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[2001:44b8:31f2:bb00:4ac3:1a64:408:689b]) by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id r21sm13606331pfh.128.2021.11.28.14.37.04 for (version=TLS1_3 cipher=TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 bits=256/256); Sun, 28 Nov 2021 14:37:05 -0800 (PST) References: User-agent: mu4e 1.7.5; emacs 28.0.60 From: Tim Cross To: emacs-orgmode@gnu.org Subject: Re: Re-installing org-mode packages due to annoying message Date: Mon, 29 Nov 2021 08:18:04 +1100 In-reply-to: Message-ID: <87a6hn7vqu.fsf@gmail.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain X-Host-Lookup-Failed: Reverse DNS lookup failed for 2607:f8b0:4864:20::1032 (failed) Received-SPF: pass client-ip=2607:f8b0:4864:20::1032; envelope-from=theophilusx@gmail.com; helo=mail-pj1-x1032.google.com X-Spam_score_int: -12 X-Spam_score: -1.3 X-Spam_bar: - X-Spam_report: (-1.3 / 5.0 requ) BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_EF=-0.1, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, PDS_HP_HELO_NORDNS=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE=-0.0001, RDNS_NONE=0.793, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001 autolearn=no autolearn_force=no X-Spam_action: no action X-BeenThere: emacs-orgmode@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: "General discussions about Org-mode." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: emacs-orgmode-bounces+larch=yhetil.org@gnu.org Sender: "Emacs-orgmode" X-Migadu-Flow: FLOW_IN ARC-Message-Signature: i=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=yhetil.org; s=key1; t=1638139086; h=from:from:sender:sender:reply-to:subject:subject:date:date: message-id:message-id:to:to:cc:mime-version:mime-version: content-type:content-type:in-reply-to:in-reply-to: references:references:list-id:list-help:list-unsubscribe: list-subscribe:list-post:dkim-signature; bh=dTxSMlSoG5MbVosd0UcimXmA/obk3Df/BhdZaj61siA=; b=ueS9mPU3baOOKkStwaXqhyAguDLIwLcxPdXIATir91ckZsIqD7OpMM7kHsv1jYfvrCqnye QKFI188rKTJydfE5uKJc9hqx3PTmXqfyeDsU7YabvxqJD1Zj8ryeDCR1CmOoNVcLxIGW2U 5st4No+56Xm1j0reyi6xEPzn0Pz7l/GejKxwlHXdqtjjji2HYlTCjwOMzvliy3C1jlGG1P GZW8o9vKxu7/5SjFePuKuGEYpsHfRDhXZmxtvembjnUpX5BGkS/wVzIeEVK9qIDAPSymn8 phP/5p2MiylwgCNuHNvhl/du53CiPpE80LgXuT3kpUM4mQprsMHTeTcYCvu3cg== ARC-Seal: i=1; s=key1; d=yhetil.org; t=1638139086; a=rsa-sha256; cv=none; b=Pa1MOGX6Mo91jwRsuN6EOCKTtZZTweNDt5xqY+/DMKCbfF4DBwVmO6aMp19QTru6h+6fQF LyA0Wt/4TatIjcw/0hSLPA2z7j+FSGOnNdSpP5FH+TuDTA2x73tpcGNk+wUEkJEt8l86zD 8k+2XFLHg870+wcpun7lLROta9hliTpSi1G975l/sQIRY4cMQ8Anit6D3Jux9H8hNuvqcX SBDvd+YUopMB1Px1/lc9CAP3JNJSm5+Go2mJFDVT9jmhszsY1LzW8VQ9r0GokX9FWaCEY4 r5k6n/FvHkbkgOKTDQWfctvIhMKfs0uPCVimx9t4v1enak3D/cPCaXdehA8cag== ARC-Authentication-Results: i=1; aspmx1.migadu.com; dkim=pass header.d=gmail.com header.s=20210112 header.b="Wgp/9jdU"; dmarc=pass (policy=none) header.from=gmail.com; spf=pass (aspmx1.migadu.com: domain of emacs-orgmode-bounces@gnu.org designates 209.51.188.17 as permitted sender) smtp.mailfrom=emacs-orgmode-bounces@gnu.org X-Migadu-Spam-Score: -4.11 Authentication-Results: aspmx1.migadu.com; dkim=pass header.d=gmail.com header.s=20210112 header.b="Wgp/9jdU"; dmarc=pass (policy=none) header.from=gmail.com; spf=pass (aspmx1.migadu.com: domain of emacs-orgmode-bounces@gnu.org designates 209.51.188.17 as permitted sender) smtp.mailfrom=emacs-orgmode-bounces@gnu.org X-Migadu-Queue-Id: A44652D02F X-Spam-Score: -4.11 X-Migadu-Scanner: scn1.migadu.com X-TUID: 5r7V+dpPRPXI "Alan E. Davis" writes: > I have just spent an hour trying to figure out what's going on with ELPA, GNU ELPA, NONGNU ELPA packages. I am lost. > > A plethora of methods exist for installing org-mode and other packages; it is unnecessary to list them, even if I could. > > I've been using Emacs and Org-mode for many years. I am not interested in spending an hour of my time to learn a new way to install > something that has been working well for me. I may not use org-mode with the facility of a programmer who can whip off a quick utility > in emacs lisp, but I have come to depend on the basic tools as a core of my work flow. > > I have tried "use package", but I would prefer something straightforward, like just list-packages then install. I don't understand how to > set up my init file (dot emacs) for various package repos. It was working, that's all I needed. Now I get a 5 second delay each time I use > org-mode. I cannot seem to find the information I need to fix this. On reddit, on emacs wiki, on this list, I cannot find the magic search > term. I see advice like "the maintainer has written a very clear explanation of the issue" but,this very clear explanation does not help > me understand what I need to do. > > I guess I need a formula, but I have cut and pasted two or three different things into the top of my .init file. Perhaps I need to start > again, but my .init file has been taking root for nearly 30 years; it's burned into my muscle memory. > > I hope I will never have to write another email like this to get help for something that should be simple. Maybe I will now have to install > from git. I think I am already too far out at sea to abandon the packages approach. I guess it serves me right for stepping off the > beach. > Hi Alan, sorry your feeling so frustrated. Unfortunately, in order to be able to maintain org mode with the limited resources available, it has been necessary to make some changes and as with most transitions, there can be some rough bits to get through initially. In the long term, things should actually be simpler with respect to org mode as there will be no need to add any repositories to use org mode or the org contgrib packages as they will be available in the default package.el configuration (Emacs 28 has both GNU ELPA and the new NONGNU repositories defined by default). It is difficult to provide you with any concrete help as you did not include some important information in your message. Things which would help include - What Emacs version are you using? Emacs