Karl Voit writes: > * M ‘quintus’ Gülker wrote: >> Am Montag, dem 29. November 2021 schrieb Karl Voit: >>> It seems to be the case that the name "Orgdown" is the reason why >>> the Org-mode community does not support the idea of an >>> implementation-agnostic definition of the syntax. Which is ... kinda >>> funny if you think about it. This does not represent my answer correctly. I explicitly said that org is implementation-defined, so *full* compatibility cannot easily be achieved outside Emacs. That does not prevent partial compatibility. >>> Well if the project is not working out, at least I made my point and >>> we continue to have all those misunderstandings and lack of Orgdown >>> support in 3rd party tools (because Org-mode is way too big). >> >> I think the project has value; better tooling outside of Emacs is >> something org can only profit from in my opinion. One point that has not >> been raised yet are scenarios of collaborative work; I would enjoy it >> quite a bit if I could work on documents together with people who do not >> like Emacs as an editor for whatever reason. Currently, org as a file >> format is pretty much excluded if collaboration is intended with someone >> who does not use Emacs. The natural choice in these cases is Markdown. > > I agree. > > One of the next things I do have on my list is to try out crdt as > I've learned at EmacsConf21 that it is mature enough to be used in > practice. > > If that holds true, we can start dreaming of having a Etherpad-like > session from our GNU/Emacs while peers are connected to the same > session via some web-based tool/service. That would be pretty nice. You might also want to look at orgzly[1], org-js[2], or markup-rocks[3]. [1]: http://www.orgzly.com/help [2]: https://github.com/mooz/org-js [3]: https://markup.rocks/ All of these call org-mode syntax simply "org". > There were two possible generic approaches for me: start from zero > with an open process, involving peers in all choices such as naming, > Orgdown1 syntax elements, ... You can also just take up the already given arguments, form a decision, and then move forward. > Simply switching to a different name is not just search&replace. It > would reset the project almost to its very start again, losing the > go-live effect of previous weekend (whose effect might be > questionable considering the name discussion), its project URL that > is now out there, the motivation video which aims to explain the > motivation to users of Emacs, the EmacsConf21 talk publicity, and it > would require much effort to reach the status where Orgdown is now. Why is that? From the technical side a simple entry in NEWS „Orgdown now uses the name Org Syntax as alias“ and a second domain should suffice. It’s the emotional side that no one but you could solve. > My guess is that most people do not suffer much from different > Markdown flavors because they rarely mix them in their workflows. I > guess most people are using Markdown only in their text editor OR > only in GitHub/GitLab org files OR only within any other > Markdown-tool. Or they just don’t use 90% of markdown features. Titles, quoted, bold, emphasis, links, inline-source, source-blocks. Which is a big difference compared to Org mode. Even with that, source-blocks tend to break between implementations. >> Maybe most documents are very simple files. README files for FLOSS >> projects, forum posts, blog posts. For such content the features where >> the Markdown implementations differ are usually not required. > > This sounds also a plausible explanation and is also boosted by > another posting as an answer to yours. And markdown has inline HTML: Anything missing (like tables) is just exported from org-mode as HTML. > I don't think that users of LaTeX/ConTeXt are part of the target > group. They would actually lose a bit of having control, I think. > And Overleaf might be too hard to beat I guess although I personally > don't like to use cloud-based services but meanwhile that's the > opinion of a tiny minority. Switching from LaTeX to Org-Mode was a very empowering step for me, because it simpified most documents a lot, enabled quick restructuring, allowed for easy tracking of TODO-states and using executed inline-code via babel — and I gained HTML export for free. It’s not the tool for a single paper to one journal that only has to fit one format and is never edited after final submission, but for any larger writing, org-mode is quite a boost in productivity. Best wishes, Arne -- Unpolitisch sein heißt politisch sein, ohne es zu merken. draketo.de