From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: from mp11.migadu.com ([2001:41d0:2:bcc0::]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 (256/256 bits)) by ms5.migadu.com with LMTPS id aPTDIISI32P+RQEAbAwnHQ (envelope-from ) for ; Sun, 05 Feb 2023 11:44:20 +0100 Received: from aspmx1.migadu.com ([2001:41d0:2:bcc0::]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 (256/256 bits)) by mp11.migadu.com with LMTPS id cP7PIISI32OA6wAA9RJhRA (envelope-from ) for ; Sun, 05 Feb 2023 11:44:20 +0100 Received: from lists.gnu.org (lists.gnu.org [209.51.188.17]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by aspmx1.migadu.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 177A013C51 for ; Sun, 5 Feb 2023 11:44:19 +0100 (CET) Received: from localhost ([::1] helo=lists1p.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1pOcUj-0004EZ-NL; Sun, 05 Feb 2023 05:43:37 -0500 Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::10]) by lists.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1pOcUi-0004EM-2b for emacs-orgmode@gnu.org; Sun, 05 Feb 2023 05:43:36 -0500 Received: from mout01.posteo.de ([185.67.36.65]) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1pOcUg-0002gd-3W for emacs-orgmode@gnu.org; Sun, 05 Feb 2023 05:43:35 -0500 Received: from submission (posteo.de [185.67.36.169]) by mout01.posteo.de (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 647C5240119 for ; Sun, 5 Feb 2023 11:43:31 +0100 (CET) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/simple; d=posteo.net; s=2017; t=1675593811; bh=h3uri/QsfaZGTJiZEcAc3D+VoO++WjnCJ3k/G8Ozgss=; h=From:To:Cc:Subject:Date:From; b=JZw0uzyygaEMKqxQ9qKXZY7lCedfty7FzVFVlt4eSXdFI7Nq5ubGkRmfuzWpLym99 LJMKZNBPISK9mpqm1t144pttAo3il522p1qrL4orGm08ILp47FFHVvG//Eg8+st9rt lMpS4mcDoJsDOsItMk0pn5Rtb/sSszjrg4jJ9bsC2pqLElTCtjoqy+xWY8lWCEKdPy +CIhakJMrvH/4T7Rstj0bhvqVQGKIYIWlLsSuvtF7jwheCUDwse5RUlA92HtWfUBUN FP12PYZJWQQfwVjhILsGLRtjs4RbvoiStRC+N1RCDIskbmGjLMc0LdicqGgnAvBf1g TEZNu+0KOoO9A== Received: from customer (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by submission (posteo.de) with ESMTPSA id 4P8mFt3Nxdz9rxH; Sun, 5 Feb 2023 11:43:30 +0100 (CET) From: Ihor Radchenko To: Ypo Cc: Org-mode Subject: Re: [POLL] Proposed syntax for timestamps with time zone info (was: [FEATURE REQUEST] Timezone support in org-mode datestamps and org-agenda) In-Reply-To: References: Date: Sun, 05 Feb 2023 10:44:09 +0000 Message-ID: <87lelce6iu.fsf@localhost> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Received-SPF: pass client-ip=185.67.36.65; envelope-from=yantar92@posteo.net; helo=mout01.posteo.de X-Spam_score_int: -43 X-Spam_score: -4.4 X-Spam_bar: ---- X-Spam_report: (-4.4 / 5.0 requ) BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_EF=-0.1, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-2.3, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001 autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no X-Spam_action: no action X-BeenThere: emacs-orgmode@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: "General discussions about Org-mode." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: emacs-orgmode-bounces+larch=yhetil.org@gnu.org Sender: emacs-orgmode-bounces+larch=yhetil.org@gnu.org X-Migadu-Country: US X-Migadu-Flow: FLOW_IN ARC-Message-Signature: i=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=yhetil.org; s=key1; t=1675593860; h=from:from:sender:sender:reply-to:subject:subject:date:date: message-id:message-id:to:to:cc:cc:mime-version:mime-version: content-type:content-type: content-transfer-encoding:content-transfer-encoding: in-reply-to:in-reply-to:references:references:list-id:list-help: