From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: from mp0 ([2001:41d0:2:bcc0::]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 (256/256 bits)) by ms0.migadu.com with LMTPS id UADtEtYCgmG8wAAAgWs5BA (envelope-from ) for ; Wed, 03 Nov 2021 04:32:38 +0100 Received: from aspmx1.migadu.com ([2001:41d0:2:bcc0::]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 (256/256 bits)) by mp0 with LMTPS id 8OqiDtYCgmH3JQAA1q6Kng (envelope-from ) for ; Wed, 03 Nov 2021 03:32:38 +0000 Received: from lists.gnu.org (lists.gnu.org [209.51.188.17]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by aspmx1.migadu.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id B844D31968 for ; Wed, 3 Nov 2021 04:32:37 +0100 (CET) Received: from localhost ([::1]:54410 helo=lists1p.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1mi70t-00032n-Dx for larch@yhetil.org; Tue, 02 Nov 2021 23:32:35 -0400 Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::10]:40736) by lists.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1mi700-0002xy-Ln for emacs-orgmode@gnu.org; Tue, 02 Nov 2021 23:31:40 -0400 Received: from mail-ua1-x932.google.com ([2607:f8b0:4864:20::932]:42570) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_128_GCM_SHA256:128) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1mi6zr-0005JQ-Rz for emacs-orgmode@gnu.org; Tue, 02 Nov 2021 23:31:34 -0400 Received: by mail-ua1-x932.google.com with SMTP id v20so1902731uaj.9 for ; Tue, 02 Nov 2021 20:31:30 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20210112; h=mime-version:from:date:message-id:subject:to :content-transfer-encoding; bh=DmPwK5p72KqMOCnt+NZtLOLFXDWXL7/E19ejukAzvME=; b=Cu66XWbNZGT5tTSimg5bMCd1FSKTYB4ROkXhrEsjXs+Zr+Pz5J3Wz9mjHRhA42iWuS lec5nZmKeUkyW/YDI3mq2sZzmFm13hXtxCSWCl6Y1aPyPa5his19yf6wHwrLaG4cd3+N lesmlKYMpecEQn4wzUoGaOfaXb2SMiq+kVPsLM//Lla3KXU2ge/OaS0EbRzkr+Vzi2N9 K1XubB08tWZjKQqVsNYYOnFbdZyvAjHTjqidHLjQgNKzCw8voXzi4WwSg0kV94Dbeflk i6mGeAtOcwOlAeas8eWbAMOGgS3ENFkY3a6LdpWzY4i/5rxAi0aH8t7C0kRFNMfcX//b 5Bfg== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20210112; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:from:date:message-id:subject:to :content-transfer-encoding; bh=DmPwK5p72KqMOCnt+NZtLOLFXDWXL7/E19ejukAzvME=; b=1RmSGdW/v1YlO/L8cp3fWG+VZGMp8hXdXq19rgbCef3RQ6XlJLCWcRBZXbE8Jtbc3S sHUHu1KOSat70P8R6BQoC6r68nBWbZMWuh2wReHCWe0NO6ws9DqAmn5mEZ1zBZ7qJ3Aj 9t885+hUDZ6PFDXcedNBuE03R9JL/6FBQvu9BtaCOhdeKiAuWaX22n7D+cv9J48XJHDG 6671dhfzAgeGvEW5tNA10SKl8uEnDzy0QhU8kNHp6TOVVd3EJBDMkGXaNYUcnOLGrxog lr81uzl4+25VhUmHa3XuwN41WWNL0Zd+pubqUQ1YI0vWazI1AxEwiZKEPizhFyoYtI0c uGaw== X-Gm-Message-State: AOAM5319NKqHCVyR71mlbF1G/jFyepZE2HT6VXL/2vWaWFIp1ugRsCTK LOGRWnS98AUPgcn5eneqPneJgGO3HpoN4fnqhVsFQ8GPLjk= X-Google-Smtp-Source: ABdhPJzq2m3H6hnzywgfKj5+sVR86IAF4ruoQFSJGzyE3gWuzdFjDBWKHbjZSbg+kN9iKBCtxO8uufkVlueSoZYHgNk= X-Received: by 2002:a67:1c05:: with SMTP id c5mr46387159vsc.25.1635910289836; Tue, 02 Nov 2021 20:31:29 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 From: Carlos Pita Date: Wed, 3 Nov 2021 00:31:14 -0300 Message-ID: Subject: Inconsistent usage of "overview" To: emacs-orgmode@gnu.org Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Received-SPF: pass client-ip=2607:f8b0:4864:20::932; envelope-from=carlosjosepita2@gmail.com; helo=mail-ua1-x932.google.com X-Spam_score_int: -17 X-Spam_score: -1.8 X-Spam_bar: - X-Spam_report: (-1.8 / 5.0 requ) BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_EF=-0.1, FREEMAIL_ENVFROM_END_DIGIT=0.25, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE=-0.0001, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001 autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no X-Spam_action: no action X-BeenThere: emacs-orgmode@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: "General discussions about Org-mode." