From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: from mp2 ([2001:41d0:2:4a6f::]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 (256/256 bits)) by ms0.migadu.com with LMTPS id gLZFBsL9bmF5fAAAgWs5BA (envelope-from ) for ; Tue, 19 Oct 2021 19:17:54 +0200 Received: from aspmx1.migadu.com ([2001:41d0:2:4a6f::]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 (256/256 bits)) by mp2 with LMTPS id IBnoAcL9bmHmKgAAB5/wlQ (envelope-from ) for ; Tue, 19 Oct 2021 17:17:54 +0000 Received: from lists.gnu.org (lists.gnu.org [209.51.188.17]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by aspmx1.migadu.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 58A9F2BFAA for ; Tue, 19 Oct 2021 19:17:53 +0200 (CEST) Received: from localhost ([::1]:44822 helo=lists1p.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1mcskJ-00070A-HZ for larch@yhetil.org; Tue, 19 Oct 2021 13:17:52 -0400 Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::10]:49612) by lists.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1mcsRy-00081r-DK for emacs-orgmode@gnu.org; Tue, 19 Oct 2021 12:58:54 -0400 Received: from mail-ua1-x931.google.com ([2607:f8b0:4864:20::931]:39556) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_128_GCM_SHA256:128) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1mcsRw-0002w1-Dr for emacs-orgmode@gnu.org; Tue, 19 Oct 2021 12:58:54 -0400 Received: by mail-ua1-x931.google.com with SMTP id f3so1215054uap.6 for ; Tue, 19 Oct 2021 09:58:51 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20210112; h=mime-version:from:date:message-id:subject:to :content-transfer-encoding; bh=3gp3822y6DAzsq+W1KBnHJ3Ins4gnHWrsng+gGT9lAA=; b=aoKmrWPGH3/Z3ldoWzAEmo9Oq4x85rBc96cgkECgoaFwmxbm/PHLEl2yoPXA1WxyOt xEZ5iTP8gMQrRJxF4fzqEGGn1CQhDGQbO9xwzbrGHxORBpInorGkTKljkS1uYEH1lp3J mTcik/tYSWqEhZ8h3+fa8BWIfDE5bQkggZz0zPH0YmZI4F9pYt6QLF/XtDASgBVF7wZ+ 0c+vHyusveh3WqXH1j0ewqHiSasJrs7AOMqjpxiz4Xjd/kXdW60VujVjfXHLvz6Gkf8w 2tGnfi54EpXHlQ1wCLwIOTr842Of8E8McAczAvxdy8UTxVkTdqvZeTa5mKCtHVW/5xhA oKMQ== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20210112; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:from:date:message-id:subject:to :content-transfer-encoding; bh=3gp3822y6DAzsq+W1KBnHJ3Ins4gnHWrsng+gGT9lAA=; b=ahEKh0RFVRwH0TxzYLqZcvUidOYUm2xgKn8I+IP3sOkzSJTGgrH/flHX0R5KQVdhHT Z1sqcDE7PsWv1l2iPmlM/sgqnYl5PDg+K744LtDsRbpNNx4Qhw6kC7CQlDySMqRfKZkN k/FMC3+Ppl95Ep5GkZgfpclZL1QWcMoj5CjJ7R3jotzRlN/jZygB07NsCc2QCidlxHCX dtawLfP60LbkJ59nNP4UTXJhug/diXJGXtcaF9iQ+YSK9i1FgfV4S/O5niwrmpj3ujLu uTMIRXTN6KwBLmtZxZg4JmkjEjdz4JwrhLv/b9CyHLuYHPvXu+rMP3VNe844f9VU8HaS 3ifQ== X-Gm-Message-State: AOAM531hXOzXw/lGQjdkvN3ib68p4419PPHKKm21thPwV5mdNrWynkHg IllO+QQ0NZ7ZTAbb77PYOZ3e5hFUZAD+ErxDzilxabUrnQsvIw== X-Google-Smtp-Source: ABdhPJzZ3xOV+4vvQrb79mdRrCrnBHO1XPU8A+fOg8hai0pJ69Aq+R4e7AvhJVS4o1iiH/Ot9Nnr1KqCp8ZpDbT8PIg= X-Received: by 2002:a67:e147:: with SMTP id o7mr36199325vsl.60.1634662730256; Tue, 19 Oct 2021 09:58:50 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 From: John Hendy Date: Tue, 19 Oct 2021 11:58:39 -0500 Message-ID: Subject: Clarification on org-startup-fold behavior vs. docs To: emacs-orgmode Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Received-SPF: pass client-ip=2607:f8b0:4864:20::931; envelope-from=jw.hendy@gmail.com; helo=mail-ua1-x931.google.com X-Spam_score_int: -20 X-Spam_score: -2.1 X-Spam_bar: -- X-Spam_report: (-2.1 / 5.0 requ) BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_EF=-0.1, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE=-0.0001, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001 autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no X-Spam_action: no action X-BeenThere: emacs-orgmode@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.23 Precedence: list List-Id: "General discussions about Org-mode." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: emacs-orgmode-bounces+larch=yhetil.org@gnu.org Sender: "Emacs-orgmode" X-Migadu-Flow: FLOW_IN ARC-Message-Signature: i=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=yhetil.org; s=key1; t=1634663873; h=from:from:sender:sender:reply-to:subject:subject:date:date: message-id:message-id:to:to:cc:mime-version:mime-version: content-type:content-type: content-transfer-encoding:content-transfer-encoding:list-id:list-help: list-unsubscribe:list-subscribe:list-post:dkim-signature; bh=3gp3822y6DAzsq+W1KBnHJ3Ins4gnHWrsng+gGT9lAA=; b=W8Ny9F0jpjyoUrKwEMdNr0eKIdbR97AWJAocv4NUNV8b8xhV0YvxTsGRdtWWrVxLNCHK3M NJHjqh9SKq3ErNds6H8REf2Wyq+AlhMin9dEoVF6nuXYcf30d+X32wWNScVAKyfKrlNezl RObffCpcr+HVmCeTHDu194cft2bOLTGN2R0yXQMS8Zcp8Ta2fJApVUMXuL2cJ0mWKZS0WA 5VhkHKnIYADQ691rfH3NUvq1B9+MgnJ2ivBhYTE8siqFFr5nPpBDjniBocL8CpH8PaNuhe a40Uezt+CCk5d3Z0G6c1FZ9DHVcKkddA3EaHmwH/sxVn4wcfgJNf4L1iwG4f/A== ARC-Seal: i=1; s=key1; d=yhetil.org; t=1634663873; a=rsa-sha256; cv=none; b=U5O7Vrqa9I/bO5DQLiCQM1O4ki+PPoignckCeNc/9RQ1pPwFcTTVXOL6HMB7E/rhGy0mwr aiw3+8k/g6LAMDEVMFfqmmei6xK96EP+ibdlttZoKyWjKckk7L0eoerguHzWgUe4GlEHPY vnG262DsK4rH87yOJEh6hrrQA6vCIOakcrnAfvQqQ+b86lp9AOz0s4YFbBWaNJZxg/VRDV 1P7SByjlIVXp8Li70QD+uBA9x29UuP1xGsssVI91ZMRj8Rhy5Bswn3muhpuIB0ctgn1b8z 8gHpaLzTXCHvXuc50VmHwA7/Py/TTrbSLYBlmgf4wNQCYWB9iFFZERwdTgOUKw== ARC-Authentication-Results: i=1; aspmx1.migadu.com; dkim=pass header.d=gmail.com header.s=20210112 header.b=aoKmrWPG; dmarc=pass (policy=none) header.from=gmail.com; spf=pass (aspmx1.migadu.com: domain of emacs-orgmode-bounces@gnu.org designates 209.51.188.17 as permitted sender) smtp.mailfrom=emacs-orgmode-bounces@gnu.org X-Migadu-Spam-Score: -3.13 Authentication-Results: aspmx1.migadu.com; dkim=pass header.d=gmail.com header.s=20210112 header.b=aoKmrWPG; dmarc=pass (policy=none) header.from=gmail.com; spf=pass (aspmx1.migadu.com: domain of emacs-orgmode-bounces@gnu.org designates 209.51.188.17 as permitted sender) smtp.mailfrom=emacs-orgmode-bounces@gnu.org X-Migadu-Queue-Id: 58A9F2BFAA X-Spam-Score: -3.13 X-Migadu-Scanner: scn0.migadu.com X-TUID: 5j+DU6kCIU0I Greetings, I was surprised to open a file and find it in a fully expanded state. I took a moment to try and figure out what one should do on a global level. I searched "orgmode startup folded" and got here: https://orgmode.org/manual/Initial-visibility.html This points me to org-startup-folded, which has documentation here: https://orgmode.org/manual/In_002dbuffer-Settings.html #+begin_quote The first set of options deals with the initial visibility of the outline tree. The corresponding variable for global default settings is org-startup-folded with a default value of showeverything. =E2=80=98overview=E2=80=99 Top-level headlines only. =E2=80=98content=E2=80=99 All headlines. =E2=80=98showall=E2=80=99 No folding on any entry. =E2=80=98show2levels=E2=80=99 Headline levels 1-2. =E2=80=98show3levels=E2=80=99 Headline levels 1-3. =E2=80=98show4levels=E2=80=99 Headline levels 1-4. =E2=80=98show5levels=E2=80=99 Headline levels 1-5. =E2=80=98showeverything=E2=80=99 Show even drawer contents. #+end_quote In addition, M-x customize-variable for org-startup-folded says: #+begin_quote org-startup-folded: "overview" State : CHANGED outside Customize. (mismatch) Non-nil means entering Org mode will switch to OVERVIEW. Hide This can also be configured on a per-file basis by adding one of the following lines anywhere in the buffer: #+STARTUP: fold (or =E2=80=98overview=E2=80=99, this is = equivalent) #+STARTUP: nofold (or =E2=80=98showall=E2=80=99, this is e= quivalent) #+STARTUP: content #+STARTUP: showeverything #+end_quote Using the following min-config, I am unable to get a file to open in folded state: #+begin_example (add-to-list 'load-path "~/.elisp/org/lisp/") (add-to-list 'load-path "~/.elisp/org/contrib/lisp/") (setq org-startup-folded "overview") #+end_example #+begin_example * head1 asdf * head2 asdf #+end_example With emacs -Q and M-x load-file path/to/min-config, it opens expanded with either of these: (setq org-startup-folded "fold") (setq org-startup-folded "overview") This does work: (setq org-startup-folded t) Is this the fact that I still don't really understand emacs inner workings/elisp... or am I sane in feeling that the documentation and behavior is not intuitive? Interestingly this reddit thread poses the exact same question, yet one user thinks this is completely expected? That said, he/she both says "non-nil" and therefore `t` works... but not why "overview" or "fold" are also not equivalent to "non-nil"? https://www.reddit.com/r/emacs/comments/izf6xe Thanks for taking a look, John