list-unsubscribe:list-subscribe:list-post:dkim-signature; bh=CShEUNqmfkI6+hdMtXVXlCIoOxbpbikYMcwhA+rafBw=; b=jymHJTTb4Jh6Et5R8lLPbcwZwld6KE9Dpwm6o0jR9kVL6+RfWgpS1QXD2ABlJZ/iEvjpzp 08oxllCbNRpG0TnE+V/5oJ49UwwKD2JUFflaGj3VxVEiru0OpuWXgwxtKMYyGyymvwQhFJ f5WRTBWBzBs7RV7DK1U84V8whQhpKXONdiRnTimWhSSxBm50mhWUpgVy8NUWPtKhpQbINS rsqNQNeADLyI5tiKTKvXNXLdRAw1AldHnwIeVqF0i6Flaj8ecW/8AvBTy0b3DDDt++oMFt gD1Lq+wD/5QXRCSKPPo5BC16LOAf9dRrK7YBgYSQlqoNupcCYZlP0ggSll87DA== ARC-Authentication-Results: i=1; aspmx1.migadu.com; dkim=pass header.d=posteo.net header.s=2017 header.b=JZw0uzyy; dmarc=pass (policy=none) header.from=posteo.net; spf=pass (aspmx1.migadu.com: domain of "emacs-orgmode-bounces+larch=yhetil.org@gnu.org" designates 209.51.188.17 as permitted sender) smtp.mailfrom="emacs-orgmode-bounces+larch=yhetil.org@gnu.org" ARC-Seal: i=1; s=key1; d=yhetil.org; t=1675593860; a=rsa-sha256; cv=none; b=kqJgFvTWHCAazRHMo177CjtUp/tegggPItL67O3XSJ6nVueyND/ah0C7iigxDecTlbP8Gu tE+THHxDJEFzxX9LOgaHnF6RTLwPFHuwHq/e1R52WP3V5dXxpI83+jQxxFr+zdb/fyRAOY 7toJupxD5LUulBkhNEfZQTZkj2PnrIdjuIeZA+p1cOWCwJypBaKtPa8rHshHDxa4fJuGza 5guh069x6rnU7dy058r9ia9CtTmpobroRrqwhqD3bQoscUiYPk68wsJEWuO2W9tle0AB05 rONmGNW+7k/yqkNCQEUczx6t9JBbul/Yk1TfdpJbfDB3DPFmtjcZIglzdJ/J5A== X-Migadu-Queue-Id: 177A013C51 X-Migadu-Scanner: scn0.migadu.com Authentication-Results: aspmx1.migadu.com; dkim=pass header.d=posteo.net header.s=2017 header.b=JZw0uzyy; dmarc=pass (policy=none) header.from=posteo.net; spf=pass (aspmx1.migadu.com: domain of "emacs-orgmode-bounces+larch=yhetil.org@gnu.org" designates 209.51.188.17 as permitted sender) smtp.mailfrom="emacs-orgmode-bounces+larch=yhetil.org@gnu.org" X-Migadu-Spam-Score: -7.35 X-Spam-Score: -7.35 X-TUID: 5oGpxn/2gcqh Ypo writes: > 4. For the Poll: What would be the expected behavior if we used the UTC=20 > offset?=C2=A0 [2024-02-04 12:00 @-08,America/Vancouver] > =C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 - We should know beforehand the DST of Vancouver, or = there would be=20 > warnings. It seems more difficult for the user: maybe the "-08," should=20 > be optional? In what I suggested, [2024-02-04 12:00 @-08,America/Vancouver] will use fixed -8 offset [2024-02-04 12:00 @-08] will also use fixed -8 offset [2024-02-04 12:00 @America/Vancouver] will use @America/Vancouver time zone, as it is be defined in you OS time zone database. [2024-02-04 12:00 @-08,!America/Vancouver] (note "!") will use fixed -8 offset, but also calculate America/Vancouver time from TZ database, compare it with the time coming from -8 offset, and warn you if there is inconsistency. > =C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 - Case 3: After updating the tz database we would get= warnings too.=20 > To correct those warnings, should the UTC offset be changed manually in=20 > the timestamp?. If there were 35 meetings in Vancouver throughout the=20 > year, to change all the UTC offsets could be non trivial for a normal=20 > user: UTC of the summer and winter would differ. > =C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 [2024-09-04 12:00 @-07,America/Vancouver]= should be changed to=20 > [2024-09-04 12:00 @-08,America/Vancouver] > =C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 [2024-02-04 12:00 @-08,America/Vancouver]= should be changed to=20 > [2024-02-04 12:00 @-09,America/Vancouver] In what I suggested, you will need to mark "!" in order to get warnings. There will be little point correcting, for example, clock entries - they already represent the correct past time. --=20 Ihor Radchenko // yantar92, Org mode contributor, Learn more about Org mode at . Support Org development at , or support my work at