From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: from mp2 ([2001:41d0:2:4a6f::]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 (256/256 bits)) by ms11 with LMTPS id 6FgLIvSMr1+QVAAA0tVLHw (envelope-from ) for ; Sat, 14 Nov 2020 07:53:24 +0000 Received: from aspmx1.migadu.com ([2001:41d0:2:4a6f::]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 (256/256 bits)) by mp2 with LMTPS id ULbgHfSMr1/eewAAB5/wlQ (envelope-from ) for ; Sat, 14 Nov 2020 07:53:24 +0000 Received: from lists.gnu.org (lists.gnu.org [209.51.188.17]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by aspmx1.migadu.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id DEBC29404C2 for ; Sat, 14 Nov 2020 07:53:23 +0000 (UTC) Received: from localhost ([::1]:55186 helo=lists1p.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1kdqN7-0000vJ-En for larch@yhetil.org; Sat, 14 Nov 2020 02:53:21 -0500 Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::10]:59276) by lists.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1kdqMl-0000v8-Uf for emacs-orgmode@gnu.org; Sat, 14 Nov 2020 02:52:59 -0500 Received: from static.rcdrun.com ([95.85.24.50]:53543) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1kdqMk-0001cN-1c for emacs-orgmode@gnu.org; Sat, 14 Nov 2020 02:52:59 -0500 Received: from localhost ([::ffff:41.202.241.56]) (AUTH: PLAIN admin, TLS: TLS1.2,256bits,ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384) by static.rcdrun.com with ESMTPSA id 00000000002C0009.000000005FAF8CD6.00003216; Sat, 14 Nov 2020 07:52:53 +0000 Date: Sat, 14 Nov 2020 01:21:23 +0300 From: Jean Louis To: Gustavo Barros Subject: Re: Changed list indentation behavior: how to revert? Message-ID: References: <2020-11-13T18-23-43@devnull.Karl-Voit.at> <871rgxotcv.fsf@gmail.com> <87zh3koqgk.fsf@gmail.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: <87zh3koqgk.fsf@gmail.com> User-Agent: Mutt/2.0 (3d08634) (2020-11-07) Received-SPF: pass client-ip=95.85.24.50; envelope-from=bugs@gnu.support; helo=static.rcdrun.com X-detected-operating-system: by eggs.gnu.org: First seen = 2020/11/14 02:52:55 X-ACL-Warn: Detected OS = Linux 3.11 and newer [fuzzy] X-Spam_score_int: -3 X-Spam_score: -0.4 X-Spam_bar: / X-Spam_report: (-0.4 / 5.0 requ) BAYES_00=-1.9, DATE_IN_PAST_06_12=1.543, SPF_HELO_PASS=-0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001 autolearn=no autolearn_force=no X-Spam_action: no action X-BeenThere: emacs-orgmode@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.23 Precedence: list List-Id: "General discussions about Org-mode." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Cc: emacs-orgmode@gnu.org Errors-To: emacs-orgmode-bounces+larch=yhetil.org@gnu.org Sender: "Emacs-orgmode" X-Scanner: ns3122888.ip-94-23-21.eu Authentication-Results: aspmx1.migadu.com; dkim=none; dmarc=none; spf=pass (aspmx1.migadu.com: domain of emacs-orgmode-bounces@gnu.org designates 209.51.188.17 as permitted sender) smtp.mailfrom=emacs-orgmode-bounces@gnu.org X-Spam-Score: 0.49 X-TUID: wwFQk6k2CQsI * Gustavo Barros [2020-11-14 01:14]: > > On Fri, 13 Nov 2020 at 18:47, Jean Louis wrote: > > > * Gustavo Barros [2020-11-14 00:12]: > > > > I have seen discussion with very little reasoning. You are changing > > default for many users and large subset of those users will not read > > the NEWS. And now you are discovering that there are people who get > > messed up with it. Is it really useful? So far I remember the > > electric-indent-mode did work in Org mode without this anti-enhancement. > > > [...] > > > > Introducing default that changes habits and gives more work to present > > users is not useful. > > > > Did you consider number of users who would now maybe need to introduce > > local variable just to turn that off? Sorry that I do not find this > > case reasonable. > > Oh, my! I'm not even the person you should be ranting to. I'm just an > user, and someone who follows this list, and was trying to be helpful. > > But, as such, I do get what motivated maintainers to make the change from > the linked threads. And I also got from them and the News the information > needed to adjust for the change, in case I'd want to. Perhaps we read > differently. Sorry. I was wondering for quite some time what is happening as I use development Emacs version. It was so annoying. Now when I know what is going on I can turn it off. So far I was thinking that most common Org writing is like this: * Heading ** Second *** Third **** Fourth And not like: * Heading ** Second *** Third **** Fourth As that is how ugly and less visible it should look like if the same principle should be followed. As if somebody forces me to indent list items like that, then they shall also force headings. So consistency is lacking. /s Please send that to those people to reconsider taking it back.