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: emacs-orgmode-bounces+larch=yhetil.org@gnu.org Sender: "Emacs-orgmode" X-Migadu-Flow: FLOW_IN ARC-Message-Signature: i=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=yhetil.org; s=key1; t=1635910357; h=from:from:sender:sender:reply-to:subject:subject:date:date: message-id:message-id:to:to:cc:mime-version:mime-version: content-type:content-type: content-transfer-encoding:content-transfer-encoding:list-id:list-help: list-unsubscribe:list-subscribe:list-post:dkim-signature; bh=DmPwK5p72KqMOCnt+NZtLOLFXDWXL7/E19ejukAzvME=; b=e/d1z9UKoRUSUl953vvq6GiW+XVS0S0uPPZVS23qkBsxVq0q6Ws+0XNAqY81FNQbAE4z5P tZopyO8cZou7NptIf/OBkZVzt3fWuKP/T/v+SEOSeU7TPYru3sCWap4v+S/AbirI2H7wyb 9ftlmuT99HDGwN7u9yRoVdcwZTC3IVmh7MfllZmfHO9PdeZLEzG0RSZvQ6u+M4QPV6PqEz VdwIyREHmQ/ZUNf0Em5PejGdqnhjNOvV49+RghnOx8N4DKd2P9IOd/Z2x1caL809EolN7I U58bug9qfFilG3lP5kxZ61iKbjVNdzlIf2BFkfqTPSntz9yJDpikzsiwmTHDUA== ARC-Seal: i=1; s=key1; d=yhetil.org; t=1635910357; a=rsa-sha256; cv=none; b=bvjm/SEGbM2rMRIGFIx6D+AINvvrM9i3IMkQ7v9Btc2F6aYbJ4kqGrbxo+rmNH1AgmNFrs hh+RGGB+llVS4llkojD5vG+0F41RXyZop2RzLHOYvb+NDq3Cmy4vM5UhRBPUmKIuvYVrVm HDIi4lGt84eCzltOTHhX7B3YacT12+m+TZFuBqL3/30BhecEwDyrXof7YqgjpV0HsBKD5P 8apUxnVLfgwnoY8BZdJ3CauWBZf/DCU8G0Z1wMDquK4rZPnWgMcqmuIBg3r079A9aDrhut xfJDagIEMvZcjd8LG86WhUm1xw2SJ6NRZ6VyFcrmhI88ah6boqzfQQUDo/Kr8A== ARC-Authentication-Results: i=1; aspmx1.migadu.com; dkim=pass header.d=gmail.com header.s=20210112 header.b=Cu66XWbN; dmarc=pass (policy=none) header.from=gmail.com; spf=pass (aspmx1.migadu.com: domain of emacs-orgmode-bounces@gnu.org designates 209.51.188.17 as permitted sender) smtp.mailfrom=emacs-orgmode-bounces@gnu.org X-Migadu-Spam-Score: -3.12 Authentication-Results: aspmx1.migadu.com; dkim=pass header.d=gmail.com header.s=20210112 header.b=Cu66XWbN; dmarc=pass (policy=none) header.from=gmail.com; spf=pass (aspmx1.migadu.com: domain of emacs-orgmode-bounces@gnu.org designates 209.51.188.17 as permitted sender) smtp.mailfrom=emacs-orgmode-bounces@gnu.org X-Migadu-Queue-Id: B844D31968 X-Spam-Score: -3.12 X-Migadu-Scanner: scn0.migadu.com X-TUID: tAJObH2sm8OQ Hi all, Here is something I find very confusing. In [1]: #+STARTUP: overview #+STARTUP: content #+STARTUP: showall #+STARTUP: showlevels #+STARTUP: showeverything In org-startup-folded docstring it is said that it takes values equivalent = to: #+STARTUP: fold (or =E2=80=98overview=E2=80=99, this is equ= ivalent) #+STARTUP: nofold (or =E2=80=98showall=E2=80=99, this is equi= valent) #+STARTUP: content #+STARTUP: showlevels ( =3D 2..5) #+STARTUP: showeverything The fact that "overview" is also called "fold" doesn't make what follows simpler, but so far so good. Then there is the function org-overview, which: Switch to overview mode, showing only top-level headlines. But org-overview shows drawers unfolded while "overview" mode folds drawers at startup. That is, if you start in "fold" or "overview" mode (as in #+STARTUP or org-startup-folder) and then cycle visibility all the way back to "overview" (now as in org-overview) you're not at the beginning again. I would say that this is not intentional but an inconsistency in what "overview" means that should be resolved some way or another. For me it makes sense that drawers begin folded in an overview and the docstring of org-overview seems to suggest that. Moreover, while cycling the rest of the "more expanded" visibility states fold drawers. And sometimes properties represent a disproportionate part of the document when compared to folded top-level headlines. For example, I'm thinking of brief org-roam notes showing an awful UUID at the top which is IMO not relevant to an overview. Best regards, Carlos --- [1] https://orgmode.org/manual/Initial-visibility.html