =20 >> moved >> to the front. With prefix arg, file is added/moved to the end. >> >> It would make the manual longer, but at least it looks clean. >> It is easy to neglect the function names if one wants, and just as =20= >> easy >> to skim through them. > > +1 for the same reasons. > But Andreas R=F6hlers original variant is IMHO even better: > >> | [ ... ] >> | `C-c [', org-agenda-file-to-front >> | Add current file to the list of agenda files. The file is =20 >> added to >> | the front of the list. If it was already in the list, it is =20= >> moved >> | to the front. With prefix Argument, file is added/moved to =20 >> the end. > > Here the command name serves as a kind of a heading, it's easy > to search these locations while at the same time it's easy to > skim over the pages and not bother with the command names. > > > > My preference: > > 1. as in Andreas R=F6hlers original ASCII rendering > 2. as in Andreas Burtzlaffs ASCII rendering > 3. not at all > 4. as in the test manual > > > > Just me 2=A2. Either way, org-mode is great. Gregor > > > P.S.: Some of the command names don't help that much: > > C-c C-c (org-ctrl-c-ctrl-c) If there is a checkbox (see Section 5.6 =20= > [Checkboxes], > page 46) in the item line, toggle the state of the checkbox. =20= > If not, this command > makes sure that all the items on this list level use the same =20= > bullet. Furthermore, > if this is an ordered list, make sure the numbering is OK. > C-c - (org-ctrl-c-minus) Cycle the entire list level through the =20 > different item- > ize/enumerate bullets (`-', `+', `*', `1.', `1)'). With a =20 > numeric prefix argument > N, select the Nth bullet from this list. If there is an =20 > active region when calling > this, all lines will be converted to list items. If the first =20= > line already was a list > item, any item markers will be removed from the list. =20 > Finally, even without an > active region, a normal line will be converted into a list =20 > item. > C-c * (org-ctrl-c-star) Turn a plain list item into a headline (so =20= > that it becomes > a subheading at its location). See Section 2.5 [Structure =20 > editing], page 7, for a > detailed explanation. For these cases the dispatcher command could be replaced with the =20 specific command that will be called by the dispatcher when in this context...... - Carsten > > But even this gives a clue in how it all works. > > _______________________________________________ > Emacs-orgmode mailing list > Please use `Reply All' to send replies to the list. > Emacs-orgmode@gnu.org > http://lists.gnu.org/mailman/listinfo/emacs-orgmode - Carsten