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List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: emacs-orgmode-bounces+larch=yhetil.org@gnu.org Sender: "Emacs-orgmode" X-Migadu-Flow: FLOW_IN X-Migadu-To: larch@yhetil.org X-Migadu-Country: US ARC-Message-Signature: i=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=yhetil.org; s=key1; t=1648570521; h=from:from:sender:sender:reply-to:subject:subject:date:date: message-id:message-id:to:to:cc:mime-version:mime-version: content-type:content-type:in-reply-to:in-reply-to: references:references:list-id:list-help:list-unsubscribe: list-subscribe:list-post:dkim-signature; bh=27rNTJLpDakxJWeq0jD3x1ksaN76P4wPr2Hj5RU7hXs=; b=gntOYEsccOtvNSliP7twS25kFDLxj88jf5gRUxYVXFvqAd8E5bP1TnKU0ig9r9M4vHJoWU 3narvBKC/rHrjQuahZ67vJ5FR2bCHSEfF0Tj7iBEb/8VGsK9OHwHGR29Yz2bhNjVpkIkdC SpuvhHOPpYeye7Nou66z2O7B67bSuMJhBVkzEtYB436K+zwKMmUdvblmYnqlu+2Xl66zQj gf9S1nqBA3h2x3F6gT3vsox3bG0/Okd4pndtTCsQoSqrHeZ+fjMOm6Sngggbba2bh0MYAn +LJa1Ndva8VBwGHVbuv30cs9T7+bL6rYqrAl7+xfVG//43HMzIZ0npFbokvvaQ== ARC-Seal: i=1; s=key1; d=yhetil.org; t=1648570521; a=rsa-sha256; cv=none; b=Ab5PT2qGpYK7xh8iCUVBBgGkahb4vwaq6a1pkKe/aM/A/kuK6/6aQrL6IYZN5QgFIp5q42 Q3roabu+ElBIAIQ3U4J1f5cy6j2ymeEcgIvozo0t02dLrPZjeFOUX25yu1wsDO0b0kPAII yBny4DD6wgh6JpskujA5Hb6WyCqA4VntnHWPNvzzbtKQjV1qSjqQF/tbsWr10qQZSL0ti1 3NpxvyZgyraFLuxNyF2r7rBdX/HnU7K909XjDxBcUkASNCaqwzJEqxNnKJb6pgKVWrti6F HCkEphQOCQ+nqtsWY5GwFbJhFRu6PFNigViu2nSOchsql0hPso9f3/ZYpxFirA== ARC-Authentication-Results: i=1; aspmx1.migadu.com; dkim=pass header.d=gmail.com header.s=20210112 header.b=Hny45xv5; dmarc=pass (policy=none) header.from=gmail.com; spf=pass (aspmx1.migadu.com: domain of "emacs-orgmode-bounces+larch=yhetil.org@gnu.org" designates 209.51.188.17 as permitted sender) smtp.mailfrom="emacs-orgmode-bounces+larch=yhetil.org@gnu.org" X-Migadu-Spam-Score: -7.57 Authentication-Results: aspmx1.migadu.com; dkim=pass header.d=gmail.com header.s=20210112 header.b=Hny45xv5; dmarc=pass (policy=none) header.from=gmail.com; spf=pass (aspmx1.migadu.com: domain of "emacs-orgmode-bounces+larch=yhetil.org@gnu.org" designates 209.51.188.17 as permitted sender) smtp.mailfrom="emacs-orgmode-bounces+larch=yhetil.org@gnu.org" X-Migadu-Queue-Id: E369136AD4 X-Spam-Score: -7.57 X-Migadu-Scanner: scn0.migadu.com X-TUID: nMasu9qXTnmh On Tue, Mar 29, 2022 at 11:23 AM Max Nikulin wrote: ... > >> You even have managed to convince me that, besides adding missing style > >> names, some existing ones should be adjusted. noauthor/bare for citeyear > >> example makes for me much more sense ... > > > > This does need some attention, but there are wrinkles here. > > > > Citeyear is specific to author-date styles, while noauthor is intended > > to be more general. > > Anyway citation style is rather specific for a particular CSL style. I > tried some styles: > https://github.com/citation-style-language/styles/blob/master/ieee.csl > https://github.com/citation-style-language/styles/blob/master/american-physics-society.csl > nature.csl science.csl and for all these styles even "author" is > meaningless since they are numeric styles. Yes. I think it's more relevant in author-date to note styles. I believe biblatex has a command relevant here, but Denis knows biblatex better than I. > So it is not more general. Switching CSL style means necessity to update > styles in each citations (unless it is possible to specify global or > per-cite mapping). Not really. Arguably the most important style is "text", which applies to any output style; author-date, note-based, numeric. When you start getting into some of the others, the range of styles a given style may apply to shrinks. But you might say author-date styles are pretty dependent on such local citation modification. If those are output to a style that has no such notions (like a numeric one), then a processor can just ignore it. > It seems modifiers are set of boolean flags (positive "year" or negative > "suppress-author") in citeproc.el, set of values in natbib, and a kind > of hierarchy in org-cite. From my point of view, set of constrains > (flags) is the most general variant in this list. I think that's right, and is how it's represented in a GUI app like Zotero. But that's not so convenient in a plain text format. But it's a good way to explain the differences. > > I think it's probably a good idea to add "year" to the latex processors too. > > I agree. Negations are more confusing when an author needs just year. We might as well do that then, along with bibentry/fullcite. ... > I am familiar with bst language used by BibTeX and I am surprised that > initials instead of full names are not enforced by CSL styles. I'm not following here. Certainly one can specify initialization rules in a CSL style. WDYM by "enforced"? > Emphasis and bold markers may appear in plain text export. Behavior of styles is > not uniform in respect to adding (unbreakable?) space before citation. Sorry; not following here again. Isn't the space before a citation determined by the user? Bruce