Re: Documentation request

From: "Rustom Mody" <rustompmody@gmail.com>
To: emacs-org <emacs-orgmode@gnu.org>
Subject: Re: Documentation request
Date: Sun, 20 Jan 2008 15:50:46 +0530	[thread overview]
Message-ID: <f46c52560801200220r745918f9xd14ad2f9c5c86e92@mail.gmail.com> (raw)
In-Reply-To: <87lk6lhh4v.fsf@kamaloka.dhatu>

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On Jan 19, 2008 10:44 PM, Sven Bretfeld <sven.bretfeld@gmx.ch> wrote:

> Hello to all
>
> Org mode is powerful. This well-known, almost trivial, statement
> contains a problematic dimension that is so far not solved in neither
> the documentation nor in the various howtos all over the web: How do
> newbies learn to make optimal use of all it's power?
>

Hear Hear Sven!
I too must confess to increasing depression at the fact that -- in my little
world -- the imminent marriage of GTD with org is far from consummated.  Two
months back I told my friends Give me 2 days of 'leave-me-alone' and I'll
grok this org-thing and soon have my life in order.

2 months on and I am yet to figure out how to match the org notion of agenda
with the corresponding GTD lists.  Not yet figured out how to use
remember... Just 2 examples... Much else that has me at sea...

>
> I read quite a few descriptions of how to use org mode for GTD,
> day-planning, even LaTeX-writing. But when reading this list I have
> the impression that many members use org mode in a much more creative
> way than I can imagine from reading what is to be found on the web.
>
> I'm sure that I don't use the possibilities of org mode in an optimal
> way, and that my concept of ordering data and using features is not
> the best suitable for me. The major problem is as follows:
>
> - Even if one knows what features are available in org-mode, it's hard
>  to imagine what fine things you can actually do with them and how
>  they could be used to complement each other in order to build up a
>  meaningful overall concept.
>

This may be so Sven but I see the problem as more basic:

I never learnt how to be organized
I do not know the intricacies of orgmode
The use of org for organizing (a la GTD or anything else) is clearly a
second order problem

>
> In other words, it's a problem of imagination. This might be *my*
> problem, but yet I believe that many users will have this same
> difficulty, especially the new ones. John Wiegley's and Charles Cave's
> howtos are fine and most instructive in this respect, but I have
> different needs. I need more of these suggestions in order to pick out
> ideas for my own style. On the org mode homepage there are several
> descriptions of setups (Lisp code), but AFAIK only these two
> explanations of concepts. We had many postings that gave a glimpse on
> some concepts, but this is piecemeal.
>
> What I would really like to see -- and now I come to my suggestion --
> are some snapshots of org files by other users. What features are they
> using and what for? What is the underlying concept of their
> organization structure? What I need is the: "Aah, you are doing it
> that way ..."
>

Of course this  would be useful.
Also would be useful to see the lisp setups, makefiles/shell scripts people
are using showing how remember, diary, bbdb and much else hang together

>
> How do you think about making a space on the tutorial page of the org
> mode homepage where people can upload example org-files, maybe
> together with a short description of their concepts? Of course these
> files have to be prepared in order to disguise their personal tasks
> and dates, which are (of course) of no concern to the public, but they
> should have to be recognizable as snapshots of a work-in-progress
> ("project A", "project B" isn't very instructive, I think. "Writing
> chapter 4 of my dissertation thesis" would be much more informative).
>
> I think this could be a valuable source for ideas how to optimize the
> use of org mode, and it could give newbies (as well as experts) a
> major clue to orientate themselves in the world of org mode.
>
> I hope this request is not too silly. Of course, I would be willing to
> become the first person to submit a file, although I believe that
> there is not much to be learned from it.
>
> Thanks for considering my request (and for reading this long message)
>
> Sven
>

Sorry if Ive sounded grumpy.  When I saw the mail talking of the need to
rewrite org-mode I thought I know lisp better than many people and I may
even be able to round up some ex-students of mine to chip in to this
rewrite.
Then I thought-- knowing Scheme is one thing whereas the intricacies of
elisp something else.  Each time the emacs version bumps up I find I
understand it less and less

So for now will have to stay as a user rather than contributor. :-(

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