From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: from mp0 ([2001:41d0:8:6d80::]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 (256/256 bits)) by ms0.migadu.com with LMTPS id aBA3FFLPpGEWIwAAgWs5BA (envelope-from ) for ; Mon, 29 Nov 2021 14:02:10 +0100 Received: from aspmx1.migadu.com ([2001:41d0:8:6d80::]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 (256/256 bits)) by mp0 with LMTPS id 2MULEFLPpGEKJgAA1q6Kng (envelope-from ) for ; Mon, 29 Nov 2021 13:02:10 +0000 Received: from lists.gnu.org (lists.gnu.org [209.51.188.17]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by aspmx1.migadu.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 526B01DF41 for ; Mon, 29 Nov 2021 14:02:09 +0100 (CET) Received: from localhost ([::1]:39034 helo=lists1p.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1mrgIK-0004qY-Ct for larch@yhetil.org; Mon, 29 Nov 2021 08:02:08 -0500 Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([209.51.188.92]:34416) by lists.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1mrgEn-0002aF-Tt for emacs-orgmode@gnu.org; Mon, 29 Nov 2021 07:58:29 -0500 Received: from relay6-d.mail.gandi.net ([217.70.183.198]:57751) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1mrgEl-0002JZ-QD for emacs-orgmode@gnu.org; Mon, 29 Nov 2021 07:58:29 -0500 Received: (Authenticated sender: cschockaert@citadels.be) by relay6-d.mail.gandi.net (Postfix) with ESMTPA id 12582C000A for ; Mon, 29 Nov 2021 12:58:23 +0000 (UTC) MIME-Version: 1.0 Date: Mon, 29 Nov 2021 13:58:23 +0100 From: Christophe Schockaert To: emacs-orgmode@gnu.org Subject: Re: "Orgdown", the new name for the syntax of Org-mode In-Reply-To: <16F7037A-6055-4500-AE04-72DAC60DBA8E@gtf.org> References: <2021-11-28T20-44-37@devnull.Karl-Voit.at> <75ce32ea-616b-0293-1eb5-f9b64afd42ed@gmail.com> <16F7037A-6055-4500-AE04-72DAC60DBA8E@gtf.org> Message-ID: X-Sender: R3vLibre@citadels.eu Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Received-SPF: none client-ip=217.70.183.198; envelope-from=R3vLibre@citadels.eu; helo=relay6-d.mail.gandi.net X-Spam_score_int: -25 X-Spam_score: -2.6 X-Spam_bar: -- X-Spam_report: (-2.6 / 5.0 requ) BAYES_00=-1.9, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_LOW=-0.7, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_H2=-0.001, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_NONE=0.001 autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no X-Spam_action: no action X-BeenThere: emacs-orgmode@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: "General discussions about Org-mode." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: emacs-orgmode-bounces+larch=yhetil.org@gnu.org Sender: "Emacs-orgmode" X-Migadu-Flow: FLOW_IN ARC-Message-Signature: i=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=yhetil.org; s=key1; t=1638190929; h=from:from:sender:sender:reply-to:subject:subject:date:date: message-id:message-id:to:to:cc:mime-version:mime-version: content-type:content-type: content-transfer-encoding:content-transfer-encoding: in-reply-to:in-reply-to:references:references:list-id:list-help: list-unsubscribe:list-subscribe:list-post; bh=Pf51UZn7LDhbYmO4e6NfXBklZWJhMRFMuMplIvV7+Nw=; b=O8SzFn18/sgJGhx2PfA/HnVuXrtlC+4pjWdw2sdJBgWo7njV3mui3fTo/4VQcBuExVMBN0 LgCbfyKGEGjzaYLoiB9BncknrVR+ExilEjChxtObrBxnnVk0ZMp5VjyBjXbxXcdiYENdRG DyvbUh8gBB2zMEsjXAMctH054q+wk0OLs3otq4j1dSP8QQIUOIO/CMR89zLwJuLmfRT6ey IbdefUBWbYALUoD+QHImrjPcnz7wVEFMCo6ckGefuHPhEpZ/oysxYnXbXkzznXMz2ET9YX 8E4vTc7NHBHjyIpJGlfLiyAEYtuSnU7IrdrRGSdfsWAfmX6h7B+fRnEgwUMCBQ== ARC-Seal: i=1; s=key1; d=yhetil.org; t=1638190929; a=rsa-sha256; cv=none; b=hvNtv4ot/ESdYBsNMuRQNENu64NHX0umIZvgtH+mNquqJaFn7WD9rmeUzbPS0WMZfQ4m2C 8ne5dr3NfdLNMEX96na0gAzeuLrO/5GGUznSaS6FfI8coyQ4WhOse8+VE36dqpRZyU32Uv Yn/xFvfmx2kg2sE/HPCG3RpOjwN5yPlL6XjEjwByw/FyNGM3H1huod1nLA37UmS3g2WdNk 