From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: from mp12.migadu.com ([2001:41d0:2:bcc0::]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 (256/256 bits)) by ms5.migadu.com with LMTPS id +AJIAzWwQGPxCQEAbAwnHQ (envelope-from ) for ; Sat, 08 Oct 2022 01:03:17 +0200 Received: from aspmx1.migadu.com ([2001:41d0:2:bcc0::]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 (256/256 bits)) by mp12.migadu.com with LMTPS id sBUyAzWwQGP+EwEAauVa8A (envelope-from ) for ; Sat, 08 Oct 2022 01:03:17 +0200 Received: from lists.gnu.org (lists.gnu.org [209.51.188.17]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by aspmx1.migadu.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id AE169129F7 for ; Sat, 8 Oct 2022 01:03:16 +0200 (CEST) Received: from localhost ([::1]:37286 helo=lists1p.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1ogwN8-0003M3-Vb for larch@yhetil.org; Fri, 07 Oct 2022 19:03:14 -0400 Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::10]:59210) by lists.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1ogwJM-0000Bi-HS for emacs-orgmode@gnu.org; Fri, 07 Oct 2022 18:59:20 -0400 Received: from stw1.rcdrun.com ([217.170.207.13]:50567) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1ogwJK-0003DR-OR for emacs-orgmode@gnu.org; Fri, 07 Oct 2022 18:59:20 -0400 Received: from localhost ([::ffff:154.225.55.149]) (AUTH: PLAIN admin, TLS: TLS1.3,256bits,ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384) by stw1.rcdrun.com with ESMTPSA id 00000000000BBD19.000000006340AF46.00003D69; Fri, 07 Oct 2022 15:59:17 -0700 Date: Sat, 8 Oct 2022 01:44:45 +0300 From: Jean Louis To: Payas Relekar Cc: emacs-orgmode@gnu.org Subject: Re: Org and Hyperbole Message-ID: Mail-Followup-To: Payas Relekar , emacs-orgmode@gnu.org References: <878rlw3ws3.fsf@gmail.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: <878rlw3ws3.fsf@gmail.com> User-Agent: Mutt/2.2.7+37 (a90f69b) (2022-09-02) Received-SPF: pass client-ip=217.170.207.13; envelope-from=bugs@gnu.support; helo=stw1.rcdrun.com X-Spam_score_int: -18 X-Spam_score: -1.9 X-Spam_bar: - X-Spam_report: (-1.9 / 5.0 requ) BAYES_00=-1.9, SPF_HELO_PASS=-0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001 autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no X-Spam_action: no action X-BeenThere: emacs-orgmode@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: "General discussions about Org-mode." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: emacs-orgmode-bounces+larch=yhetil.org@gnu.org Sender: "Emacs-orgmode" X-Migadu-Flow: FLOW_IN X-Migadu-Country: US ARC-Message-Signature: i=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=yhetil.org; s=key1; t=1665183796; h=from:from:sender:sender:reply-to:subject:subject:date:date: message-id:message-id:to:to:cc:cc:mime-version:mime-version: content-type:content-type: content-transfer-encoding:content-transfer-encoding: in-reply-to:in-reply-to:references:references:list-id:list-help: list-unsubscribe:list-subscribe:list-post; bh=IlHs8mwqBss/yzIQpaKqRYbEVqnNtiqNPyklkudbddI=; b=d/jMirqQ2K0UyCuv1LPvFmNVHfzI+QcbCSEFmjhiGo/KikHQsNPUw3MsqAahziB0IPcweP szgAuSJJpT+y3TB+z9rjcSrVjuLKF70gTxg3VlcWZhCF22RqsDMhQD1htoJX6tVNFgucQQ w1PT/+KA6X+dC7EDvmxCaYd4sCMNuKgR6nZND/Ksb6Z3oPDcIWLAsRjKqczleTd0xRuTu/ szdItbmQv4NC/fzDbbxDgoFXLAuz7w8o8rp7NQ6pvu5JNyTzAX4ED7ynAw4gyS2eX48aNd 2oZMWdJQwosKeGvtiRypgrfao2HZnonRfc0hO//3NnkkRyMJCBb7QO4HhaQlqQ== ARC-Seal: i=1; s=key1; d=yhetil.org; t=1665183796; a=rsa-sha256; cv=none; b=TOxUivUcV5d+CwxxTlIjT4XWe5PUrCOOU5WpeigXhDz2m798sr3/e8CF24xv5TqrYp5D6f vt4PW7xU/flJJw5YzuAQ0CWLki59sLXGujRI4bvtvNZ51371BkzCHxYO0MqPRs2Ti939WQ ih1INOm5urczCrguLx4b6+G/YS1Pg3zTWdjRKo38wopJQ7QOzO3VDimdMr8hiWDKHuCOSZ +4tZzCjFzxTi2DfeIrKKTDsARBC/qdvDewTnFoBLIRrcJ+2/JIKa4wFQVXm+vG/tV2zJQQ RQT8vFymT0vEEosKILf2nI2tJ7bdGgIuG8s7mJmSsmuNQwxYUKEntYZFwSTQGg== ARC-Authentication-Results: i=1; aspmx1.migadu.com; dkim=none; dmarc=none; spf=pass (aspmx1.migadu.com: domain of "emacs-orgmode-bounces+larch=yhetil.org@gnu.org" designates 209.51.188.17 as permitted sender) smtp.mailfrom="emacs-orgmode-bounces+larch=yhetil.org@gnu.org" X-Migadu-Spam-Score: -2.18 Authentication-Results: aspmx1.migadu.com; dkim=none; dmarc=none; spf=pass (aspmx1.migadu.com: domain of "emacs-orgmode-bounces+larch=yhetil.org@gnu.org" designates 209.51.188.17 as permitted sender) smtp.mailfrom="emacs-orgmode-bounces+larch=yhetil.org@gnu.org" X-Migadu-Queue-Id: AE169129F7 X-Spam-Score: -2.18 X-Migadu-Scanner: scn1.migadu.com X-TUID: MD0ZLGoaKAs6 * Payas Relekar [2022-10-04 09:56]: > Not Jean, but as someone using Org with Hyperbole, this is a great news! > > > We welcome brief summaries of features you need for effective note taking > > in Emacs. We are not looking to do much with images or on mobile devices, > > just focused on people who spend a lot of time in Emacs and want an > > easy-to-use notes system that does not require any external packages like > > SQLite. > > For my 2c: > > - Multiple small files vs single large file. > I currently have former, with org-roam taking care of finding, linking > and backlinking between files, making it a non-issue to easily build a > network of connected topics/thoughts Org-roam is yet another attempt to make relational database out of Org text by using exlusive ID links. I can't know, I am just assuming that it has to parse plethora of Org files and links inside to understand what is linking to what. Old fashioned way wish to ignore the existence of RDBMs. Files have its location and user is supposed to move file in file system, to think about it and decide where it is. I don't think it is right so in 21st century. It is better to know very descriptive name of file, but as user to forget where is file located. On the ATM machine I want cash out and not to know where is cash located. I just want to access it, and be able to access it from many locations. Only RDBMs are for that purpose. > - Daily notes > Every day gets its own note, only generated if visited. This allows > dumping the thoughts at that moment rather than first hunting the > correct node. Then they can be easily filtered into actual topic note, > or just be referenced via backlinks buffer That is very nice. That is how I sort screenshots and videos as well, by date when they are made. If note is related to person, then system is to recognize it automatically. Notes are related mostly to people: groups or lists of people such as "Emacs Users" or "Org Users" or "ABC SLIME LTD" and individual people, and people assigned to various tasks, and groups assigned to tasks, and people supposed to get reports of it. > - sqlite might just be better, considering overhead of opening and > parsing hundreds-thousands of small files is non-negligible. Of course it is so much better option than keeping stuff in text. All properties shall be in the database. SQLite is not a network database, thus it disables collaboration. It is better developing with PostgresSQL or MariaDB, or other network databases. > - Refiling > Refile/move the subtree (in Org terms) can be easily moved to another > file and the links automatically point to new location. This means I > can always know rearranging stuff later is a possibility, and its less > cognitive burden to organize. Once my files are stored in the meta system, I have no idea where they are located. File name does not matter any more. Many files arrive with strange file names. If file gets its meta name then its storage and file name in file system may remain static forever, while separate meta data can be changed. Meta data may tell that "ABC FILE" shall be moved to "CAR REPAIR" while file name on file system does not move ever. Moving files in file system is tedious. It requires operations such as listing of directories, opening file manager, copying, renaming, etc. Instead it is better to go straight to the thought. Do you wnat file "ABC FILE" to be moved in the collection or header of "CAR REPAIR?" Then choose "CAR REPAIR" by completion and let it go there. File in the file system may remain immutable, only the meta data of its position may change. -- Jean Take action in Free Software Foundation campaigns: https://www.fsf.org/campaigns In support of Richard M. Stallman https://stallmansupport.org/