From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 From: Karl Voit Subject: Re: Allowing loose ordering in Org files Date: Wed, 11 Nov 2015 17:13:25 +0100 Message-ID: <2015-11-11T16-40-39@devnull.Karl-Voit.at> References: <871tc83p01.fsf@flynn.nichework.com> <84611j19hk.fsf@gmail.com> <5638C2A1.2090801@iancu.ch> <87h9l32gfc.fsf@nicolasgoaziou.fr> <87d1vq3mh4.fsf@nicolasgoaziou.fr> <874mh23iw0.fsf@nicolasgoaziou.fr> <878u6eu5wg.fsf@Rainer.invalid> <315DDEDC-1BD9-4680-A8C8-B36821EB931C@gmail.com> <874mh2u2w0.fsf@Rainer.invalid> <87ziytyl3z.fsf@free.fr> <877flqskci.fsf@gmail.com> <87vb99zlb0.fsf@Rainer.invalid> Reply-To: Karl Voit Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Return-path: Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:4830:134:3::10]:33071) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1ZwY1q-0001zm-Lp for emacs-orgmode@gnu.org; Wed, 11 Nov 2015 11:13:49 -0500 Received: from Debian-exim by eggs.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1ZwY1k-0000Nn-CU for emacs-orgmode@gnu.org; Wed, 11 Nov 2015 11:13:46 -0500 Received: from plane.gmane.org ([80.91.229.3]:42070) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1ZwY1k-0000Mu-5l for emacs-orgmode@gnu.org; Wed, 11 Nov 2015 11:13:40 -0500 Received: from list by plane.gmane.org with local (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1ZwY1g-0004n8-Je for emacs-orgmode@gnu.org; Wed, 11 Nov 2015 17:13:36 +0100 Received: from friends.grml.info ([136.243.234.19]) by main.gmane.org with esmtp (Gmexim 0.1 (Debian)) id 1AlnuQ-0007hv-00 for ; Wed, 11 Nov 2015 17:13:36 +0100 Received: from news1142 by friends.grml.info with local (Gmexim 0.1 (Debian)) id 1AlnuQ-0007hv-00 for ; Wed, 11 Nov 2015 17:13:36 +0100 List-Id: "General discussions about Org-mode." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: emacs-orgmode-bounces+geo-emacs-orgmode=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Sender: emacs-orgmode-bounces+geo-emacs-orgmode=m.gmane.org@gnu.org To: emacs-orgmode@gnu.org * John Wiegley wrote: > > In my regimen, every single entry has a PROPERTIES drawer, since I tag each > one with ID and CREATED, for future reference. This also holds for my Org-mode files - in general. > Most items are SCHEDULED as well. So when I open up a headline to > look at the contents, I see: > > * Head > SCHEDULED > text > :PROPERTIES:... > > It's a trivial thing, but I'd rather not scan past two lines to start reading > my entry. I just wanted to add an additional notion to the discussion: In most cases, the content of the drawers gets populated automatically (LOGBOOK, CREATED, ...). In some cases, I manually add properties, mainly :ID: for being able to use references to it. Below the drawers, there is the actual content which is free text, mixed with lists, blocks, and so forth. In those cases, I prefer drawers being closed by default. However, in my contacts.org file, I have entries where the actual content is in a rather strict form like: ,---- | ** Firstname Lastname :FirstnameLastname: | :PROPERTIES: | :TYPE: person | :TITLE: | :EMAIL: Firstname.Lastname@example.com | :URL: http://example.com | :MOBILE: 0043/123456789 | :HOMEPHONE: | :WORKPHONE: | :PHONE: | :COMPANY: | :STREET: Herrengasse 42 | :POSTALCODE: 8042 | :CITY: Graz | :COUNTRY: Österreich | :PHOTOGRAPH: [[photo:FirstnameLastname.jpg]] | :BORN: 1970-12-31 | :ITOLDTHEM_EMAIL: Lastname@MYDOMAIN.at | :ITOLDTHEM_ADDRESS: home | :ITOLDTHEM_PHONE: mobile | :ADDRESS_CHANGE_METHOD: email | :CREATED: [2015-11-11 Wed 16:51] | :END: | | - first contact: <2015-11-11 Wed> when meeting at id:FooConf15 `---- Here, the drawer is of particular interest to me and I'd love to have them expanded together with the heading. Besides, I once started an attempt to define a standard for contact property item names in order to enable external tools to parse contact data like [1]. Unfortunately, my focus shifted and I did not follow my standardization attempt much further: http://thread.gmane.org/gmane.emacs.orgmode/45347/focus=45740 http://thread.gmane.org/gmane.emacs.orgmode/47434/focus=47490 http://article.gmane.org/gmane.emacs.orgmode/57231/ [...] Two notions: first, content of properties are of different interest for different people in different org-mode files with different data. It's hard to derive a general rule here. Second, I still do think that a bit more standardization would be a benefit for Org-mode (contact data, order of org elements, ...). Having written a pretty dumb Org-mode parser in Python by myself for [2] I recognized that this is not an easy job to do properly outside of Elisp. And: being able to use Org-mode files outside of Emacs/Elisp is also of interest for all users of Emacs/Elisp. Just my 2 cents. [1] https://github.com/novoid/org-contacts2vcard [2] https://github.com/novoid/lazyblorg -- mail|git|SVN|photos|postings|SMS|phonecalls|RSS|CSV|XML to Org-mode: > get Memacs from https://github.com/novoid/Memacs < https://github.com/novoid/extract_pdf_annotations_to_orgmode + more on github