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To: John Kitchin Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="00000000000058994305db0e9488" X-Host-Lookup-Failed: Reverse DNS lookup failed for 2a00:1450:4864:20::332 (failed) Received-SPF: pass client-ip=2a00:1450:4864:20::332; envelope-from=bdarcus@gmail.com; helo=mail-wm1-x332.google.com X-Spam_score_int: -6 X-Spam_score: -0.7 X-Spam_bar: / X-Spam_report: (-0.7 / 5.0 requ) BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_EF=-0.1, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, PDS_HP_HELO_NORDNS=0.659, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE=-0.0001, RDNS_NONE=0.793, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, T_SCC_BODY_TEXT_LINE=-0.01 autolearn=no autolearn_force=no X-Spam_action: no action X-BeenThere: emacs-orgmode@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: "General discussions about Org-mode." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Cc: Vikas Rawal , org-mode-email Errors-To: emacs-orgmode-bounces+larch=yhetil.org@gnu.org Sender: "Emacs-orgmode" X-Migadu-Flow: FLOW_IN X-Migadu-To: larch@yhetil.org X-Migadu-Country: US ARC-Message-Signature: i=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=yhetil.org; s=key1; t=1648230642; h=from:from:sender:sender:reply-to:subject:subject:date:date: message-id:message-id:to:to:cc:cc:mime-version:mime-version: content-type:content-type:in-reply-to:in-reply-to: references:references:list-id:list-help:list-unsubscribe: list-subscribe:list-post:dkim-signature; bh=/pIPQK/Wrdnef7wDa1Rt1NTd4tqcFPe8HrY5VRJfCoM=; b=ajnJMHVeVOOSpyyEpeDna6kwHabO6LPAIRQ2rWxA/1iWy2E03GDqmLwX61FO12vKY0+T3d nPjKYVfrX7kfXk7RqL3GWU+lwddUi0i+82XmW1s+bGdhhIrjZn22lxsvXJ7Pb+h6y0dTwI igLIXfPsPW3jvZ6RIfeYdtaDcjuYpSSay0237WsD0KDsRHDunUQCh7y3M47ciT3+GqQZdq py9F4yz6RsV0XI4hZiv0dAT674Xa2EjR2hrjpeJYwzv4Ha7rQzYvQxOzgPT5kk8PZcppAR zkfDyMIGKXbGYHZsY5KQLHSQdWGZ0IMQAi2ckvwyaOVW/+suCnRxUvaHuq3KnQ== ARC-Seal: i=1; s=key1; d=yhetil.org; t=1648230642; a=rsa-sha256; cv=none; b=rW+UeGyv+38torWUUjWIYl29ylU/gCWpqtV4BcCjKAspw30+XshSixY28RO1VNvm0nK2YT T2i4M57a1szM1CYyLlBqntk55EwKZojmpRZmxcoM7HUd0eBGQO1oOEp/UkoAd6ZPxUNCMe RJxAosn1GD33qJo8YlOBFWG/TLRdxPJGj0fE76pU63CLNZ26dqm/SQsd6zEGyHG+rUR2Pp 0DRxOWPacSfBnYB3hEDx0X+oPXSZfg4ZPWLIncK//R1sHkTaeIqanqsbEAH9ftKLfVxAA+ iM/kYdMGYVoqDLEajGI7qO8ETap0m0vHgEmCdzD6LW0DhY2ZVte3K8xk0AkMiQ== ARC-Authentication-Results: i=1; aspmx1.migadu.com; dkim=pass header.d=gmail.com header.s=20210112 header.b=n0ydaVJv; dmarc=pass (policy=none) header.from=gmail.com; spf=pass (aspmx1.migadu.com: domain of "emacs-orgmode-bounces+larch=yhetil.org@gnu.org" designates 209.51.188.17 as permitted sender) smtp.mailfrom="emacs-orgmode-bounces+larch=yhetil.org@gnu.org" X-Migadu-Spam-Score: -3.08 Authentication-Results: aspmx1.migadu.com; dkim=pass header.d=gmail.com header.s=20210112 header.b=n0ydaVJv; dmarc=pass (policy=none) header.from=gmail.com; spf=pass (aspmx1.migadu.com: domain of "emacs-orgmode-bounces+larch=yhetil.org@gnu.org" designates 209.51.188.17 as permitted sender) smtp.mailfrom="emacs-orgmode-bounces+larch=yhetil.org@gnu.org" X-Migadu-Queue-Id: CDD1088B2 X-Spam-Score: -3.08 X-Migadu-Scanner: scn0.migadu.com X-TUID: igCQoSQNh+TP --00000000000058994305db0e9488 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" On Fri, Mar 25, 2022 at 8:55 AM John Kitchin wrote: > I think this kind of preview is well-suited for external packages. You may be right. > There is a subtle point I ran into with this preview approach though, > and that is what is the backend export you want to see? People expect > one source (org) to export to different backends, and even use one > source to make a PDF and HTML (and maybe others). Now it also possible > to use different citation styles for different backends, and the > backends may use different citation processors (e.g. bib(la)tex or CSL). > I felt this was too complex to try to get right in one package. External > packages could provide any subset of these they want, e.g. the way > https://github.com/andras-simonyi/org-cite-csl-activate does. My opinion > of course. oc-csl-activate uses org-cite-csl--fallback-style-file for the preview style, but also has a org-cite-csl-activate-use-document-style defcustom to optionally override that. A LaTeX preview wouldn't need this. Seems more generally a user would need to be able to specify what the export target is. But I guess per your point, one could do configuration by simply selecting whatever preferred activate processor. So, for example, we could have one for latex preview. > I think the basic CSL styled citation tooltip that is independent of the > final state is a good compromise. The point is to give enough context > about the key to tell you what it is without visiting the source, and if > you need more, you go visit the source (bibtex file, org file, etc.). Indeed. Bruce --00000000000058994305db0e9488 Content-Type: text/html; charset="UTF-8"
On Fri, Mar 25, 2022 at 8:55 AM John Kitchin <jkitchin@andrew.cmu.edu> wrote:

> I think this kind of preview is well-suited for external packages.

You may be right.

> There is a subtle point I ran into with this preview approach though,
> and that is what is the backend export you want to see? People expect
> one source (org) to export to different backends, and even use one
> source to make a PDF and HTML (and maybe others). Now it also possible
> to use different citation styles for different backends, and the
> backends may use different citation processors (e.g. bib(la)tex or CSL).
> I felt this was too complex to try to get right in one package. External
> packages could provide any subset of these they want, e.g. the way
> https://github.com/andras-simonyi/org-cite-csl-activate does. My opinion
> of course.

oc-csl-activate uses org-cite-csl--fallback-style-file for the preview style, but also has a org-cite-csl-activate-use-document-style defcustom to optionally override that. A LaTeX preview wouldn't need this.

Seems more generally a user would need to be able to specify what the export target is.

But I guess per your point, one could do configuration by simply selecting whatever preferred activate processor. So, for example, we could have one for latex preview.

> I think the basic CSL styled citation tooltip that is independent of the
> final state is a good compromise. The point is to give enough context
> about the key to tell you what it is without visiting the source, and if
> you need more, you go visit the source (bibtex file, org file, etc.).

Indeed.

Bruce
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