4pJP1mx1iKpJjK6SKaoEZG0chnAoDTglfkntkINZ/eojXeoV5Q0OZzEIYA8ZpoqB+j6a9u IR2YPduUCLg6syBNjZp+xoiTg88fppy8yWvG4sUzRvbcha0k7fxVOZ4/LbrEYQ== ARC-Authentication-Results: i=1; aspmx1.migadu.com; dkim=none; spf=pass (aspmx1.migadu.com: domain of emacs-orgmode-bounces@gnu.org designates 209.51.188.17 as permitted sender) smtp.mailfrom=emacs-orgmode-bounces@gnu.org X-Migadu-Spam-Score: -3.01 Authentication-Results: aspmx1.migadu.com; dkim=none; dmarc=none; spf=pass (aspmx1.migadu.com: domain of emacs-orgmode-bounces@gnu.org designates 209.51.188.17 as permitted sender) smtp.mailfrom=emacs-orgmode-bounces@gnu.org X-Migadu-Queue-Id: 526B01DF41 X-Spam-Score: -3.01 X-Migadu-Scanner: scn1.migadu.com X-TUID: TRjn4BDD1Ttz On 2021-11-29 03:33, Michael Ashton wrote: >> On Nov 28, 2021, at 6:22 PM, Jim Porter wrote: >> >> On 11/28/2021 11:46 AM, Karl Voit wrote: >>> At this year's EmascsConf, I had a 12 minute video where I explain >>> why >>> we do need a different name for the syntax of Org-mode in contrast to >>> the Elisp implementation of GNU/Emacs Org-mode. >>> I would like you to read my rationale and motivate you to use the >>> term >>> "Orgdown" for the syntax and "Orgdown1" for the first (very basic) >>> level of Orgdown syntax elements. >> >> I agree that it's useful to distinguish the files/syntax from the >> *mode*, which contains many functions for doing things with those >> files. >> >> For what it's worth (perhaps not much), I've always referred to the >> syntax/file format as simply "Org"; for example, "I put my notes into >> an Org file." This is by analogy with most of the other Emacs major >> modes for editing files. I write Python in `python-mode', I write C++ >> in `c++-mode', I write text files in `text-mode', and so on. >> >> Maybe "Org" isn't distinct enough though. People unfamiliar with >> Org-Mode might confuse "Org" with "org charts" or some other use of >> the word. Still, if we look to other tools that can read the same >> files as Org-Mode, they tend to be called things like "Organice", not >> "Orgmodeanice". :) > > Perhaps orgtext or org-text? Hi Karl and Org fellows, I do understand that it has always been a tricky topic, since Org Mode and its format are intrinsically linked. I think what you are bringing is useful, I can feel how a syntax for a "standard" Org format subset would be useful (maybe we could keep open a way to customize it by exporting Lisp params values as part of a document annex, but that's beyond the current status, just to say I understand why you bring that :). I have to say, however, that I am not very enthusiast with the name that you came by for this. At first, because I feel Org format and Markdown are different beasts ; eventhough I do use Markdown, I prefer Org alot, so it sounds strange to have a reference to Markdown in Org format name. But, really more because I feel like Org stands on its own, and it does not need to help itself as a comparison to Markdown to get its own renown, or to explain what it is. In previous mails, "Org Syntax" and "Org Markup" sounded good to me. However, I do like "org-text" or "Org Text" a lot, or why not even "OrgText", but I favor the first two, which refer to the way we write "org-mode" the Emacs Mode and "Org Mode" in documents. After all, this is exactly what it is about, "Writing text in Org", and what it is essentially "text characters arranged according to Org format". Have a good day, Christophe -- ---------------> https://www.citadels.earth Once it's perfectly aimed, the flying arrow goes straight to its target. Thus, don't worry when things go right. There will be enough time to worry about if they go wrong. Then, it's time to fire a new arrow towards another direction. Don't sink. Adapt yourself ! The archer has to shoot accurately and quickly. [Words of Erenthar, the bowman ranger] <---------------<<<<