comes with org built-in, so if your running a reasonably recent version of Emacs, perhaps you don't actually need to install org at all? - Do you use any org mode extensions or add on packages (those which are not part of org mode or the org mode contrib packages)? - Is there a reason you need the latest version of org mode rather than just using the version which comes bundled in Emacs? Many people just stick with the version which is bundled with Emacs as it is stable and requires no additional installation steps. - What is the annoying message you reference in the subject but failed to include in the body of your message? The good news is that while there are many different ways of installing packages, you really don't need any of them except those that come with Emacs. I don't use straight, eget, or any of the many other package management solutions for Emacs. I use just package.el and use-package, which works on top of package.el (it can use straight and other package managers, but your not required to). This gives you exactly what you want - M-x list-packages, from where you can just select the packages you want to install and install them. I would not advise installing from git. This will likely just make things even more complicated as then you also need to make sure your building from the right branch/tag - you don't want to run org from the head of the main branch as this is the development branch, which is likely not as stable as you want. Assuming you are running the current Emacs stable release (Emacs 27.2), the only repository you have to add in your init file is the new nongnu repository. You no longer require the orgmode.org/elpa repository. As the GNU ELPA repository has been standard in Emacs for the last few releases, you don't need to add anything in order to get the current org mode. If you use some of the contrib packages, then you now need to install the nongnu repository. This repository will be configured by default for the next Emacs release (Emacs 28), but for versions prior to that, you need to add https://elpa.nongnu.org/nongnu/ to the package archives list. I have the following in my init.el file (require 'package) (setq package-archives '(("nongnu" . "https://elpa.nongnu.org/nongnu/") ("elpa" . "https://elpa.gnu.org/packages/") ("melpa" . "https://melpa.org/packages/"))) (package-initialize) (unless package-archive-contents (package-refresh-contents)) (unless (package-installed-p 'use-package) (package-install 'use-package)) (require 'use-package) (setq use-package-always-ensure t) In the above, I have added the nongnu repository as well as the melpa repository. You will also note I'm installing the use-package package, which I find useful, but it is not required. The benefit of use package is that to just do a basic package install with no additional configuration, you can run (use-package package-name) and Emacs will ensure the package is installed at startup. Of course, for many of my packages, the use-package form has additional sections for :config, :init, :bindings etc, none of which are necessary for a basic default installation. I add the MELPA repository because there are some packages I use which are not in the main GNU ELPA or NONGNU repositories. As I'm not running Emacs 28, I now only need to add MELPA as GNU ELPA and NONGNU are already configured by default in Emacs 28. With the above configuration, I can install any of the packages I need just by doing M-x list-packages and selecting what I want from the list and then installing them. >From your message, it sounds like you have a bit of code in your init file you have copied from various sources, but which you are not 100% clear about what it does. This is a bad position to be in because when things stop working you don't know where to start to fix them. My advice would be to either start with a clean init.el file and only add back the bits you understand or go through your current init.el file and comment out everything you don't understand and then uncomment bits if and when you need them and only after you understand them. While various forums like stackoverflow, readdit and mailing lists can be valuable, the information they provide can easily be out of date and I find is often just plain wrong. If your maintaining your own init.el file, my rule of thumb is that nothing goes into the init.el file if I don't understand it, regardless of how useful it might seem. The other thing you can try is to just use one of the pre-canned Emacs configuration setups. This is actually what I do these days. After 30 years of Emacs, I actually got tired of tweaking and fiddling with my emacs configuration. I just want to use the editor to get things done. Currently, I use spacemacs, which I really enjoy. I was a vi user for many years and now realise I really like the modal editing model. However, I also used Purcell's emacs.d and prelude, which I think are both good setups. The disadvantage of this approach is that you do then have to work within the confides of how these predefined setups work rather than configure Emacs to follow your own bespoke workflow setup. It is a balancing act and the approach which suits you will depend on where you like to spend your time. For me, I've spent just a little time getting familiar with spacemacs, a little more to work out how to tweak the configuration and now, it all just works. I do also have a very basic standard installation of GNU Linux as a virtual with a bare bones Eamcs setup (not using spacemacs), which I use for testing purposes and sometimes to try and reproduce bugs reported by others. This is another useful tool for testing and experimenting as ti means I don't break my main Emacs setup when I want to try something out. It also provides a convenient way to determine if some problem I'm trying to diagnose is part of the canned setup I'm using (i.e. spacemacs), part of my personal tweaks or a problem with the underlying package. This is where the config for package.el I posted above comes from.