From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 From: "Avdi Grimm" Subject: Re: How you can help Date: Fri, 24 Oct 2008 14:44:39 -0400 Message-ID: References: <967CE7ED-05E9-4031-9F3B-CFB826511554@alexanderonline.org> <87ljwfbdga.fsf@kassiopeya.MSHEIMNETZ> <752DA813-1B66-4FD1-B28E-3C23176BA13D@alexanderonline.org> <87r6679t1t.fsf@kassiopeya.MSHEIMNETZ> <4A07BAD9-7045-4A42-BEAE-CD67DD491E61@alexanderonline.org> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Return-path: Received: from mailman by lists.gnu.org with tmda-scanned (Exim 4.43) id 1KtReM-0000qx-R2 for emacs-orgmode@gnu.org; Fri, 24 Oct 2008 14:44:42 -0400 Received: from exim by lists.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.43) id 1KtReL-0000qj-Fx for emacs-orgmode@gnu.org; Fri, 24 Oct 2008 14:44:42 -0400 Received: from [199.232.76.173] (port=34291 helo=monty-python.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1KtReL-0000qg-AT for emacs-orgmode@gnu.org; Fri, 24 Oct 2008 14:44:41 -0400 Received: from rv-out-0708.google.com ([209.85.198.247]:31199) by monty-python.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.60) (envelope-from ) id 1KtReK-0001X2-RN for emacs-orgmode@gnu.org; Fri, 24 Oct 2008 14:44:41 -0400 Received: by rv-out-0708.google.com with SMTP id k29so1166096rvb.6 for ; Fri, 24 Oct 2008 11:44:39 -0700 (PDT) In-Reply-To: <4A07BAD9-7045-4A42-BEAE-CD67DD491E61@alexanderonline.org> Content-Disposition: inline List-Id: "General discussions about Org-mode." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: emacs-orgmode-bounces+geo-emacs-orgmode=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Errors-To: emacs-orgmode-bounces+geo-emacs-orgmode=m.gmane.org@gnu.org To: Ben Alexander Cc: emacs-orgmode Org-Mode On Fri, Oct 24, 2008 at 2:33 PM, Ben Alexander wrote: > Ok, here's your chance. This is something that has bothered me for quite > some time, but I've never been able to reliably reproduce the problem. And > it's such a small issue. Thanks! I'll try to take a look tonight or this weekend. > So the value of a testing framework is that this: if I'm going to announce > to the world that I can't get something to work, (like the tab key), I'm > going to make darn sure it's a real problem. I'm going to spend the time to > create a small sample file, that reliable creates the problem, and I'm going > to try a few different scenarios. But if I start to get lost or confused > about which settings I've fiddled with or what is supposed to happen, I'll > wander away from the problem and I won't submit the bug. We all lose in > that scenario. But if the testing framework exists, and it is lightweight > enough for novice emacs users (advanced enough to use M-x but not advanced > enough to read lisp) then maybe I would have used it for this example. For the record, I normally would never expect the user to submit tests. A description of the problem and some sample data is all I expect. Writing the a test to reproduce the behavior is the programmer's responsibility as far as I'm concerned. -- Avdi Home: http://avdi.org Developer Blog: http://avdi.org/devblog/ Twitter: http://twitter.com/avdi Journal: http://avdi.livejournal.com